My ex decided it would be best if we swapped our 3 yearold son at her parents place. She said she doesn't feel comfortable at mine and me going there out of nowhere after 3 months of it. I said ok. We have been doing so for the past month. My son has been curious about seeing my work van. So the other day I happened to be working around the ex's home and at the right time (after sons daycare) so I decided to stop by to show him. She freaked out on me for coming there. The next night police came to my door asked a bunch of relationship questions and said I'm not aloud to be in her complex from now on. Can they actually enforce that just because she doesn't want me there for no reason?
Uhg
- Thread starter Johndoe
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First, I think you made a mistake by showing up when you were not expected and outside your normal visitation time. Especially as she told you she was uncomfortable with you now going to her place to pick your son up. I'm not surprised she freaked out.
Can she enforce you not coming? I'm not sure, I'm not a lawyer. But seems to me that sort of thing should be in the agreement. You seem fine with going to the ex-in-laws so don't make a fuss about it if it happens.
Can the police say you can't go into her complex? I don't think so. You imply you're some sort of contractor. What happens if you get a job there? Sorry, I can't because my ex lives in the building? I think that sort of thing would need a court order, not the police saying you can't go there. But do avoid if at all possible.
Can she enforce you not coming? I'm not sure, I'm not a lawyer. But seems to me that sort of thing should be in the agreement. You seem fine with going to the ex-in-laws so don't make a fuss about it if it happens.
Can the police say you can't go into her complex? I don't think so. You imply you're some sort of contractor. What happens if you get a job there? Sorry, I can't because my ex lives in the building? I think that sort of thing would need a court order, not the police saying you can't go there. But do avoid if at all possible.
wretchedotis
New member
'Dropping by' un-announced didn't work out too well for you did it?
Probably should at least call or something first if you're going to do tht again.
I don't believe the police can forbid you from being there, unless you were arrested and have conditions set out as a result. Having said that, probably best to avoid the complex. It WILL be in that cops notes that you were told to stay away - so any further issues will look bad on you - and that COULD lead to an arrest.
You may do yourself well by coming to the conclusion that some ppl are idiots (my ex, for example), and its best just to say "yes dear" to all her nonsense and avoid all the baby mama drama.
Whats important is seeing your kid. Not where you pick him/her up, or how difficult the ex can be on any given day.
Remember that.
Probably should at least call or something first if you're going to do tht again.
I don't believe the police can forbid you from being there, unless you were arrested and have conditions set out as a result. Having said that, probably best to avoid the complex. It WILL be in that cops notes that you were told to stay away - so any further issues will look bad on you - and that COULD lead to an arrest.
You may do yourself well by coming to the conclusion that some ppl are idiots (my ex, for example), and its best just to say "yes dear" to all her nonsense and avoid all the baby mama drama.
Whats important is seeing your kid. Not where you pick him/her up, or how difficult the ex can be on any given day.
Remember that.
If someone (including your ex) states that you are not allowed on their property (including if they rent) they are giving you legal notice of trespass. If you go there again, you can be arrested just for setting foot on the property.
In an extreme emergency if you were called there by your child you could argue against a trespass charge, but yes, you could be charged automatically.
If the ex sees you on the property she can call the police and you can be arrested later even after you've left.
This is something you don't want to play with.
In an extreme emergency if you were called there by your child you could argue against a trespass charge, but yes, you could be charged automatically.
If the ex sees you on the property she can call the police and you can be arrested later even after you've left.
This is something you don't want to play with.
It is true, my intent was harmless. And I now I have no reason to return again, but if one happens to arise in the future then I don't need to feel like I'm going to get in trouble with the law to tend to what ever that reason may be for my son. I just can't believe police can come by and tell me it is now illegal to go near there. I have a very passive personality and never cause problems. So when I feel someone (the police in this case) has lied or treated me unfairly, I guess I can get pretty stubborn and do not let them go till some kind of fairness is restored.
And just a note to some replys: I never went on her rental property. Only entered the townhouse complex and stayed in the parking lot. I also realize showing up somewhere unannounced when one does not want to see someone is wrong, but she knows why I did and it had nothing to do with her. Her over reaction in calling the police is proof of what kind of person she is. If she needed to call anyone it should have been some type of shrink/counselor to sort her wild emotions- the police only escalate the problem. Anyway lol I felt I should add this 2nd paragraph to defend myself. This wasn't why I posted. If she wants to be a nut then so be it. But if the law is going to bring trouble for no good reason then that is a problem.
And just a note to some replys: I never went on her rental property. Only entered the townhouse complex and stayed in the parking lot. I also realize showing up somewhere unannounced when one does not want to see someone is wrong, but she knows why I did and it had nothing to do with her. Her over reaction in calling the police is proof of what kind of person she is. If she needed to call anyone it should have been some type of shrink/counselor to sort her wild emotions- the police only escalate the problem. Anyway lol I felt I should add this 2nd paragraph to defend myself. This wasn't why I posted. If she wants to be a nut then so be it. But if the law is going to bring trouble for no good reason then that is a problem.
standing on the sidelines
New member
yes but if you keep going back there (not that you are) you could get arrested for stalking. You do not have to be in her unit for that.
You say you are passive but when you feel wronged you get stubborn and refuse to let it go until what you deem is fair. That is not a passive person, a passive person just goes with the flow. Sure you are not passive/aggresive?
If she is as bad as you say she is and you know what she is like, it should not have been a surprise the way she reacted. All of a sudden it is so important to show your son your work truck?? You could/should have called her first and let her know that you would like to stop by to show him the truck.
Yes she over-reacted based on what you have said, but we only know your side of the story and your version of the history behind everything.
You say you are passive but when you feel wronged you get stubborn and refuse to let it go until what you deem is fair. That is not a passive person, a passive person just goes with the flow. Sure you are not passive/aggresive?
If she is as bad as you say she is and you know what she is like, it should not have been a surprise the way she reacted. All of a sudden it is so important to show your son your work truck?? You could/should have called her first and let her know that you would like to stop by to show him the truck.
Yes she over-reacted based on what you have said, but we only know your side of the story and your version of the history behind everything.
WorkingDAD
New member
welcome to the real Canada
Police always does it. Thous so called serve and protect guys try to do minimum job with maximum result.
Are you sure you want to spend years to try to restore some kind of fairness? I meant just think what is more important some kind of fairness or your kid? Try to be smart - yeas I know it hard sometime but losses may be huge...
Working dad, that is completely out of line. We in Canada have trespass and stalking laws for a reason, people aren't arrested randomly for wandering around accidently on people's property.
Johndoe is being ridiculous, he did something stupid and is lucky that the consequence is just a warning, but he is hiding behind "I can't believe the police would arrest me for something like that".
You are being worse. You have a knee jerk reaction against the wife. She did nothing wrong. I don't want my ex hanging around my house either. She's not allowed in the house and she has to call before she comes over.
Johndoe is being ridiculous, he did something stupid and is lucky that the consequence is just a warning, but he is hiding behind "I can't believe the police would arrest me for something like that".
You are being worse. You have a knee jerk reaction against the wife. She did nothing wrong. I don't want my ex hanging around my house either. She's not allowed in the house and she has to call before she comes over.
WorkingDAD
New member
Oh common...
Are you kidding me?
when all that bullshit started with me I also being told do not go to apartment despite the fact I have a key and I was on a lease.
and one more time I do not have "You have a knee jerk reaction against the wife" she is not my wife and I do not care about what she think or do unless it related to little one...
But I have reaction to the system when just because someone call police and say do not come police can come and tell you can not go there. IT'S A COURT / JUDGE ONLY AFTER TRAIL CAN ORDER YOU TO NOT GO OR WHATEVER... Isn't it?
I also have a problem with a system that allow someone sitting on welfare to get LegalAID Certificate put bunch a lies on affidavit without even one single prove and almost destroy another persons life without any possibilities to accountability for her action ...
and I can continue but you probably very proud Canadian to believe as I was before I face this horrible discussting mess called "Canadian Family Law" and how men treat in Canada.
WorkingDAD
New member
Mess, I think we talking little bit about different subjects here...
My comment was about how police work first of all. They have no right to tell someone not to go somewhere. They can tell if you will go you can be arrested for such and such but not tell CAN NOT GO THERE.
I saw that way of doing from police every time...
And again may be I did not understand something but poster said that he did not come to the house... for example i was told not even come to apartment building... I mean common base on what?
And just to be clear did you invite me to your house? Well you know that if you invited me it's not trespass) thank you for invitation but I think I will pass but thank you anyway )
May be when Garry teach me to make cinnamon buns I will make some and come but before ....
My comment was about how police work first of all. They have no right to tell someone not to go somewhere. They can tell if you will go you can be arrested for such and such but not tell CAN NOT GO THERE.
I saw that way of doing from police every time...
And again may be I did not understand something but poster said that he did not come to the house... for example i was told not even come to apartment building... I mean common base on what?
And just to be clear did you invite me to your house? Well you know that if you invited me it's not trespass) thank you for invitation but I think I will pass but thank you anyway )
May be when Garry teach me to make cinnamon buns I will make some and come but before ....
This has been gone over time and time again on this board.
You have a right to enter a place IF YOU LIVE THERE. If you live somewhere else, you do not have a right to keep your old residency.
This flows from landlord/tenant law. Just because you own a building or have a lease doesn't mean you can just walk in any time you feel like it if someone else lives there (or works there in a commercial property) and you live elsewhere.
Say you rent an apartment. You go on a trip and sublet it to someone else while you go on vacation for July and August. You come back early, you have a key, you have a lease, you crawl into bed. The woman you subletted to will kick your ass and have you arrested. You can't just walk into a place because you have a key.
If you don't understand that you are a fool. You can't just walk into your old place in on your ex any time you feel like it.
You don't understand that because you don't WANT TO understand that, you just want to whine about the system and the police because you aren't able to just do whatever the hell you want.
I'm frankly not surprised you are in court, what I am surprised about is that you are not in jail.
Under Canadian law (like it or leave) there is something called NOTICE OF TRESPASS. You are told the first time you are trespassing, this is like a first warning. A sign is also sufficient. If you step on the property again, you are automatically committing a criminal act, you don't have have to be told to leave, you can just be arrested on the spot.
The police were absolutely right in telling you that you couldn't go there, you had been told by the resident not to come on the property, if you go back you are trespassing and it is a criminal offence.
Wise up, grow up and stop whining about everything that isn't exactly the way you like it. You live in a society, you live according to the rules we came up with.
You have a right to enter a place IF YOU LIVE THERE. If you live somewhere else, you do not have a right to keep your old residency.
This flows from landlord/tenant law. Just because you own a building or have a lease doesn't mean you can just walk in any time you feel like it if someone else lives there (or works there in a commercial property) and you live elsewhere.
Say you rent an apartment. You go on a trip and sublet it to someone else while you go on vacation for July and August. You come back early, you have a key, you have a lease, you crawl into bed. The woman you subletted to will kick your ass and have you arrested. You can't just walk into a place because you have a key.
If you don't understand that you are a fool. You can't just walk into your old place in on your ex any time you feel like it.
You don't understand that because you don't WANT TO understand that, you just want to whine about the system and the police because you aren't able to just do whatever the hell you want.
I'm frankly not surprised you are in court, what I am surprised about is that you are not in jail.
Under Canadian law (like it or leave) there is something called NOTICE OF TRESPASS. You are told the first time you are trespassing, this is like a first warning. A sign is also sufficient. If you step on the property again, you are automatically committing a criminal act, you don't have have to be told to leave, you can just be arrested on the spot.
The police were absolutely right in telling you that you couldn't go there, you had been told by the resident not to come on the property, if you go back you are trespassing and it is a criminal offence.
Wise up, grow up and stop whining about everything that isn't exactly the way you like it. You live in a society, you live according to the rules we came up with.
WorkingDAD
New member
Eh Mess ... It's a mess
so just to confirm - you saying police can (have legal authority) without court order prevent you from go even to apartment building what is not property of a residence. Right?
and by the way I am not in jail because I did not do anything illegal... Despite about ~15 calls (false accusation) to police I DID NOT DO ANYTHING ILLEGAL...
and in court I am just because I love my son and will not give up on him. Just to be clear.
so just to confirm - you saying police can (have legal authority) without court order prevent you from go even to apartment building what is not property of a residence. Right?
and by the way I am not in jail because I did not do anything illegal... Despite about ~15 calls (false accusation) to police I DID NOT DO ANYTHING ILLEGAL...
and in court I am just because I love my son and will not give up on him. Just to be clear.
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Stop whining. The police did not grab you and stop you going in. They told you that you couldn't go in. They were actually doing you a favour.
I've given you a complete explanation, you should be able to figure it out from here. What, do you need someone to hold your hand and help you with the spelling?
I've given you a complete explanation, you should be able to figure it out from here. What, do you need someone to hold your hand and help you with the spelling?
WorkingDAD
New member
I am not winning
I am not arguing about tresspass law and saying that it's ok to go anywhere in anytime...
what I am saying that police act not legal saying you are not allowed to go there. And it not only about going there ... and it complete different reaction from police when I asked to make her stop doing something - nothing we can do ...
and you keep telling me about tresspass.
In my case. If you are interested. I had to stay on a lease so little one will be ably to stay in better place with his mom. Agreement was I come when I want or need. I had a key so I will not have to call and waik up little one to open door (but I always knock even with a key before enter). sometimes I have to bring some stuff early morning so I come put stuff (diapers, medicine, food etc ) down kiss little one and quietly leave because they sleeping...
Then after I go married next day practically door was closed. So I went downstairs and call police. They said you can not come if you not invited
or (that interesting) SHE IS IN THE APARTMENT as you moved out more than 6 month ago... And the fact that I am in that appartment EVERYDAY at least once and still tenant and fully responsible for apartment does not matter.
So I left. AND I REPEAT I LEFT !!! I DID NOT THINK THAT WAS RIGHT BUT I LEFT TO FIND OUT. Went to landlord next day - landlord: what a hell you are tenant ...
So.. What to do? Landlord or Police? Ok police can arrest you landlord not... Next evening I went to talk with superintendent to explain what is going on and if something regarding apartment what can screw my record what was perfect btw, call me right away...
While I was talking with super downstairs my ex came out from elevator with her brother taking away some stuff (including mine).
Later this evening police came again saying here complain that you come etc... - I explain they said ok. So just to cut any possible new bullshit from other side I offered police a key. I DID OFFER POLICE A KEY. they took it and give it to supper.
what we reading in affidavit attached to court application: Police took key from Respondent but I still do not believe he will not come so "I want restraint order against me and MY son..." and police report from that day said "respondent offer a key"
As for spelling: yes I still have a lot of spelling errors especially when I have some emotions related to what I write... How many languages you speak (read and write on) Mess? More than 3?
I am not arguing about tresspass law and saying that it's ok to go anywhere in anytime...
what I am saying that police act not legal saying you are not allowed to go there. And it not only about going there ... and it complete different reaction from police when I asked to make her stop doing something - nothing we can do ...
and you keep telling me about tresspass.
In my case. If you are interested. I had to stay on a lease so little one will be ably to stay in better place with his mom. Agreement was I come when I want or need. I had a key so I will not have to call and waik up little one to open door (but I always knock even with a key before enter). sometimes I have to bring some stuff early morning so I come put stuff (diapers, medicine, food etc ) down kiss little one and quietly leave because they sleeping...
Then after I go married next day practically door was closed. So I went downstairs and call police. They said you can not come if you not invited
or (that interesting) SHE IS IN THE APARTMENT as you moved out more than 6 month ago... And the fact that I am in that appartment EVERYDAY at least once and still tenant and fully responsible for apartment does not matter.
So I left. AND I REPEAT I LEFT !!! I DID NOT THINK THAT WAS RIGHT BUT I LEFT TO FIND OUT. Went to landlord next day - landlord: what a hell you are tenant ...
So.. What to do? Landlord or Police? Ok police can arrest you landlord not... Next evening I went to talk with superintendent to explain what is going on and if something regarding apartment what can screw my record what was perfect btw, call me right away...
While I was talking with super downstairs my ex came out from elevator with her brother taking away some stuff (including mine).
Later this evening police came again saying here complain that you come etc... - I explain they said ok. So just to cut any possible new bullshit from other side I offered police a key. I DID OFFER POLICE A KEY. they took it and give it to supper.
what we reading in affidavit attached to court application: Police took key from Respondent but I still do not believe he will not come so "I want restraint order against me and MY son..." and police report from that day said "respondent offer a key"
As for spelling: yes I still have a lot of spelling errors especially when I have some emotions related to what I write... How many languages you speak (read and write on) Mess? More than 3?
Just curious WorkingDad. What ever came of it. I mean did she get a restraining order on you because of that?
I guess a question could be about the original post, as I am not sure legally to be honest. If she lives in an apartment or townhouse complex what constitutes as his ex's property. In an apartment would it be from the door to her apartment or would it mean the Building. In a townhouse would it be her direct front lawn if any, and her back lawn if any? Or again the whole complex. If your parked on the road and on public property and your kid comes to you can that be considered trespassing if you are not actually on "her" property or the area she is renting?
I ask this as I was told by a lawyer when my ex was showing up in the mornings when I was bringing our daughter to school in the morning (Access was Friday after school until Tuesday when I brought her to school). So my ex was showing up at times that was not her access, and it was not like we bumped into each other at a mall or something like that. She was totally allowed to show up and hang out with us during my access(would love to see what would happen if I did the same during hers lol, probably be in jail).
Really, the cop was probably trying to keep the peace, she did not want him out front but it made sense in the situation, while maybe not totally legal to tell him to not come there again, he may have been trying to keep peace between him and his ex. If she felt that she did not want him around then maybe the cop was worried what would happen to him if he showed up again.
If you have a crazy ex then why pop in unannounced? I get the fact that you want to see your kid, I want to see mine as well but I know that it would cause a scene that would be worse for our daughter if I just showed up.
I guess a question could be about the original post, as I am not sure legally to be honest. If she lives in an apartment or townhouse complex what constitutes as his ex's property. In an apartment would it be from the door to her apartment or would it mean the Building. In a townhouse would it be her direct front lawn if any, and her back lawn if any? Or again the whole complex. If your parked on the road and on public property and your kid comes to you can that be considered trespassing if you are not actually on "her" property or the area she is renting?
I ask this as I was told by a lawyer when my ex was showing up in the mornings when I was bringing our daughter to school in the morning (Access was Friday after school until Tuesday when I brought her to school). So my ex was showing up at times that was not her access, and it was not like we bumped into each other at a mall or something like that. She was totally allowed to show up and hang out with us during my access(would love to see what would happen if I did the same during hers lol, probably be in jail).
Really, the cop was probably trying to keep the peace, she did not want him out front but it made sense in the situation, while maybe not totally legal to tell him to not come there again, he may have been trying to keep peace between him and his ex. If she felt that she did not want him around then maybe the cop was worried what would happen to him if he showed up again.
If you have a crazy ex then why pop in unannounced? I get the fact that you want to see your kid, I want to see mine as well but I know that it would cause a scene that would be worse for our daughter if I just showed up.
WorkingDAD
New member
Nope. It's funny but they still kind of put it as issue in a trial and just after trial started signed temporary agreement with exchange at her new place downstairs. It better for little one than other place what I and he tired of but I have to be always with camera and voice recorder )
that exactly what I am trying to tell. They just try to keep peace. So they tell you do not go you do not communicate at all. What??????? What about my kid? well you have to go to lawyer ... Why they do not tell her it illegal to keep child from father? Why they do not tell her that before you have court order father has all rights to see a kid .... and so on ....
Well may she has to go to lawyer so I will not see my kid? why I have to go to lawyer to fight for what my kid and I has a right by law... Bla bla - you do not go and communicate ... Isn't it just to make less work with most result for cops?
What I agree with Mess that for trespassing cops will act very quickly and straight. But when you come to police station saying there is court order that I have to have kid and he gone - nothing they will do ... Well this court order is just please of paper and you have to go to court again if you want to be enforced... well probably 3-5 times ...
Isn't just brilliant?
oh I finally in court house after two month not seeing my kid. First question Why I am here? I did not do anything. There is not even one smallest prove from other side. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED WITH INNOCENT BEFORE PROVEN GUILTY? Weeeeeeeeeeeel lawyer said you are right but that HOW IT WORK IN THAT BUILDING.... Can you freaking believable it? so that building problem - huh what a relief lets move to another building than ...
Well if you want to see you kid you have to agree for supervised access. WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT? I have to be supervised with my own kid? Do you now how humiliating this ? do you know how hard I have to bend over just to accept this idea "to agree for supervised access when I did not do anything wrong to him". Can you imagine what will person who did not bend under communists machine in a school for 10 years (than it fall apart otherwise I would be in Siberia I think) felt in that moment... but I did agree for him.. I was very afraid that he is very little and just one more month and he will forget me .... I was afraid that he already forgot me for thous too month ...
but he did not not thanks God and to him. He was smiling and did not let me go for a sec for that hour and half we had ....
Oh Mess will write that I am winning and do not like Canadian rules... How could I not like it ? I just bad bad guy ...
And yes a lot of spelling errors probably ...
PS:
I think I wrote it somewhere but I will repeat.
When I was about 13-14 and climbing from 3rd floor to ground using balconies having only underwear on me to run away from step-father who again had some drink (all night) and decided to give me life lesson and ... (I throw pants before because I did not have time to put it in) I give my self two promises:
1. Never ever even try a drop of alcohol as I do not be like that
2. Never ever leave my kid...
so I am 35
1. - keep 100%. I did not try even once any alcohol.
2. - still keeping. and looks like it only over my dead body I will give up this one. Yes I know that I could destroy my life (or what is left of it) but I also know that I will not be able to live in peace with myself if I give up him...
those promises given 20 years ago somehow became very strong...
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wretchedotis
New member
I can appreciate this. I feel like doing the same. But is it really that good of an idea?
My ex's new husband has had me charged with criminl offence. He has told my son that i do not"love" him, and I don't "want" him. This man has forbidden any access exchanges from occuring at his and the boys' Moms place of residence. My boy fully understands the man does not like me - and I can see it hurts him to know it.
Obviously, I am not a huge fan of the man myself. I would love to stuff him in a crate and mail it to Zimbabwe. But I still invite him into the house when he happens to show up at the door. I talk plainly and civily to him.
He, and ALL of the boys extended family will ALWAYS be welcome at my home.
Lots of women walk into a courtroom and tell a judge they are "threatened" by their husband and get a restraining order without the other person even knowing until it is served on him. The evidence required is flimsy but the infringment on the rights of the husband (usually) is huge. There should be an objective threat not a subjective threat. What if this dad owned the property jointly? Then it is his place too and can he be told not to come there? Grrr.
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