SS with good income

The subject of your post is like a red flag in front of a bull for many of us paying piles of SS.

... but no harm done. :)

Before you deal with the amount of any SSAG, you have to look at whether you have any entitlement to it. I believe (it's been a while) that the SSAG discusses this quite a bit. In your case, there are likely no hard and fast rules so it basically comes down to whether you sacrificed your career for the family or if you have a need.

Since you're making $100K, you don't have a need.

As far as having sacrificed, you mentioned that you took a year off (per child?) and didn't get a promotion. Sure, there is a sacrifice but it doesn't look very clear cut to me. Others (military spouses, foreign affairs spouses) have moved every few years for decades and completely gave up any hope of a career.

It sounds like you're still in pain, shock and grieving over the whole situation. As long as you can keep things stable and loving for the kids, you probably don't have to rush through things. If you can, take your time, talk to friends & family, get some counselling, join some "newly divorced" groups. Take care of yourself and it will help both you and your children more than anything else. Children are very resilient but will take cues from you and your STBX.

It's a dark time but gets better with time. Good luck and best wishes.
 
sorry to hear about your situation. it's not easy but your kids will get through this just fine. They're extremely resilient and adapt to new realities - often easier than their parents. I would second the advice that don't steadfastly hold on to the idea that the house needs to stay the same...moving to a new place can be great for kids and a destresser financially.

good luck
 
Nothing creates more long term animosity (possibly to the extreme) in a divorce than alimony, especially in a case like yours. What you do is up to you of course, but be aware of that...
 
I know I begrudge every cent that I have to pay to another grown-up adult.

Money for the kids, no problem, but sports car and travel money.....total BS.
 
piggybanktoex said:
I know I begrudge every cent that I have to pay to another grown-up adult.

Money for the kids, no problem, but sports car and travel money.....total BS.
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Same. SS and CS was done and gone for my husband. But then for awhile we paid cell phone bill (on our plan) for his youngest daughter (22) when she couldn't. When she started working full time, he asked her to start paying her share of the bill again. She said she couldn't because she was helping her Mom. That just made him fell like he was paying SS again. He told D22 to go get her own cell phone plan.
 
The children have not been told yet. I wanted to try and have some solutions for them before they were told. It is getting worse every day for us and I hope we can work things out before getting lawyers all over it.

If I am not entitled to SS that is fine. I just wanted to be aware of my options potentially. STBX has already started to talk about the new car he is going to be buying! He has wanted a sports car for years so I expect he will be getting one when this is done. My priority will be my kids and their future and our current state.

I will take note of things like activities, benefits and such. I know those can change with something like a job loss which can always happen which is a worry.

Thank you for the advice and words of comfort in regards to kids and how they deal. I have had many sleepless nights worried about the situation and the fact I can't prevent it even though in a heartbeat I would try to fix it if I was given the option. I would give up any happiness I might have to ensure my kids and husband were happy. I live (and have lived) for my family and would never wish any of this upon anyone. It is a nightmare I can't get out of and am trying to make it through each day.
 
Any good family law lawyer should willing to talk with you for 20-30 minutes for free to give you an idea of what you may be entitled to. They've seen hundreds of cases and should have a good idea how things would likely turn out if you ended up in court. If you can, speak to 2 or 3 to find one who you get along with, feel comfortable with, and has a compatible approach to you. No need to get them to do anything at this stage.

If you have an idea of what you are legally able to get you can then decide what is best for you, whether it is worth fighting for, and to start to pick up the pieces and move on to a better future.
 
And let's not get caught up in the sports car thing.......Dads worry about bills, kids, school, and everything else a woman thinks about too.

Actually it was my ex who bought the sports car while adding NOTHING to the financials needed for the kids.

I alone provided all the $$ needed for the kids activities, schooling, and dental, oh, and support payments.
 
I don't think it's worth it. All the other posters here are flipping out like alimony doesn't happen.

100 - 150k + offset child support, ur incomes will be similar. It will be harder as you are 1 income not 2 but unless you're a woman and generally women marry up and can expect men to pay towards their expenses. Current social structures generally (especially if you're good looking),

As for the whole divorce, you might have not watned the divorce but you need to embrace it. You get to be single 50% of the time, go sleep around the weeks you don't have the kids, go on some adventures....
 
DivorceSucksCanada said:
The children have not been told yet. I wanted to try and have some solutions for them before they were told. It is getting worse every day for us and I hope we can work things out before getting lawyers all over it.

If I am not entitled to SS that is fine. I just wanted to be aware of my options potentially. STBX has already started to talk about the new car he is going to be buying! He has wanted a sports car for years so I expect he will be getting one when this is done. My priority will be my kids and their future and our current state.

I will take note of things like activities, benefits and such. I know those can change with something like a job loss which can always happen which is a worry.

Thank you for the advice and words of comfort in regards to kids and how they deal. I have had many sleepless nights worried about the situation and the fact I can't prevent it even though in a heartbeat I would try to fix it if I was given the option. I would give up any happiness I might have to ensure my kids and husband were happy. I live (and have lived) for my family and would never wish any of this upon anyone. It is a nightmare I can't get out of and am trying to make it through each day.
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I know it looks bad right now but believe me, divorce can be a blessing. There's no doubt that getting through the process is tough though.

Is there any chance that you might be able to reduce expenses by just moving into a smaller house in the same area? I did that and it did help to keep the youngest in the same school and around the same friends.

My advice...go step by step. Figure out the easiest way to split assets with the least involvement of lawyers. For instance, I've known people that have spent 40-50k to get 10k a year in termed SS. Sometimes its just easier to save your assets and make a reasonable settlement deal with your stbx.

And take care of you...vent to friends, get lots of sleep, take walks, start planning your new life and think about what you might be gaining rather than what you might be losing. Best wishes.
 
Pursuinghappiness said:
I know it looks bad right now but believe me, divorce can be a blessing. There's no doubt that getting through the process is tough though.

Is there any chance that you might be able to reduce expenses by just moving into a smaller house in the same area? I did that and it did help to keep the youngest in the same school and around the same friends.

My advice...go step by step. Figure out the easiest way to split assets with the least involvement of lawyers. For instance, I've known people that have spent 40-50k to get 10k a year in termed SS. Sometimes its just easier to save your assets and make a reasonable settlement deal with your stbx.

And take care of you...vent to friends, get lots of sleep, take walks, start planning your new life and think about what you might be gaining rather than what you might be losing. Best wishes.
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Thank you for the advice. I am trying to work through all this and determine the best option. I waver between trying to keep the house versus moving. I worry all the time. And just am not sure what to do in general. And know that if I keep it, there is an option to sell down the road and then hopefully be in a better mental position to handle a change. There is so much to figure out right now - house value (one that can be agreed upon), all our financials, contents of the house, how we schedule the kids (50/50 but what days), how we work together on this, what do we do for child care as we will now need it, etc.

Is there anywhere anyone recommends to get info on all the things to cover when we start conversations? In the hopes to have as much agreed upon before getting lawyers involved?
 
Separating and dividing up assets and liabilities is a big job.

You have to start somewhere and both agree on the basics (value of assets for example). Get the home appraised. Gather up all bank statements, bills and make a list of everything. Lawyers will require this anyhow and the two of you can save a lot of money if you can get through the financials without choking each other/playing the blame game.

Both of you to prepare financial statements. This would include business financial statements should one of you own a business.

So you will come up with a few lists: 1. We have 2. We owe 3. We agree to sell.

Of course it can get more complicated. The more complicated things are the more money the lawyers make off of you.

I'd highly recommend that you seek advice from financial expert prior to you signing any legal document as you need to know the tax implications and often lawyers don't have a clue, nor do they care, about this.

Tip: If you need to itemize the household contents simply go online to a moving company and they usually have lists you could utilize. Keep in mind that most people over-value content value. Be generous... until you want to puke. This will keep lawyers at bay and money in your pocket.
 
DivorceSucksCanada said:
house value (one that can be agreed upon)
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You don't really have to agree. But, you do have to spend money if you can't agree on a value. You each hire your own property assessor who does a report of what the home's value is on the date of separation. These are not real estate agents. General cost is between 700-1200 for one to be done. Generally, the two come within 2-3% of each other's estimates. Generally, you split the difference on the 2-3%.

Your lawyer will have a professional they use all the time. Just hire them to determine the value of the home.

DivorceSucksCanada said:
all our financials
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Generally easy to do if you are not in the 2+ million dollar club. 50-50 split.

DivorceSucksCanada said:
contents of the house
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Generally, they are worth 0$ and minimally what they are worth on Kijiji. "Why are you here?!!! You can get a washer and dryer on Kijiji for 150$." -- The Honourable Madame Justice Mossip in a courthouse in Peel to a parent.

DivorceSucksCanada said:
how we schedule the kids (50/50 but what days)
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2-2-5-5 access schedule is the best: http://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/f4/2-2-5-5-50-50-residential-schedule-explained-13702/

DivorceSucksCanada said:
how we work together on this, what do we do for child care as we will now need it, etc.
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Before and afterschool program when school is on. "Camps" when school is out. If you can't agree then figure it out for yourself and the other person for themselves. But, generally it isn't that hard...

DivorceSucksCanada said:
Is there anywhere anyone recommends to get info on all the things to cover when we start conversations? In the hopes to have as much agreed upon before getting lawyers involved?
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Read this book: https://www.amazon.ca/Tug-War-Judge`s-Separation-Realities/dp/1550228706

Good Luck!
Tayken
 
I’m currently trying to figure out what/whether there should be any SS paid from me to STBX. Initial planning of asset division CS and kids’ schedule (50/50, though there’s a common sentiment amongst friends and family that she will want less once she spends some time on her own with them. I choose not to believe that) has been very amicable.
But she still wants more. Because we have 3 kids the CS is already significant and I read SSAG that when CS is already being paid, SS should be calculated such that recipient finishes with 40-46 of net income of payor. As is, she’ll be at 43% of my net income so I feel that’s a case to say that SS is not warranted. Anybody else have background on such a stance?
She is legitimately nervous about future and money can provide security so I intend to offer some SS but only as a single lump sum.
 
Futureisbright said:
the CS is already significant and I read SSAG that when CS is already being paid, SS should be calculated such that recipient finishes with 40-46 of net income of payor. As is, she’ll be at 43% of my net income so I feel that’s a case to say that SS is not warranted.
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Is this 40-46 of net income where the Percentage of NDI number comes from in DivorceMate? Trying to understand this for myself in general. And does it depend on a case by case basis in general? I did some reading in the SSAG document and sometimes they try to make the NDI to 50/50. I truly don't get how they determine this and if it is like throwing a dart at a dartboard sometimes?
 
The 40-46% of Adjusted Net Income is for section 8.3 of SSAG as at

*http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/fl-lf/spousal-epoux/spag/pdf/SSAG_eng.pdf

I calculated my net income (after taxes and paying CS and receiving CCB) and her net income (after taxes and receiving CS and CCB).

Then I add those together and she is at 43% of the combined total. Is that fair or do need to get her to 50% if she shows entitlement- it’s a crapshoot as to whether she’d pass the entitlement test. Not to be discussed here, I prefer to stick to the math.
 
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