In a shared custody situation where I pay the set-off amount (we agreed to a little less than the table amounts actually) because my salary is higher. Our separation agreement states that Special expenses would be shared in proportion to our income which I'm fine with but what about ordinary expenses (particulary extracurricular activities)? I understand from a friend who receives CS that she pays for all clothes (at both houses) and ordinary activitiy fees out of the CS. He doesn't pay anything for these things since he pays CS. I have a hard time getting even a pro rata share of ordinary activity fees even though I pay the CS. Usually she just says to everything that she can't afford it even though these programs are ones that the kids were doing before we split and were definitely within the means of the family before the split. I'd be happy with her just splitting the cost of these programs.
Shared custody...what should CS cover?
- Thread starter cfs25
- Start date
In shared custody/setoff, you are both equally responsible for ordinary expenses. It would be wrong for one parent to be buying all of the clothes. Each parent should buy roughly half of the clothes.
As far as school fees, if you mean the $10-20 for a class trip or activity, then the parents should split this roughly equally by taking turns, however keep in mind that a parent would be responsible for costs that incur during their time. If there is a class trip during your week with the child, it is reasonable for you to pay. The other parent will pay for expenses during their time; this should even out over time.
Minor medical and dental expenses, under $100, or a deductible from insurance under $100 are not section 7 expenses, and should be paid by the parent who is with the child when the expense is incurred.
There is no clear definition for minor vs. special expenses for activities and sports. This will vary from family to family, and depends a lot on total income. My rule of thumb is to use the $100 amount that is stated for medical expenses as a guideline for this. If swimming lessons are <$100 per month, then I wouldn't call them extraordinary. They should be paid by the parent who is with the child when the lessons take place. If both parents take the child to lessons alternately, it should be split. Of course it would be good sense for the parents to split such expenses in any case, you won't get a court order to split $80 a month.
As far as school fees, if you mean the $10-20 for a class trip or activity, then the parents should split this roughly equally by taking turns, however keep in mind that a parent would be responsible for costs that incur during their time. If there is a class trip during your week with the child, it is reasonable for you to pay. The other parent will pay for expenses during their time; this should even out over time.
Minor medical and dental expenses, under $100, or a deductible from insurance under $100 are not section 7 expenses, and should be paid by the parent who is with the child when the expense is incurred.
There is no clear definition for minor vs. special expenses for activities and sports. This will vary from family to family, and depends a lot on total income. My rule of thumb is to use the $100 amount that is stated for medical expenses as a guideline for this. If swimming lessons are <$100 per month, then I wouldn't call them extraordinary. They should be paid by the parent who is with the child when the lessons take place. If both parents take the child to lessons alternately, it should be split. Of course it would be good sense for the parents to split such expenses in any case, you won't get a court order to split $80 a month.
FightingForFamily
Member
If the 30 times take place over 30 months then the person receives table CS 30 times to cover the cost 30 times.
OrleansLawyer
Active member
To add some clarity:
This refers to expenses under $100 annually, not total. So if the child needs medication that costs $15/month, that is an extra-ordinary expense.
Source - CanLII - Federal Child Support Guidelines, SOR/97-175 at s.7(1)(c)
iceberg
New member
In the 1st 3 years post separation I spent over $1000 for medical/dental. Ex spent $0
I hear you...but playing DA (Devil's Advo) for a sec, pretend you ex is not in the picture (I know she is but), we are talking about your kid(s) here, and if you are in a position to spend on them, that should trump any drama the other party is engaging in.
Like I said before, I work and live for my child and that is never going to change.
expenses split
expenses split
I my situation, we make an 'account at the end of the month'. I insisted on that in the agreement. The problem is that 'small' expenses add up to a lot. Especially when one parent, although it is a 50/50 splits, ends up doing all the dental, haircut, school supplies, clothing and so on because the other parents does not want to be bothered. All these 'little' expenses can add up to 100's at the end of the month, for several kids. And without the monthly account, the parent who is more 'in charge' than the other would end up stuck with the bills.
When the expense is a little bigger, say shoes or a schoolbag, we check with the other before buying.
Sometimes, parents may avoid an expense, so that the other parent gets stuck with it next week. The 'wait till you are out your dad's next week' type of thing. This frustrates the kids. With the account, there is no reason to have this happen.
Finally, note that the offset C/S is to offset the difference between the income. Not for one parent to pay more of the kids expenses. It is not for one parent to pay more than the other. For example, if the offset is say $25 a month, it would be very unfair that the receiving parent gets stuck with paying all the air cuts, dental, clothing and so on out of these $25!
expenses split
I my situation, we make an 'account at the end of the month'. I insisted on that in the agreement. The problem is that 'small' expenses add up to a lot. Especially when one parent, although it is a 50/50 splits, ends up doing all the dental, haircut, school supplies, clothing and so on because the other parents does not want to be bothered. All these 'little' expenses can add up to 100's at the end of the month, for several kids. And without the monthly account, the parent who is more 'in charge' than the other would end up stuck with the bills.
When the expense is a little bigger, say shoes or a schoolbag, we check with the other before buying.
Sometimes, parents may avoid an expense, so that the other parent gets stuck with it next week. The 'wait till you are out your dad's next week' type of thing. This frustrates the kids. With the account, there is no reason to have this happen.
Finally, note that the offset C/S is to offset the difference between the income. Not for one parent to pay more of the kids expenses. It is not for one parent to pay more than the other. For example, if the offset is say $25 a month, it would be very unfair that the receiving parent gets stuck with paying all the air cuts, dental, clothing and so on out of these $25!
Ok, to just add on to this. How long does one parent have to submit the receipt for s7 expenses, My example is my son needed glasses last year. She says that my share is roughly $200.00. I told her OK, but they need to go thru her insurance first,(her birthday is before mine). Then give me the remainder receipt from that payment and I will submit it to my insurance for the rest. She just says pay her cash and I refused until the receipt is shown. Now my insurance will only honor a receipt for up to a year from payment and in 2 months that will be a year. So can she then give me the receipt after the year is up and I can't go thru my insurance any longer..... And Yes she plays these games. Our agreement just says you have 3 weeks to pay once receipt is given nothing about a timeline for the receipt to be handed over.
Thanks Mess.
So if I have 2 kids and they each do:
hockey $350 /year + some equipment (say $150 more)
soccer $125 / year + some gear (say $50 more)
swimming - say $250/year and they were doing most of these things before we split (i.e these were all within the means of the family before the split), then the total per year per child is about $1000 or $85/month.
Since this is less than $100/month/child would you say that we would split these costs and any activity much more than the ones above for one of the kids would be S7 and split in proportion to our incomes (if she agreed the cost was doable for the extra activity?). Thanks
I would say that this is the way I would work it out with my ex.
I would also say that the ex should be paying for half. If it were a higher amount, then I would say it should be split as a section 7, and be done proportionate to income.
I would say that both parents should have input into the decision over activities.
I would not say that one parent should ordinarily pay all of the expense, unless it worked out that the activity was always on the one parent's time.
I would also say that the ex should be paying for half. If it were a higher amount, then I would say it should be split as a section 7, and be done proportionate to income.
I would say that both parents should have input into the decision over activities.
I would not say that one parent should ordinarily pay all of the expense, unless it worked out that the activity was always on the one parent's time.
It is unfortunate that the guidelines are so vauge. My ex believes that any cost to the child is split proportionally. So for a $50 soccer registration I pay $33 and she pays $17.
The only expense that I can think would be split proportional would be daycare, school (collage, univ) or some major medical expenses.
But it is difficult explaining to the ex that costs should be split 50/50 when the guidelines are not clear themselves.
OrleansLawyer
Active member
Costs are either extra-ordinary, in which case they are split proportional to income, or they are not extra-ordinary, in which case the parent incurring the cost covers it in its entirety.
Whether something is extra-ordinary or not depends upon the family; incomes involved, reasonable expectations of the child, what the expense is for, etc.
Perhaps your ex and my stbx attended the same school of thought? Mine took the "proportional to income" ratios and tried to apply it to every single monthly bill i.e mortgage, car loan, utilities, LOC et al
So if your only worry is the $50 for your child's soccer, you have it good considering it's for the direct benefit of the kid....Heck I'll even pay it in full just because my child means a lot to me personal, than some unreasonable person that can't put BIC first.
Funny how when it comes to splitting any equity in the home, they don't reason the same way eh i.e "proportional to income"? Let me guess....that is different will be the answer
Everytime an expense is made for the child, only one parent incurrs the cost beacuse that is the parent paying at that time.
But the child has two parents and they both take and attend with the child rotating between parents.
In the situation I detailed earlier, my ex expects me to ask her permission before registration each year for the hockey and soccer they have been doing since before we split up and then agrees, but last few years has just said I agree but I can't afford to pay. She expects that if she does agree to contribute that it would only be a proportional contribution which is another thing. Most of the time I have to pay everything because she continues to say she can't afford to contribute. Our separation agreement listed these activities as ones both kids were doing and indicates who will take them to these activities (since most of the time she won't take them) but it does not spell out anything about how we will split expenses like these. It only lists how we will split S7 expenses.
OrleansLawyer
Active member
If you are splitting them they are likely to be viewed as s.7 expenses.
Otherwise, if it is purely a contractual obligation (not based on the FCSG) then "split" would seem to indicate "equally".
I believe the guidelines say that extraordinary expenses are those which exceed expenses that someone receiving the spouse's guidelines income plus child support could reasonably be expected to pay with just those resources. I realize this is vague, but it does indicate that what might be considered an "extraordinary expense" varies by income level - someone who earns $40K per year plus receiving $10K in CS might argue that spending $2K on extracurriculars per year is "extraordinay", because on his/her own s/he would not be able to pay it, whereas someone who earns $150K per year and receives no child support would have more difficulty making that claim, because his/her resources are greater. In general, it seems that the higher your indvidual income is and/or the more closely your income approximates that of the other parent, the fewer expenses you should claim as S7.