Shared Custody support payments

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HappyMomma

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Hi. I'm SURE this question has been answered somewhere already but I'm unable to find it.

How are support payments calculated if parents share custody? My lawyer indicated that it's all over the place - some judges use the guidelines, others do not. Is this true?

My lawyer also indicated that because there are no clear guidelines for support in shared custody situations that the courts may take into account the fact that I support a third child (not his) as well.

And clarification would be appreciated.

Thanks!
 
Hi CSAngel. I am still in the middle of this so I can't tell you my end result, only what I've been advised so far. However I will tell you that both my lawyer and my STBX's lawyer at least agree on this principal. I also had the same advice from an earlier lawyer I had a half hour consultation with. But keep in mind this isn't settled and I can't remark on how it would play out in court...

Where the access is roughly equal, that is, somewhere between 40% and 60%, each parent will pay the other the amount from the Federal Tables according to income. So if I would pay $200 per month and my ex would pay $1000 per month then the net difference is $800 and that is what my ex should pay.

The amount can vary due to undue hardship if the amount would put the paying household below the standard of living of the receiving household. This has to be proven, not just claimed.

Both of us are required to contribute to section 7 expenses (daycare, tuition) proportionate to income. My ex makes 4X my income, the split is 20/80.

My understanding from my lawyer is that the courts are absolutely required to use the Guidelines, but if my ex and me work something out together that is agreeable, or through mediation, we don't have to stick to the Guidelines. I have been told that for the courst the Guidelines are not really guidelines, they are mandatory.

However again, we haven't played this out so I don't know how this will end up, and I would also like to hear someone's advice who has been through this start to finish.
 
...

Where the access is roughly equal, that is, somewhere between 40% and 60%, each parent will pay the other the amount from the Federal Tables according to income. So if I would pay $200 per month and my ex would pay $1000 per month then the net difference is $800 and that is what my ex should pay.
...

That is the formula that I use with 50/50 custody.
 
My lawyer advised that if custody were to go 50/50 then CS could either be zero or based on the table amounts for each parent's income. A coin flip according to him...
 
..

Where the access is roughly equal, that is, somewhere between 40% and 60%, each parent will pay the other the amount from the Federal Tables according to income. So if I would pay $200 per month and my ex would pay $1000 per month then the net difference is $800 and that is what my ex should pay.
...

This method mathematically means that it costs exactly DOUBLE to raise the child in two homes insteaf of one, which is of course not true, and therefore not fair....
 
Hey Billm - help me out wouldya? :D

To clarify: (I know the #'s aren't right but.....)

Scenario: Both parents have 50/50 "shared" custody.

Parent 1 makes $100,000/yr
Parent 2 makes $50,000/yr

For "shared" CS payments, does each parent determine "their" guideline amount, and Parent 1 pay the difference? For example....

Parent 1 supposed to pay $1000
Parent 2 supposed to pay $500

So therefore Parent 1 pays Parent 2 $500 and that's it?
 
Hey Billm - help me out wouldya? :D

To clarify: (I know the #'s aren't right but.....)

Scenario: Both parents have 50/50 "shared" custody.

Parent 1 makes $100,000/yr
Parent 2 makes $50,000/yr

For "shared" CS payments, does each parent determine "their" guideline amount, and Parent 1 pay the difference? For example....

Parent 1 supposed to pay $1000
Parent 2 supposed to pay $500

So therefore Parent 1 pays Parent 2 $500 and that's it?

Yes that is correct - that is called the set off method.

This method as I mentioned assumes that it costs exactly twice as much to raise a child, or in other words that the parents should spend exactly twice as much as when the child is living in just one house. I don't agree with this and it is a disadvantage to the person who make more money.

Here is the math to show that. Using your scenario, the guidelines say that given parent 1's income, they should spend $1000 on child raising (by giving it to the parent that has the child all the time).

Given parent 2's income, they should spend $500 on child raising (by giving it to the parent that has the child all the time).

So that is the case for a single house hold, parent 1 should spend $1000 and parent 2 should spend $500. Which ever one actually raises the child, it is assumed they spend that much, and they receive the other parents support, so the total to raise the child in one house is $1500.

Okay, so now for the set off method and equal physical custody...

Again with the same income/cs numbers. If it costs the same to raise the child in two houses as it does one, then the total still is $1500 ($750 for each house), and parent 1, who is supposed to spend $1000, gives parent 2 $250, and uses the remaining $750 to raise the child. Parent 2 receives $250 and spends their own $500 totalling $750 to raise the child. Great it works, assuming it costs the same for two houses, which of course it does not.

BUT for the set off method parent 1 gives parent 2 DOUBLE the amount ($500 instead of $250), which means that the set off method says it costs DOUBLE to raise kids in two houses because the only way that the set off method is fair (ie preserves the relative amounts each parent should pay : parent 1 twice as much as parent 2 in our case) is if it costs double to raise them in two houses.

So to prove this, lets look at examples of what it costs to see what is 'fair'...
Lets say it does cost double, $1500 for each house. So parent 1 gives $500 to parent 2, and also spends $1500 in their own house so total cost to parent 1 is $2000. Parent 2 receives $500, and spends another $1000 in their own house so total cost to parent 2 = $1000, so parent 1 pays twice as much for raising the kid as does parent 2, which is what the tables say.

BUT now lets assume that it does not cost double, lets assume that it costs 50% more when you do it in two houses instead of one = $1500 * 1.5 = $2250, or $1125/house. Parent 1 pays $500 to parent 2 and spends $1125 in their own house so total cost to parent 1 is $1625. Parent 2 receives $500 and spends $625 in their own house so total cost to parent 2 is $625. Parent 2's cost IS LESS than half of what poor parent 1 pays, yet the CS tables say that parent 2 should spend half as much as parent 1, which means parent 1 is taking on a greater percentage of the burden!

So the only way the set off method is fair to the greater income earner is if it costs twice as much to raise kids in two homes as compared to one, which of course is not true, so the greater income earner is paying more than their fair share.

I think all my numbers and logic is correct so if anyone can disprove or agree that would be great...
 
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THANK GOD our incomes are almost equal! I was actually able to follow that Bill, but it is very confusing and unfair.

One question though, if the shared parenting is not 50/50, say 60/40, do you still use that scenario or would you account for one parent having the children longer than the other (and thus being owed more or paying less)
 
60/40 normally means the 40% parent pays full guideline support payments, the 60 % parent has no cs obligation and his/her income is irrelevant.
 
I believe 40% is the so called magic number in terms of child support, meaning you could have your child for up to 40% of the time yet likely will pay full support to the other parent, along with everything else.
 
Dont forget, if you have shared custody, you are entitled to 6 months of any child tax credits in a given year. If you are the higher earning spouse, it works out in both your and the lower wage earning spouse's best interest to work out a deal to reduce your monthly support payments and allow the lower wage earner to claim the whole tax credit as they will receive more than you would.
 
Would the set off method apply if one child decided to move in with the other parent and each parent had custody of one child ?
 
Would the set off method apply if one child decided to move in with the other parent and each parent had custody of one child ?

I can't think of any reason why the set off method would not be applied to that situtation. Especially considering that the CS tables do not take into consideration the age of the children.
 
Dad needs help

Dad needs help

I need help.

I have my three small kids for 52.7% of each week living with me. I still manage to keep my job as a Senior Manager for a construction company by compressing my work week into 4 days. I also farm with my parents. The plan is that I will eventually buy my parents out and farm full time.
We have an interim order for Equal Shared Parenting / Joint Custody. My kids are 5, 3, and 1.

For the last year I have been paying 1500 per month in CS and 1000 per month in spousal support and barely getting by between support payments and constant legal bills. I also pay the special expenses directly.

My lawyer keeps telling me I am so "screw#d". She says I will be lucky if they do not get retroactive payments for both Child Support and Spousal Support. She has told me that I have no option but to pay the table amount of child support, and the "draft" guideline amount of spousal support. This is based on a gross income of 140k.

My former spouse works 36 horus a week for $12/hr and I have a six figure salary.

I need someone to tell me if it is really likely I am going to end up paying the maximum amount of support because of our income difference?

If I end up paying the table amounts, I will be ruined. I currently have trouble after CS, SS, and my own mortgage, utilities and groceries just getting by. I need help but have no idea where to find it, and I cannot believe that what my lawyer told me is really going to happen.
 
You can get a second opinion.

How long was the marriage? What did the marriage do to your wife's ability to earn? You don't have to pay the 'draft' guildlines - they are NOT law and they are guidelines - SS should be based on what happened in the marriage. CS is based on actual incomes and how much you each have the kids. The two of you can agree to any SS amount, your lawyer is telling you the worst case scenario.

Any difference in your incomes with respect to raising the children is handled by CS, so SS should be separate issue and if she is not given an incentive to earn more than $12 and work part time, then most likely she will not and the best incentive anyone can have is that working harder means a better lifestyle.

The problem with the SS calculator is that it is too easy to use, but in fact may not be fair with respect to what happened between two adults in a marriage. If you want to share your incomes as when you were married, then sharing NDI (net disposible income) is the way to go, but to me that should be the last resort when it is impossible to separate your incomes due to for example a long term marriage where one partner has permanent career damage.
 
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second opinion

second opinion

We were only married for four years. The Childrens mother was an office administrator when I met her in Toronto in 2003. We moved to Alberta in 2005 because we both wanted to raise our kids in the country. I have paid spousal support for the last year so that she had the opportunity to upgrade her skills, which had remained current through volunteer work while we were married.

She has stated privately that she likes her current job and has no intention of changing positions to make more money.

I cannot afford to pay the table amount of child support. Will a judge order it by default, or is their some other consideration. My former spouse has told me that she has no interest in discussing CS in mediation, and would prefer to let a court decide. She has stated that she does not care what I can afford, only that the court will decide what is fair.
 
We were only married for four years. The Childrens mother was an office administrator when I met her in Toronto in 2003. We moved to Alberta in 2005 because we both wanted to raise our kids in the country. I have paid spousal support for the last year so that she had the opportunity to upgrade her skills, which had remained current through volunteer work while we were married.

She has stated privately that she likes her current job and has no intention of changing positions to make more money.

I cannot afford to pay the table amount of child support. Will a judge order it by default, or is their some other consideration. My former spouse has told me that she has no interest in discussing CS in mediation, and would prefer to let a court decide. She has stated that she does not care what I can afford, only that the court will decide what is fair.

CS is table driven unless there are some extenuating circumstances.

See my post here regarding the set off method that is usually used. You will pay less than the table amount, you pay the difference between your table amount and her table amount - is that what you have been paying?

There is no reason to go to court over CS - just use the set off method as that is what the court would do anyway (as far as I know...).

Four years of marriage should result in very short duration of SS.

I don't know if the fact that you make considerably more than your ex combined with the fact that you each are providing a home for the children (50/50 custody), will result in anything other than very limited SS and set off CS calculation. I don't see why it should.
 
Thank-you. That is what I was afraid of. The set off method says I will pay 2800 a month, which is more than I can afford. I am going in to debt now every month at 1500 CS and 1000 SS.

I have been working in the construction industry so that I can take over the farm, and the funny thing is that this job is the one thing that will prevent me from doing that.. If I make too much money the CS load every month will keep from ever being able to take over the farm. Not to mention that I will never be able to transition to the farm because there is no way for me to pay $2800 per month and fight the legal battle for a variance order.

I would happily take the children more of the time, but that is'nt "fair". Like it is "fair" that I have to pay the entire cost of raising the kids in their home with me, and the entire cost of raising the kids in their mothers home.

I am not sure if I have any other options than to start farming now, which will result in a significant drop in income, but will wipeout my ability to keep supporting the kids across two homes. I feel trapped. If I keep working in this job I will be barely making ends meet and not be able to take over the farm, If I quit working in this job I will have trouble making ends meet and It will take alot longer to turn the farm into a profitable enterprise.

My parents are talking about retiring in a year and a half.. That's when I need to be running the farm.. Anybody out there have any thoughts on what I should do, because I am running out of them.

Thank-you.
 
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