Legal rights for a 20 yr. commonlaw relationship?

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I think you would be very lucky to get a small amount of money to set yourself up in another place. You have admitted to knowingly going along with his scheme to put the house under your name so the ex wife didn't find out. Your first posts denied this and now you have admitted to have actively participating in it. That kind of puzzles me. You say you the house was purchased 10 yrs into the relationship. I think you are talking out of both sides of your face right now and don't quite know what to make of it.
 
Whether or not there was "scheme" regarding the previous ex doesn't change the situation now. The property was bought after the man broke up his previous marriage, it has been run as a business (farming), she provided free labour, the property was conciously made joint and there can be no other reason for that other than acknowledging their relationship and her contribution.

wondergirl is co-owner of the property. This is fact. wondergirl was partner in the business and provided labour and was not fully compensated and had no opportunity to build her own savings throughout the relationship. This is fact. I see no supporting facts or reasons to show that it should only be a "small amount."

The ex may owe his previous wife additional money due to fraudulent disclosure. The fact that wondergirl was aware and participated does not obligate her under Family Law. The previous equalization was between the ex and his previous wife. The most that could be argued is that he had an undischarged liability and this should be subtracted from the asset.
 
what size was this farm??? How many acres, how many cattle etc? Was it an actual working farm or was it a hobby farm?

You do deserve to get something but farm hands do not get paid the big bucks. Between the free food, shelter etc I think you made out better then if you would have had to pay for that stuff out of a farm hands wage.

Was depreciation of the machinery etc done for income tax? Was the income from the sale of any livestock in the past reported as income ? Just trying to figure out if it was run as a business or what. You can say it was but if you didnt treat it like that at tax time you could be looking at an audit that may cost you more then you realize and you would be on the hook for it.
 
Standing has a very good point. In this case the tax returns might be able to shed some light on things. Big difference between a hobby farm and a working farm. Spousal support looks at all sort of things on an individual basis: need, entitlement, payor's income and ability to pay, payee's likelihood of supporting herself. In a marriage any property acquired during the marriage, regardless of who paid for it, becomes joint. Not sure about common law entitlement. Best case scenario 50% of property less his downpayment? If not a working farm and if the taxes do not show any farm business then machinery might have been depreciated as tools of trade? Lots of people do that and get away with it. Best to get copies of all tax returns for past 5 yrs if you can.
 
arabian said:
Standing has a very good point. In this case the tax returns might be able to shed some light on things. Big difference between a hobby farm and a working farm. Spousal support looks at all sort of things on an individual basis: need, entitlement, payor's income and ability to pay, payee's likelihood of supporting herself. In a marriage any property acquired during the marriage, regardless of who paid for it, becomes joint. Not sure about common law entitlement. Best case scenario 50% of property less his downpayment? If not a working farm and if the taxes do not show any farm business then machinery might have been depreciated as tools of trade? Lots of people do that and get away with it. Best to get copies of all tax returns for past 5 yrs if you can.
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my parents had a 100 acre farm and my mom stayed at home to raise us and do the farm chores. They had to keep every receipt for animal food, animal sales and purchases and equipment. They had an accountant do the income tax and all that stuff was reported.

The main question was the farm making money or not??? I am not sure but I think a business can only show a loss for so many years.
 
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arabian said:
I think you would be very lucky to get a small amount of money to set yourself up in another place. You have admitted to knowingly going along with his scheme to put the house under your name so the ex wife didn't find out. Your first posts denied this and now you have admitted to have actively participating in it. That kind of puzzles me. You say you the house was purchased 10 yrs into the relationship. I think you are talking out of both sides of your face right now and don't quite know what to make of it.
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I just came back to see if there were more posts..and saw your post arabian... :confused:

Now I have a thick skin, but you know if you knew ALL of the situation in the emotional side of the relationship you truly wouldn't have been so cruel..but, looking back at some of your posts to others I see that this is the route you take at times. It doesn't affect me, I see where it's coming from. Strange you take such a stance with people you don't know. It doesn't show your compassionate side.

Anyways, out of all of this Mess has been the most helpful in helping me understand what I need to look at going forward.

I will check back and update as the proceedings progress. Thank you so much everyone! :o
 
wondergirl: You are probably quite right. I do not know all of the situation aside from what you have provided on your post.

Having been screwed over by my ex putting our company money into his girlfriend's name at the end of our 30 yr marriage, I have a definite problem with people who actively or passively involve themselves in someone else's divorce and assist in hiding assets. You think I'm cruel?? Walk in my shoes before you cast judgment. I'm left holding the bag on ALL company debts.

By your own admission you assisted your spouse in hiding assets from his ex wife. Do you think that is something to be proud of? Some of us on this forum are "ex wives" who have been screwed over by the new emerging girlfriend.

I realize you made a judgement call at the time and the more information you provided in your post I thought I could empathize with your situation. I provide information on this site regularly to assist people in not making the same mistakes my ex did (as he has been 100% unsuccessful in any legal action taken against me).

If your feelings are hurt by my remarks then you had better toughen up. I only offer a sampling of what you will face in the future.
 
Since both of oyur names are on the title, you own half of the house. Your ex might try to argue unjust enrichment, but his lawyer and the judge if needed will tellhim how hard it would be to prove.

As for spousal support, since you live in Ontario, you will be treated the same as any married couple when it comes to spousal support. Therefore, he will be paying spousal support, and most likely indefinitely considering your age and lenght of your relationship. On the other side, you might not have a claim on his pension or RRSPs or any other assets that are in his name only.

As for Arabian, it seems that she is still very bitter when it comes to second wifes. I have to admit that it is almost funny how she blames her ex's girlfriend (and not her ex) for all her misfortunes. but I guess it is easier to blame the 'new girlfriend thento admit to her self that her ex just didn't love her anymore.
 
Toutou said:
Since both of oyur names are on the title, you own half of the house. Your ex might try to argue unjust enrichment, but his lawyer and the judge if needed will tellhim how hard it would be to prove.

As for spousal support, since you live in Ontario, you will be treated the same as any married couple when it comes to spousal support. Therefore, he will be paying spousal support, and most likely indefinitely considering your age and lenght of your relationship. On the other side, you might not have a claim on his pension or RRSPs or any other assets that are in his name only.

As for Arabian, it seems that she is still very bitter when it comes to second wifes. I have to admit that it is almost funny how she blames her ex's girlfriend (and not her ex) for all her misfortunes. but I guess it is easier to blame the 'new girlfriend thento admit to her self that her ex just didn't love her anymore.
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Re: Your statements...

Toutou, how do you know this for a fact? The joint tenant on this house is being disputed due to the fact that he paid for it all. :( And being that it is a commonlaw relationship (20 yrs) my lawyer is having a hard time justifying this other than trying for a resulting trust. At this moment it doesn't seem promising for me. He offered a small lump sum and no SS so far, and my lawyer is trying to come up with a better solution in my case. Are you suggesting I go to court?
 
Toutou - I would appreciate it if you wouldn't attempt to psychoanalyze me. I do ultimately blame my ex and myself for the failure of our 30 yr marriage and no one else. Nothing mysterious about that. My situation is not "almost funny" as I'm sure your situation isn't funny either. It is a very sad situation.

FYI - most people on this forum ARE bitter in one way or another for good reason. My ex is living with a former employee's wife (married woman), not a new wife. If you want to take the time and read through all of my posts you might have a clue as to what I have been through. Bitter - you better believe it. I was left with all of the debt of our company to pay off.
 
arabian said:
Toutou - I would appreciate it if you wouldn't attempt to psychoanalyze me. I do ultimately blame my ex and myself for the failure of our 30 yr marriage and no one else. Nothing mysterious about that. My situation is not "almost funny" as I'm sure your situation isn't funny either. It is a very sad situation.

FYI - most people on this forum ARE bitter in one way or another for good reason. My ex is living with a former employee's wife (married woman), not a new wife. If you want to take the time and read through all of my posts you might have a clue as to what I have been through. Bitter - you better believe it. I was left with all of the debt of our company to pay off.
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Perhaps, but do you really feel it helps - either yourself or anyone else - to walk around in a bitter angry little bubble waiting to explode on anyone who happens by?

There's lots and lots of different counselling and support groups available to get through/over that so you can start living with a clearer, healthier mind.
 
You legally own 50% of the house, so the fact that he made a payment on the mortgage will not change that. This is valid if both your names are on the legal title. He might try to argue unjust enrichment, but it is usually argued in situations where house is in one common law partner's name only and the other contributed by renovating or something similar. He will have to prove it and it will be really hard and expensive. I would suggest calling some other lawyers just to get another opinion on the issue. There is often 30 minutes free consultation, so if I were you I would call a couple and ask about this just to be sure.



As for spousal support, in Ontario you have the same rights as any married couple after three years of living together.
 
TouTou - I don't think proving unjust enrichment would be hard in this case at all. All the ex has to do is produce bank statements showing he paid the entire mortgage and the down payment etc. for the duration of the relationship. The ex will also likely provide affidavits supporting that fact. So while she is on title, her ex could and likely would argue that she has not financial investment in the house as he has made 100% of the financial contribution to the house.

The OP would have to argue that she did in fact make payments to the mortgage, which she has admitted here she has not. So she would effectively have to purger herself to make such claim, and would likely be quickly corrected by opposing counsel. That would effect her credibility going forward.

I think the best bet is a constructive trust claim. Yeah, he paid for everything but she made contributions in other ways to the upkeep of the house etc.

Being on title does give her some rights to the house in that he can't evict her or otherwise sell the house from underneith her. But she is likely in for a fight when it comes to equity.
 
HammerDad:

You are likely correct in your thoughts in this matter as it's becoming clear that my lawyer believes in this also.

It's amazing the reality of what joint tenant actually is, and what it is not in my case.

I would think from all of the reading and research I have done about joint tenant deeds/titles/mortgages that the split was supposed to be 50/50 regardless of who had payed.

As far as contributions in an alcoholic relationship, let it be known that I contributed far above what would have been required had it not been such.

But, as we all know..the emotional side of this is moot. sad but true.
 
Another wise tatement from our unbiased "moderator" blinkandimgone. So good to know she tries to keep things from getting personal between the posters and discourage this sort of thing. Such maturitiy on her part. Cudos.
 
It's interesting that my last comment mysteriously didn't get posted. I haven't used offensive language. Hmmmm. I do recall making a remark about the outstanding ability of our "moderator" blinkandimgone to ensure no one is insulting another....
 
....I have Issues with Common-Law Marriage as well

I find the 'SENIOR MEMBERS' here are more rude than helpful.

And, I don't know why that is!

But...I know this... If you were a 'KEPT WOMAN' Then He, has created that life for you. The Judge...will look at it as such...and He May have to continue that drama!!

I'm not a Senior nor a Junior here (LOL)
But, been in Court for 5 years/Common-Law (for reasons/motions!) Lawyers..LOVE MOTIONS!! I think there are over 3,000 of them!! (LOL)

Anyhow!
I'm in Ontario...So..Same Boat!


Email Anytime!
jdhpackaging@rogers.com

Hopefully, these Seniors....have not scared you away!!

I, ALSO, Thought this Forum was for Questions and Help!!

Email ANYTIME!
 
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