Ex wants to move with child. We have 50/50 access.

G

goblue

Member
Hello,

I'm going to share my current situation, and seeking advice and or a wake up call. I was with a woman for a few years, never married. We have a 3 year old daughter together. We split in May 2019. Since then, without a written agreement, we have split access and decision making 50/50. A month ago she got engaged to someone new. Two weeks ago, she tells me she plans to move an hour away but will still commute as hour daughter is in daycare where we live. I asked what happens next year when she starts school? She says she's not prepared to discuss that. One week later I get a letter from her lawyer outlining terms of a new agreement, whereby the daughter moves with her 2.5 hours away and that I have access to her every other weekend, forcing me to meet her half way to get her.

This week, both her and her fiance's house went up for sale. I retained a lawyer. , and will be filing a temporary, non-prejudiced order that says my daughter must maintain residence in Massey until a final order is made. I will be fighting to not lose any current access I have, and willing to keep her full time if I have to. I'm a present and caring parent. They are moving, I believe, solely because the fiance is from this other town and has another job lined up.

I guess I'm posting this to see if people here think I'm on the right track, and what do they think the chances are of a judge allowing her to leave town with my daughter?
 
Preventing relocation on an interim basis is the right move. Given that you have a shared custodial arrangement, you have a strong chance of success.

See Cox and Cox v. Darling, 2008 ONCJ at paragraph 13 (http://canlii.ca/t/1vxgx)

Relocating the child on an interim basis should be avoided where possible. This is because disruption now only to be reversed again at trial would be difficult for the child.
 
You are doing the right thing. She can move but your daughter stays where you are unless you agree.

The best thing you did was get a lawyer and file a motion. Good luck to you!
 
You have strong chances and argument. She chose to pick up and move, not you. If anything, she can have EOW.

I especially like how she lawyered up and tried to strong-arm you in hopes you turtle and scare away.
 
Last edited:
Good for you. You are doing the right thing. You could ask for custody of your child and that your ex sees her every second weekend if she insists on moving. Plus if she is the one moving she could be responsible for 100% of the drive to the drop off and pick up. When I first split with my ex he moved 2 hours away and the judge wouldn’t even consider his request that I meet him and his supervisor half way! He had to make the full trip back and forth to our city each and every time he exercised his supervised access with the person supervising him. Your matter would qualify as an urgent motion in these Covid times. How decent of you to fight for your children’s rights to have you in their lives as much as possible!
 
So, after all that positive talk. Beware and tread lightly.
Her lawyer obviously knows what they did is not going to work but it sounds like the staging of a much larger and dirty legal fight.
Your lawyer may like that and go along with some big fight.

If you have records that show that you had 50/50 but often changed up the schedule with irregular visits / access that will help.
 
pinkHouses, you're right, I'm positive once I file this order it will get dirty. The fact that she would even try this and think there's a possibility I would accept it is what scares me. She's the type of person that thinks she should get her way. I am very encouraged by the other responses, here, however.
 
I would add... be a model parent and be very careful with your communication with your ex. Minimize anything and expect anything you say to be twisted by her lawyer trying to discredit you.

I had a somewhat similar situation, but it was without notice in order to change the status quo. You have a strong establish status quo and you should do your best to document the STABLE and LONG STANDING STATUS QUO. Things will get ugly if your ex doesn't get her way, so expect a dirty fight. Don't give her any ammunition
to shoot you with. Good luck!
 
Kinso said:
Preventing relocation on an interim basis is the right move. Given that you have a shared custodial arrangement, you have a strong chance of success.

See Cox and Cox v. Darling, 2008 ONCJ at paragraph 13 (http://canlii.ca/t/1vxgx)

Relocating the child on an interim basis should be avoided where possible. This is because disruption now only to be reversed again at trial would be difficult for the child.
Click to expand...

I agree.

There are a few complex elements to this case though regarding the current jurisdictional location of the child. Massey Ontario is an isolated community. Significantly isolated.

2.5 hour from Massey is Sault Ste. Marie. 1.5 hour from Massey is Sudbury.

Employment in Massey and a lot of the arguments to support a move to a larger centre to support the "best interests" requirements under Gortz can be easily argued when you focus on Massey, ON.

There are just better opportunities for this child all round in the Soo or Sudbury in general. The justice hearing this matter will know that. That will play against the position you present. School has not been established.

The length of the relationship the other parent has had with their "new" partner will also matter and the state of that relationship. So focus on the Parent's employment (will they be employed) and their personal stability in the absence of the new partner matters. It matters because if it is a new relationship with no hardened track record of stability this works against them. Many relationships brake up and to move a child for a fleeting relationship is not something many judges will do.

Is the child with status? Meaning is either parent a Native Canadian? The reason I ask is that in Massey that matters and there is a strong Native population and this throws another layer of complexity. Depending on the band pressure can be applied through the Band Counsel on a parent. Its a very complex dynamic.

I would recommend that the OP (original poster) be prepared with a plan to move to where the child is should the other parent be permitted to move with the child. This matter is not a "slam dunk" (or "basket motion") due to a number of complex issues.

It is not like this child is being moved from say Peel/Durham or Toronto to Massey, ON... They are moving from Massey, ON potentially if I am reading this correctly. To a community (I suspect Soo based on the distances provided) that has 20x the support services for mother and child. Child care, medical services, employment opportunities, etc... are SIGNIFICANTLY different than in Massey, ON. Northern Ontario is NOTHING like Southern Ontario when it comes to service availability etc...

Applying "Southern Ontario" advice in this matter may seem like it fits but... It doesn't. Commute times that are only 30 minutes could turn quickly into a "no pass" situation from weather between Oct to April!

Proceed with a motion immediately. Hopefully it is heard in the Sudbury Superior Court. (I think that is the closest one.) There are good justices in that district that will be able to weave through the complexities of this matter.

I hope you have a very good lawyer. This is a very complex matter.
 
 
lol I didn't realize I posted the location. Scared me for a second. Yeah, I spend most weekends in the Soo as that's where my family is from and my daughter comes with me. It's more of a 2 hour drive. Sudbury is 1 hr away and we go there often for medical and other needs. The proposed move is to North Bay, which is the opposite direction of my family.

Both the mother and her fiance already have current full time employment (the mother in Massey, the fiance in Sudbury), but are, I believe, moving solely based on the fiance getting a job in his hometown.
 
goblue said:
lol I didn't realize I posted the location. Scared me for a second. Yeah, I spend most weekends in the Soo as that's where my family is from and my daughter comes with me. It's more of a 2 hour drive. Sudbury is 1 hr away and we go there often for medical and other needs. The proposed move is to North Bay, which is the opposite direction of my family.
Click to expand...

That works better for you. North Bay suffers similar challenges as Massey. Opportunities are low in North Bay and driving to Sudbury for employment daily is not do-able.

goblue said:
Both the mother and her fiance already have current full time employment (the mother in Massey, the fiance in Sudbury), but are, I believe, moving solely based on the fiance getting a job in his hometown.
Click to expand...

Oh I hope that they present that as evidence. A judge will have a FIELD DAY with that. Structure, stability and the ability to support the child is KEY. Basically they are gambling with the child's residence on a city that has very (if any real) opportunities.

Most of the cases I have seen involving mobility that have successful moves are for major career opportunities that are established for the moving parent. The "i want to move because my partner is going there" doesn't usually hold much water.

Again. Have a good lawyer. They will crush oral arguments on this one as the moving parent will have to disclose all this evidence. Chances are improving for you.
 
Tayken said:
Again. Have a good lawyer. They will crush oral arguments on this one as the moving parent will have to disclose all this evidence. Chances are improving for you.
Click to expand...

What are signs of a good lawyer? I haven't been happy with lack of communication or sense of urgency, or strategy (I've suggested everything), so far. But I lack experience in this and don't what's commonplace. I was considering making a switch after the first application, but I'm unsure.
 
What are signs of a good lawyer? I haven't been happy with lack of communication or sense of urgency, or strategy (I've suggested everything), so far. But I lack experience in this and don't what's commonplace. I was considering making a switch after the first application, but I'm unsure.
Click to expand...

This is a tough question to answer. I am a family lawyer and even I find it difficult to give a summary of things to look for. Mainly because things such as how a client feels, or success rates are terrible barometers in this field. Facts are everything and a lawyer who has lost many cases may just be willing to advance tough files.

Sadly, many lawyers are terrible communicators (ironically), and will take days to get back to you. I'm not sure a 'sense of urgency' is a good thing. After all, I'd rather the surgeon dealing with my heart attack have an air of calm than panic.

You can pay for another lawyer to give a second opinion. Have them review your file and give some thoughts. It will cost a bit (1-2 hours maybe), but could provide peace of mind that your lawyer is on the right track. It may also alert you to major problems.

As a lawyer, I have no issue with a client of mind getting a second opinion. My actions and advice should stand up to scrutiny.
 
Last edited:
goblue said:
What are signs of a good lawyer? I haven't been happy with lack of communication or sense of urgency, or strategy (I've suggested everything), so far. But I lack experience in this and don't what's commonplace. I was considering making a switch after the first application, but I'm unsure.
Click to expand...


This is normal as many people going through custody and divorce issues live and breathe their case daily. Your lawyer has many cases of various levels of urgency and court time. Throw in the delays due to COVID and it is a recipe for panic.

Take a deep breath. Has a motion been filed yet? Has your lawyer filed any paperwork or even a response? Then all you can do is wait. My husband went through the same terror over how slow things go and how he didn’t hear from his lawyer. You dont pay your lawyer to hold your hand. Take a beat and remember the court system works slowly. As long as things are headed to a date there is not much you can do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Thanks for the responses, everyone.

rockscan said:
Take a deep breath. Has a motion been filed yet? Has your lawyer filed any paperwork or even a response? Then all you can do is wait.
Click to expand...

No, nothing's been filed yet. I filled out the forms I was asked to do on Wednesday. On Friday, I asked my lawyer that while I wait for the application to be filed if I should at least be on record via email as opposing the change in my daughter's residency. I was told yes, so I sent an email.
 
So October 5th was my last post, which feels like two months ago to me based on how slow things seem to move for me. Oct 7th I signed the application, but she wasn't served until October 16th. In that time her house sold. Under the presumption that she's planning on leaving for North Bay (since i have not been told otherwise), my lawyer sent off a letter asking if she will bring an interim mobility motion or just plans to leave with the child, at which point i would file the urgent motion of non removal.

We did get a response stating that in the interim she will move to sudbury (an hour away) and that my access wouldn't be affected. This would be in place until she gets consent or court order to move to North Bay. So this isn't ideal, but good news I suppose.

I'm new to this, but still laughed at this paragraph in the email:
"There is no reason that your client needs to bring an urgent motion at this time as we have advised our client that she will need his permission or a court order to finalize her move to North Bay. On a balance of probabilities, it would appear that when she secures employment in North Bay, and given the fact that she will have support of her partner’s family in North Bay as well as her family in Sudbury, it is likely that our proposal would be accepted by the court."

Based on this, I guess I should just hook up with someone and say I have them for support, lol.
 
Your lawyer was ok with her moving the child to Sudbury? The winter drive to Massey is not very nice. It also means that if you have plans during your parenting time to visit your family in the Soo then the child will be in the car from Sudbury to the Soo, instead of just the one shorter trip from massey to the Soo.
 
tilt said:
Your lawyer was ok with her moving the child to Sudbury? The winter drive to Massey is not very nice. It also means that if you have plans during your parenting time to visit your family in the Soo then the child will be in the car from Sudbury to the Soo, instead of just the one shorter trip from massey to the Soo.
Click to expand...

I received the response yesterday and yet to discuss with lawyer. It's definitely not ideal. My daughter goes to daycare in Massey so she would just leave with me after daycare for when we visit my family.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top