Defeating an unfair and biased OCL report

Thanks dinkyface, you're probably right, I really don't know what to do to get a balance in my kids life, otherwise I can stick with proposed schedule, she talks lots of b..s.it in front of the kids, that's what is bothering me the most. And in the end, what I'm going to loose if I don't fight, my existing access schedule will not going to take it anyways.

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Dinkyface, yes there is a precedent, in 2011 in Hamilton I believe, it was {name removed by request} that father's name.

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I agree with a lot of the posters here. The thing you don't want to do is attack anyone, including the OCL.

Many times people come to this forum and say that the OCL reports are biased and in some cases they may be, but it does make me wonder if it is only biased because 50-50, joint custody is not awarded. Would you be crying the same story if the OCL concluded you should get sole custody and the ex limited access? I would think not.

You need to understand how this all looks to a Judge. Here are some points that just stick out to me...

  • Cops were called on two occassions- why? What happened? What was the end result?
  • Your ex fled to a womens shelther, you say you had no idea anything was wrong - think back to before this happened... what was really going on in the relationship at this time?
  • When the ex moved without your permission to take the kids, did you take immediate steps to have them returned or did you wait?
  • Why has the ex "banned" you form talking to her via email? How many emails were you sending and how exactly did she banned you?
  • Have you been charged with any domestic violence now or in the past that could be used against you?
  • You don't want to attend parenting classes because you say your ex has requested this and you don't think you need them... what is the harm in going? Maybe you will learn a thing or two

This isn't about proving your ex lied or the OCL was biased, this is about proving you have the best interest of the children in mind.
 
All you can do is offer the kids a safe, secure refuge where they have a voice, and know that they are loved. Avoid trash-talking the ex, or involving them in the fight as much as you can. Continually teach them the dangers of blaming and hating and judging (without reference to your conflict, of course), and encourage them to be positive thinkers, self-reliant, that they can CHOOSE their actions to make things better (or worse).
 
dinkyface said:
What did the OCL report recommend for access time? If it's alienation you are worried about, then access time, not who picks the school and takes to doctor visits, is your primary concern.
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Incorrect. As the child grows up, the child will come to the father and ask for help, the fathers response is I don't have custody, we have to check with your mother. Over time the child come to the father less and less. A relationship is lost.
This is one of the many documented reasons why joint custody is best for children.
 
involveddad75 said:
Incorrect. As the child grows up, the child will come to the father and ask for help, the fathers response is I don't have custody, we have to check with your mother. Over time the child come to the father less and less. A relationship is lost.
This is one of the many documented reasons why joint custody is best for children.
Click to expand...

I disagree with this. Custody is about MAJOR decisions, such as religion, education and heath. Even with joint custody you will run into the same thing, if it is something that falls under a major decision. Even if the OP had joint custody, he could not make decisions without consulting the mother.

I would be more worried about getting more access time with the children. If he can get shared access, even 40-60, custody to joint, would be easier.

My partner has joint custody and very rarely does Mom consult with him on anything. The only big thing is the dentist. S8 requires a lot of work to be done, but Mom books the appointments and doesn't tell Dad. Dad will phone to find out from the dentist when the appointment is and what it is for, but the reality of it is, the kid needs work done... if it is getting done that's great. We had an issue with Mom not taking the kids because she didn't want to take off work, but would not allow Dad to take them on her time. But if the kids are getting the proper care, then there is no issue.
 
To the OP and everyone else with OCL questions. WorkingDad and I are very well versed in disputing the OCL reports.
First steps here:
Set your goal, what is it you want? Joint / Sole
Access: Standard or Equal
Now keep this in mind in everything you do.
Before you do anything or say anything, say to yourself. Can I explain this to our child in 20 years and have them understand and not question why I did or say this. Does this help or hinder our children.

A few questions for you:
1. Has the OCL provided the court with a writen affidavit "The OCL Report" if so when was it filed? If not don't do anything until it is.
2. The OCL are recommendations, that is all.

Once the OCL report has been filed, you can then take steps to dispute it.
1. Write a letter to the supervisor and CC the assessor and ask for full and frank disclosure of the OCL notes and collateral notes. Including any audio, video, interviews, CAS case notes, Police records. I can help you write this letter.
2. Once you get the disclosure your requesting then you can proceed in looking it over. There are things you want to look for here. Such as
a. Does the report mention the good things about you or just the bad.
b. Does the report mention the bad things about your ex or just the good.
c. Has the concerns that the other side brought to the OCL been taken as true, or were they corroborated by a third independent person, such as coach or school, ex's family doesn't count.

You case now turns to not whats wrong with the OCL, but why you should be involved.

I suggest taking as many parenting classes as you can. It demonstrates you to be willing to take advice as well as participate in parenting discussions, and only takes a few hours. Do not go to CAS and take classes there go to the early years centers across ontario they have great classes.
I went to several and was able to provide my parenting experience to others in the meeting. It gave me confidence in how I parent.

To be continued.
 
Berner_faith, first time cops were caled because I found that she recorded my voice conversation over internet with my parents, she recorded with her phone left intentionally hidden by the PC, her mother knew about it and tried to hide it when I was about to retrieve it, then my ex called the cops, they arrived and didn't laid any charges, second time she called the cops because we had a tough conversation over the phone, she actually said that they're just supposed to counsel me and not to come.
A week before she fled to a shelter I spoke with her lawyer and she told me that I have to talk to my ex to go over terms and conditions of a separation agreement, then I had a talk to my ex and she agreed to arrange a meeting with 3 of us to prepare this separation agreement. My ex didn't arrange anything and she didn't talk to me about it, so I thought that everything will be allright. Then in one day they're missing, she flew with kids to a shelter being advised by her lawyer to do so. Everything was just fine since she last time called the cops, about 3 months period.
After she moved to a shelter I proposed her to move back with the kids to the hpuse so I will move out to a renting apartment for the sake of the children, she refused giving no reason. This offer was sent to her lawyer through my former lawyer so it's documented.
I explained above with her communication issues already.
I never been charged with any domestic violence or anything else, I never had any problems with police before or after these 2 incidents.
I have no problem on getting these counseling but it's just useless and wasting time.
So, do you still think that all off her actions was not planned ahead in time creating this status quo by lies and manipulations?

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involveddad75 said:
To the OP and everyone else with OCL questions. WorkingDad and I are very well versed in disputing the OCL reports.
First steps here:
Set your goal, what is it you want? Joint / Sole
Access: Standard or Equal
Now keep this in mind in everything you do.
Before you do anything or say anything, say to yourself. Can I explain this to our child in 20 years and have them understand and not question why I did or say this. Does this help or hinder our children.

A few questions for you:
1. Has the OCL provided the court with a writen affidavit "The OCL Report" if so when was it filed? If not don't do anything until it is.
2. The OCL are recommendations, that is all.

Once the OCL report has been filed, you can then take steps to dispute it.
1. Write a letter to the supervisor and CC the assessor and ask for full and frank disclosure of the OCL notes and collateral notes. Including any audio, video, interviews, CAS case notes, Police records. I can help you write this letter.
2. Once you get the disclosure your requesting then you can proceed in looking it over. There are things you want to look for here. Such as
a. Does the report mention the good things about you or just the bad.
b. Does the report mention the bad things about your ex or just the good.
c. Has the concerns that the other side brought to the OCL been taken as true, or were they corroborated by a third independent person, such as coach or school, ex's family doesn't count.

You case now turns to not whats wrong with the OCL, but why you should be involved.

I suggest taking as many parenting classes as you can. It demonstrates you to be willing to take advice as well as participate in parenting discussions, and only takes a few hours. Do not go to CAS and take classes there go to the early years centers across ontario they have great classes.
I went to several and was able to provide my parenting experience to others in the meeting. It gave me confidence in how I parent.

To be continued.
Click to expand...

involveddad75, thanks for your help, I appreciate it, please find my answers below. I'm looking for joint custody simply because I want to be an active part of my children's life, and not just a weekend toy dad, I want a balance in their life.

1. OCL provided with the report last September, so it's well beyond those 30 days.
2. OCL recommended sole custody to mother and increasing access to father and father to take parenting counselling classes.
Can you please help me with this letter requesting disclosure of information? My case conference is scheduled next month, is there something I can do at this conference? My ex is asking for a custody order decision. Should I ask the judge to hold on custody order until trial so all witnesses will get through cross-examination?
The report mention also the good things about me like, and only good things about my ex. All other information provided by the third party is okay, everyone talks good about me.
I already spoke with a parent-child early resource centre and I'll go there.
 
paco said:
Dinkyface, yes there is a precedent, in 2011 in Hamilton I believe, it was {name removed by request} that father's name.

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Click to expand...

This is WorkingDad. An extreme case. There is a very recent trial judgement giving him sole custody and supervised access to her, and she's not permitted to feed their son or change his clothing.
 
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Sample letter to OCL assessor requesting full disclosure.
Note: Only send this after the report has been filed in court.
Things can change between the disclosure meeting (where the assessor states her recommendations and when the report is filed. Also thing that occur at the disclosure meeting can show up in the report.


Sample letters:
Attn: Provincial Manager of Clinical Services
14th Floor
393 University Avenue
Toronto, On
M5GIW9

CC: Regional Manage
CC: Assessor

Re: Case Description (party 1 last name v. party 2 last name)
Court File Number: XXXXXX
OCL File Number: XXXXX.YYYY

I am writing to respectfully request a copy of Assessor Name CV as well the start date of when the assessor started conducting OCL assessments.

A copy of all source material, and complete personal notes from all interviews, observations, and telephone calls regarding this assessment as well as questions that were asked and things that were said. This would also include all case notes and records from all third party individuals such as the police and the CAS, and doctors and schools.

I am hear by informing the assessor and the OCL that I am disputing the OCL report.

Thank you.

I add the request for the start date as my OCL had never conducted an OCL assessment before mine. Something I suspected and later confirmed.

Again this is a sample letter, refine it for your individual case.
 
Another good wording to end the letter with is

I am requesting this information be provided to me as soon as possible, I require this information to understand and ascertain how the recommendations came about. Once again I am disputing the OCL report.
 
Excellent, but from my understanding disputing the report has to be done within 30 days when the report has been filled in court, so in my case it's more than 5 months.

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Correct, but if you tell them you are disputing it then they may allow a dispute to be put in, in my case I told them I was disputing, wrote my dispute and decided not to send it to them. I instead told them that the report needed to be tested at trial. I kept my cards close to me until trial.


But in order to prepare for trial you need to understand all the information the OCL had when they made the recommendations.

I would also search Canlii and see if the assessor has been referenced in any other cases.
 
Thanks a lot, as soon I finish my case conference brief documents I will fill that letter to OCL and i'll send it to them, so my ex is hurrying up now at case conf, she's asking the judge for a custody order to be made based on OCL recommendations, what's your advise, I need cross-examination of all witnesses.

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Remember the judge can't order custody or access at a case conference. And if they try, simply state that for the record you feel custody and access are issues to be dealt with at trial. That the evidence needs to be tested.
 
Excellent, I didn't know that, God bless you for this info...thank you, I feel kind of relaxed now knowing that I still have some time to prepare for the big battle. Now, my ex's counsel is looking to get settlement conf and trial together, is this something good or bad?

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I'm the applicant and I have no ideea how to prepare the trial, I let my former lawyer go last November after I found that she's at the 2nd personal divorce and simply didn't want to get more involved with my custody battle,and also she is $300/hr "experienced" lawyer

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