being a male, will possibly get spousal support

J

jays2017

New member
- give you a bit of details of the situation
married 12 years and have a 9 year son ...i make the make 60000 a year
she makes 110000...we have lived in our house 10 years and the house is paid off...house worth approx 950000...wife will be seeing a lawyer this week to get the seperation started and in 1 year divorce..same time i will see a lawyer soon...live in mississauga and talked about joint custody where we both find a place of our own, most likely a townhouse...
my question is will i get spousal support in my situation...and also child support..
- also yesterday mentioned about the spousal support and she freaked out saying i will get nothing and she will go for full custody if i go for spousal support

thanks
 
HALT !

You have equity (home) and both have good jobs. If the two of you start litigating the only people who come out ahead will be lawyers. Both you and your wife will be told what you want to hear from your lawyers.....

Unless you want to part with some major money (far exceeding amounts either of you would possibly pay for SS and CS) think of ways for the two of you can come to and agreement. You want to dial-down the nasty, threatening dialogue between the two of you (lawyers will want to do the opposite with aggressive letters).

Do your own independent research (and encourage your ex to do same) and then suggest the two of you meet up to have a civil discussion. Include in that discussion future plans for your son's education.
 
jays2017 said:
Thanks for the reply..
back to my initial question..am i entitled to spousal support
thanks
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Why do you think you would be entitled? What did you sacrifice during the marriage to be entitled? Did you take years off to raise the child? Did you relocate for her job? Research SS and see if you fit the criteria but income disparity alone isn't enough to award SS.


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good points, just thought after a marriage , the courts would see to still have the same standard of living...as in my situation...will most liking have to move out of mississauga as housing is expensive..so was thinking move west if not get spousal support, if can get ,,can be in the same city as my child
thanks
 
check out the "with child" calclulator

Spousal Support Advisory Guidelines

Much on determining eligibility of SS comes down to the discretion of the judge... unlike CS, SS is determined on an individual basis.

The longer you were married the more your two incomes merged together to establish standard of living. Of course, it goes without saying, when two people separate BOTH people lose standard of living unless you are wealthy. SS comes into play when one person is clearly disadvantaged by the end of the marriage.

So, for a couple with no children of the marriage, you split the assets/debts. The top end of SS would be 50% of difference of your gross income (1/2 of 50k difference would be 25k/year in SS).

You have to calculate, using the SSAG guidelines, what the calculation for SS is for with children. I believe the amount would be considerably less.

Your wife may THINK she can request and obtain sole custody and make you pay CS. It certainly isn't that simple (there are many threads on this forum where you can find out why).

So you go to your lawyer and cut him a retainer for a minimum of 5k. Your monthly bill of letter writing and you and him attending "case conferences" and "4-way meetings" will likely be well over 5k (monthly). Your wife will be looking at the same amount of money. So do the math. Is the amount you would hope to gain for time-limited SS (don't assume it will be indefinite unless you meet criteria) worth it in the end? You can look at the time limitations by reading up on "rule of 65." Basically you combine your age at time of separation with years married. If the number exceeds 65 then you may be entitled to indefinite SS. Be aware, however, that "indefinite" SS can amount to 100.00/month - nothing is guaranteed.

Lots for you to research unless you merely want to pay your lawyer to meet with you and explain everything to you (at 400.00/hr + I'd recommend you get up-to-speed).
 
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SS is not a given because you make less than your ex. Its to compensate a spouse who gave up their earning ability to support the other spouse. My partner was entitled to SS not because his ex made double his income but because he sacrificed his earning ability by staying home with the kids and not being more mobile for his career. If you both worked and it just happens that you are at your regular salary for your job and she is at the regular salary for her job then the likelihood of getting SS is low.

Keeping standards of living the same only relates to kids. If you have 50/50 offset then she would pay you the difference in child support.

Everyone who says you need to do some research and don't blow you equalization on a lawyer is right on the money. Don't waste $20,000 you could put onto a townhouse to fight for something you aren't entitled to and for gods sake don't say crap to your ex that will get her hackles up and make the negotiation worse!
 
being a male, will possibly get spousal support

jays2017 said:
so was thinking move west if not get spousal support, if can get ,,can be in the same city as my child
thanks
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Should also mention this is a crappy way to look at it. If you cant get spousal you will leave your child? Is your child not worth it? You would walk away with probably $400,000 from the equity if you are smart. Then probably receive ~$400 a month in cs. You could live on that for the sake of your child.
 
jays2017 said:
- give you a bit of details of the situation
married 12 years and have a 9 year son ...i make the make 60000 a year
she makes 110000...we have lived in our house 10 years and the house is paid off...house worth approx 950000...wife will be seeing a lawyer this week to get the seperation started and in 1 year divorce..same time i will see a lawyer soon...live in mississauga and talked about joint custody where we both find a place of our own, most likely a townhouse...
my question is will i get spousal support in my situation...and also child support..
- also yesterday mentioned about the spousal support and she freaked out saying i will get nothing and she will go for full custody if i go for spousal support

thanks
Click to expand...

Spousal support, unlike child, is not mandatory. You not sick, not stay at home dad, you have a job now, you worked before. You have your share of equity. You will get no spousal support.
 
jays2017 said:
good points, just thought after a marriage , the courts would see to still have the same standard of living...as in my situation...will most liking have to move out of mississauga as housing is expensive..so was thinking move west if not get spousal support, if can get ,,can be in the same city as my child
thanks
Click to expand...

I would suggest you re-evaluate your priorities, and focus on doing your best to remain in the area in which the child CURRENTLY resides, so that you can continue to be an equal parent. Jays - moving away from your son is not an option, for you or for him.

But yes, I believe you are correct in your initial assessment.

The two equal household/child custody will be adjusted financially with cs, and whether you are male/female doesn't really matter in 2017 (although we'll hear certain individuals continue to gripe).

And given the income disparities with your 12-year long-term marriage, a child to raise in two homes. when I combine her income, you should be entitled to/receive SS for a time period, to be negotiated.
 
Is it not better to be the "Applicant" than the "Respondent"? Jays2017 you may want to get the ball rolling before she does. Hopefully someone with more experience, (I am a newbie at this) can tell you better.
 
just a thought

just a thought

just a thought..is there anyway the judge could grant me full custody and my wife have all the visitation she wants, i would move to kitchener where my parents are and my parents would defenitly help with any day care , dropping off to schoool etc...while my wife right now gets home approx 6 pm...but than again she would buy a townhouse closer to the area where we are now and keep our son at the same school and still be close to his friends...she is a good mother , no faults..
thoughts
thanks
 
Pull that and your stbx will go for full custody with you paying full table cs leading to an expensive battle for what you really want--money.

Give your head a shake and start thinking whats best for your son not you!
 
Some questions:

1) Did you ever stay home for a period of time to watch the kids?
2) Did you ever relocate for your wife's job?
3) Did you ever turn down a promotion due to child care duties?
4) Did you make any job decisions based upon your wife's comfortable income?

If you can answer yes to at least one question, you should pursue SS.
 
jays2017 said:
just a thought..is there anyway the judge could grant me full custody
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Unless the other parent is a danger to the children or the communication is so horrible from the other parent the short answer is "NO". "Full Custody" isn't really all that important as your child is 9 and can speak for themselves when it comes to medical issues for the most part. As well, they are well established at school and not much will be able to change when it comes to that as a status quo has been established.

THe best you should hope for is joint custody.

jays2017 said:
and my wife have all the visitation she wants,
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This is effectively called "majority access" and the answer to this is unless the other parent agrees to the answer is NO again.

The best you can (and should) hope for is equal access (50-50).

jays2017 said:
i would move to kitchener where my parents are and my parents would defenitly help with any day care , dropping off to schoool etc...
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Again, unless the other parent agrees to this the answer is not just NO but, NEVER. Habitual residential locations for children are incredibly hard to move by court order. YOu will be in the Peel region and facing judges who are not keen on moving children. You would need a case of significant evidence that it would be in the child's best interests. Sorry to say moving to live with your parents is not enough. Cheaper is not enough.

In fact, if you reside in Mississauga I can almost guarantee that the children will remain in Mississauga. There isn't a sitting judge that I am aware of in Peel that will make that order. You can thank the previous Head Justice Mossip for establishing some pretty sound case law on NOT permitting children to move on a parent's want/desire.

jays2017 said:
while my wife right now gets home approx 6 pm...but than again she would buy a townhouse closer to the area where we are now and keep our son at the same school and still be close to his friends...she is a good mother , no faults..
thoughts
thanks
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The reason you will not get "sole custody", "majority access" nor be able to move the child's "habitual residential location" is highlighted in your own words (bold). She is a good mother and has no faults.

If the other parent is going to talk to a lawyer guess what... The lawyer just told them everything I am telling you. You take this to court and you will be doing as Arabian said... Wasting money.

Find a residence in Mississauga. Don't change the child's school. The whole objective of the best interests is to minimize disruption to the child. So, seeing a parent less, moving to a new city, and having only one parent makes all the decisions is the MOST disruption you could bring.

You are best to try and keep everything as simple as possible, save your legal expenses and come to an agreement for 50-50 access, joint custody and remain in Mississauga.

Furthermore, I don't think you have much of a case for SS. YOu do have a case for offset CS if 50-50 access is agreeded upon or ordered.

Good Luck!
Tayken
 
jays2017 said:
- also yesterday mentioned about the spousal support and she freaked out saying i will get nothing and she will go for full custody if i go for spousal support
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Ha! Typical female response. So she wants full custody not because it is in the best interests of the child, but instead because she don't want you to be entitled to any child support or spousal support because she has a higher income. And further, because she wants MONEY from YOU.

That first issue. Second issue, the system is biased. If not obvious by all the moms running into this thread like cockroaches taking the mom's side, the complete opposite would be true if your incomes were reversed, and she had come here asking about spousal and child support.


Yes you are entitled to spousal support because she makes more money than you. You will be earning less after the divorce and she has to compensate you for that. The house will have to be divded equally.

Don't confuse joint custody with shared custody. Joint custody is decision making. Shared custody is time sharing. You will need to have child for 40% or more of the time in your care. If you do, then she will have to pay you child support based on the difference, i.e., $50,000/year. Which translaes to a little over $400/month child support.

My advice: DO NOT LEAVE THE MAT. HOME. DO NOT ALLOW HER TO CREATE AND ARTIFICIAL STATUS QUO - STAY IN YOUR CHILDS LIFE EQUALLY. If she distrubs the status quo, then bring a motion to keep the status quo.

My other advice: Start meeting with GOOD lawyers immediately. She sounds like yet another control freak. Don't let her toss you into the PAY PAY PAY and DO DO DO cage. Soon enough she will be arranging your marriage with your new wife for you - telling you where and when to have it. he. he. he. That thread was closed but this was just another opportunity for me to take another dab at it :)
 
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rockscan said:
Pull that and your stbx will go for full custody with you paying full table cs leading to an expensive battle for what you really want--money.

Give your head a shake and start thinking whats best for your son not you!
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Except for the mom, to my surprise, is the one that is doing it for money. The father has a right to ask for spousal support, just as would the mom if she had the lower income.

- also yesterday mentioned about the spousal support and she freaked out saying i will get nothing and she will go for full custody if i go for spousal support
Click to expand...
 
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Agreed,

My ex didn't do anything to allow me to succeed, but she got SS because she is a woman.

Did not go back to work

Did not give up school for me

Did not relocate from job

Anyone can clean house, make food, and do laundry. All minimum wage work.

Women don't like the law when it works against them.

Personally, I think you should fend for yourself, but not until the other gender has to as well. What's good for the gander, is good for the goose.

AND YES, ARABIAN IS THE EXCEPTION.....SHOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO SUE IN COURT FOR WHAT HER BUSINESS PARTNER (HUSBAND) DID TO HER IF SHE WAS ACTUALLY A REAL BUSINESS PARTNER IN A COMPANY.
 
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jays2017 said:
just a thought..is there anyway the judge could grant me full custody and my wife have all the visitation she wants, i would move to kitchener where my parents are and my parents would defenitly help with any day care , dropping off to schoool etc...while my wife right now gets home approx 6 pm...but than again she would buy a townhouse closer to the area where we are now and keep our son at the same school and still be close to his friends...she is a good mother , no faults..
thoughts
thanks
Click to expand...

Yes you can get sole custody while child lives with mom. Chance of that being ordered? Rare, extremely rare. I would stay away from Kitchener. The judges there are beyond biased. You will hear horror stories from fathers on this site who have appeared before the mother-biased Kitchener family court judges.

Stay where the children reside. If she moves with the children, then you immediately motion the return of the children to your care and there you have sole custody status quo.

She is a good mother, no faults. Presumably, you are also a good dad with no faults. So why should she have sole custody? Why does she want sole custody other than because she is trying to punish you for asking for something you are entitled to, i.e., spousal support?

If you are both good parents, and you communicate with her, then it should be joint custody and equal parenting times. IF she witholds her cooperation and communication, sort of like she is now with the whole, you want spousal support then I want sole custody and full child support kindergarden utter non sense, then yes, I would go for sole custody.

You may want to re evaluate your position. How good of a mother is she if she wants to cut you out of the decisions and leave you with very little time with your children? How good of a mother is she if she is doing that just to financially benefit from the divorce? Are the children her primary concern or is this all about her chequing and savings account ?
 
piggybanktoex said:
AND YES, ARABIAN IS THE EXCEPTION.....SHOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO SUE IN COURT FOR WHAT HER BUSINESS PARTNER (HUSBAND) DID TO HER IF SHE WAS ACTUALLY A REAL BUSINESS PARTNER IN A COMPANY.
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Her ex obviously had the better lawyer.

The system may be biased, but with a way better lawyer then your ex who knows the judge well. Given your ex is a little messed up and done some "WTF" things, then you could expect to have really good results.

At the end of the day, Arabian is still getting spousal support and defending every motion to stop it. Meanwhile telling men not to persue spousal support. Not biased or jilted at all.
 
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