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2-2-5-5 --> 50-50 Residential Schedule Explained

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  • #16
    2-2-5-5 should have been followed from the get-go, seemingly not worth chg >23 mths.

    If the week-about schedule is working why change it to a 2-2-5-5. Sure, there are benefits to the 2-2-5-5 schedule. But, if you have week-about access and the children are the ages you stated and are doing well... Why change?

    Effort of change is seemingly not worth it. In hindsight, should have proposed 2-2-5-5 from the beginning - especially in light of move.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by kidsRworthit! View Post
      Effort of change is seemingly not worth it. In hindsight, should have proposed 2-2-5-5 from the beginning - especially in light of move.
      I agree fully with your statement but, the knowledge of the 2-2-5-5 access schedule isn't very common "yet" in the legal community. The 2-2-5-5 access schedules are usually the advice that comes from custody and access assessors. When you came to your week-about agreement it is highly likely that neither you, the other parent or the legal counsel that you both may have had in the matter were familiar with it. Hence the reason I posted the original thread to assist the community of people in gaining common knowledge.

      Don't beat yourself up about it now. Week-about schedules are not awful. They are very traditional and common today still. Yes, 2-2-5-5 would possibly be better but, not better than a court battle to have it put in place when you already have a week-about schedule on a 50-50 joint residency pattern with both parents.

      There are many people who come to this site that would really like to have joint residency situation no matter what schedule. So you are doing much better than many who struggle to even get that.

      Don't look back as much as you look forward. The 30 minutes is not a horrible problem. The decision to move was by the other parent but, what is 15 minutes between parents.

      The first step to possibly making your situation better is to possibly move the week-about exchanges to Wednesday after school. The parent receiving the children for their week should be responsible for picking up the children from school. In the summer, you will have to figure something out. This way the children can adjust to the change and for the weekend. You have Wednesday night through to Tuesday Night of the next week for home work and other things.

      The biggest benefit for a 2-2-5-5 is being able to know that on every monday/tuesday (or wednesday/thursday) the children are with a specific parent. For a limited set of activities that means as a parent you can schedule the children for that activity and know that you will always be able to take them and not have to discuss it with the other parent. Now this doesn't work for team sports (hockey etc...) but, for piano lessons, swimming lessons, and other individual sports and activities it works out really well.

      I wouldn't be too eager to rush into court expecting much to change. It may be an expensive lesson for you and cause more conflict than it is worth in the end. Lawyers are not cheap (250-500+ an hour) and one can't put a cost on the emotional challenge that comes from the adversarial system of family law. Do you really want to engage in a system that pits you as an applicant vs respondent in a lawsuit? I have never seen any matter go to court that makes the situation better for children.

      I am of the opinion that the court system should be a last resort left for matters that truly impact Rules 24.(4) ("violence and abuse") and that all matters are best settled peacfully through a mediated solution. This is hard to do in many cases but, I suspect your matter would be a good candidate for mediation.

      If you are in Toronto consider leveraging Riverdale Mediation services. They are not cheap but, they are well rounded, highly regarded and Hillary Linton literally wrote the book on Family Law mediation. If you are not in the Toronto area look for someone who has been specifically trained by Hillary Linton or Dr. Barbra Landau (Cooperative Solutions). Most mediators who have been trained by either Hillary or Dr. Landau will list their training from these two highly regarded professionals.

      Good LucK!
      Tayken

      Comment


      • #18
        responses

        Originally posted by SadAndTired View Post
        How long ago did the move occur? You allowed her to move?
        Move: August 2012
        Qualified yes. Although I raised my disapproval due to amount of travel to kid's school, sports, friends, etc. I allowed it, as I was given assurances all driving would be taken care of by my ex and her bf.

        You allowed your daughter(11) to change schools to Mom's area?
        Not exactly - my response is before my ex, supporting this with logistical considerations addressed. Hopefully negotiation will secure a timely solution and prempt requirement to have decision imposed in court.

        Have you maintained 50/50 throughout?
        Yes

        Have you asked Mom if she would want 2-2-5-5?
        No, I know I would receive pushback though.

        If it addressed some of the children's issues and did not disrupt the children's access to each parent, I can't see a judge having much problem with changing access to 2-2-5-5 but you have to have valid reasons why this is necessary. How will it benefit the children and how will it take away some of the current challenges associated with Mom's move??
        Frequent and meaningful contact with both parents is in children's best interests. It would inevitably hinder the routine of mom's move from last August.

        The stumbling block may be that you agreed to the move and the change of school by doing nothing at the time. This may be something you want to consider acting on quickly as the more time passes, the more status quo is established.
        I disagreed about move, however, I did not seek a court order restricting her move (hindsight is 20*20). School is now a pressing issue which is being pursued. Proper established status quo is good for all... (agreed)

        Also, since Mom moved, if you do file motions, ask that she be required to provide transportation to and from access exchange.
        Worthwhile asking...if you don't ask in court, you don't receive.
        Thx.
        Last edited by kidsRworthit; 07-21-2013, 09:25 PM.

        Comment


        • #19
          responses

          If the week-about schedule is working why change it to a 2-2-5-5. Sure, there are benefits to the 2-2-5-5 schedule. But, if you have week-about access and the children are the ages you stated and are doing well... Why change?

          Agreed: Effort of change is seemingly not worth it. In hindsight, should have proposed 2-2-5-5 from the beginning - especially in light of move by OP and focus on changing sports and school of our s9 and d11 to that centred in her community and catchment area.


          But, things change. The week-about schedule should remain the same. Just means that each parent have to do things in parallel to each other now due to the distance. Daycare or other child care providers may have to become involved. But, like life things often change.


          Agreed - life goes on.

          Why does the "boyfriend" factor into anything? You have week-about parenting and you should follow that access schedule. Routines in life change and surely the other parent has a right to seek out new relationships.


          For about 7 months, homework routine was not viewed as work by my ex, as it meant daily contact with our kids and investing in our children - was not "work". Suddenly at end of March, ex is doing "more than her share" of 50/50 routine and specifically wants me to tend to their homework (French). So true week-about format adopted. This coincided with bf new on the scene. I mentioned her comment that existing routine enabled her to see our kids daily - which she stressed as being important. She countered with: "I feel like I've been doing more than my share".

          This is good. 30 minute drive away isn't a big issue.



          You don't have to agree to the change in the enrollment in sports. A justice would look at the enrollment in school and sports as the same. Hockey Canada and Soccer Canada often link their enrollments to the child's school and location of the school. I know Hockey Canada for example has specific rules regarding this.


          Qualification: I have a High Conflict OP
          Correct. Due to engineering of arrangement, s9 has been living with mom since Christmas and has not been joining d11 on father's parenting time. The 50/50 (weekabout) shared parenting arrangement has been unilaterally upset by the mother to satisfy her interest in having our son play sports in the community she moved to.

          d11 has followed 50/50 parenting arrangement to a tee for 23 months. However, just recently, she has been withheld from my parenting time. Now education is being used as the forum to attract our d11 to stay with mom (most of the time). I am under the impression, this latest tactic constitutes "bad faith", and have counsel working on it.

          I've actively disengaged from drama, as our kids are embroiled in adult issues and it is VERY unhealthy for them. Post custody evaluation and recommendation and now into reunification counselling, it is time to secure orders as the HCP has not acknowledged reason and strong recommendations. btw: we're finally using Our Family Wizard communication software.

          Again, the child should be going with the flow of students she went to school with before. New area... new friends and new challenges. You can simply let the school know that as a joint custodial parent your written consent is required to change enrollment.


          Agreed and rational, although the custody evaluation report recommended that she attend the school in mom's catchment area = 2 hr. daily bus ride from mom's house, and NO bus service from dad's house (???) (> 80% of the 2 graduating gr. 6 students will be attending the school 1.5km down the road: in the father's catchment area)

          The school superintendent clarified board policy: so long as a parent is living in the respective catchment area of a school, they may register their child in that school. Thus dual registration is acceptable, however come school time, parental agreement is required, or court order needed to determine which school the child will be attending. School boards let the parents be accountable for their actions and intentionally do not "get involved"

          2-2-5-5 has nothing to do about the community the children are in but the access they have with parents though...



          Yes, although 2-2-5-5 would "encourage" parents to remain close together due to logistics = best interests of the children. Had 2-2-5-5 been pursued from the get-go, perhaps things would be different...

          Not enough that a large fight and court battle would be worth really. You have to consider that.


          Absolutely. This has been my life since last Sept.: hockey forum, then school forum. I have disengaged from hockey, and now I have to "prove the logic" of the flow of our daughter joining her friends at the school down the road from where she is graduating. (next to her brother who is 2 years younger) (this after 3 months of an evaluation with illogical recommendations)
          I understand the "choose your battles" addage - and am continuously adjusting my course.

          Not really but, the children are well beyond the common age where this is recommended. Not that it isn't appropriate for children of the ages you have shared but, a week about schedule isn't torture and pretty common. 2-2-5-5 is better but, not necessary.



          Best to retain counsel. Not usually worth fighting over a 30 minute commute between parent's houses. But, best to check with a lawyer to see if you have any valid evidence to seek an order for the child to remain in the current catchment and sports programs within the catchment area.


          Being pursued. Evidence and rationale being collected.

          Thank you for your insight!

          PS - I'll figure out how to respond slickly soon.


          Good Luck!
          Tayken[/QUOTE]

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by kidsRworthit! View Post
            If the ...
            Question: kidsRworthit! did you contribute to this site in the past under another user account and change the account name? Your story seems familiar but, I can't place the user name now.

            Good Luck!
            Tayken

            Comment


            • #21
              Yes, you've spotted the cameleon

              Good call...and always look forward to reading your highly insightful posts; in addition to posts of others of your ilk.

              I'm the person who delved into Hockey Canada rules in an effort to understand residency requirements...

              I've been allowed to change my userID to one which resonates with me, as opposed to name descriptive. (which I setup in a time of emotional stress)

              Comment


              • #22
                Hi All,

                Any suggestions for an offer of settlement on how I propose a build up to a 2-2-5-5 (50/50 schedule)

                I'm thinking of suggesting after 6 months of a build up to it.

                Right now I am essentially Fri eve to Mon a.m. and an alternative Sun eve to Mon a.m.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by DontGiveUp View Post
                  Hi All,

                  Any suggestions for an offer of settlement on how I propose a build up to a 2-2-5-5 (50/50 schedule)

                  I'm thinking of suggesting after 6 months of a build up to it.

                  Right now I am essentially Fri eve to Mon a.m. and an alternative Sun eve to Mon a.m.
                  They are either for it or not, how would a progressive approach help in your situation?

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    I'm trying to revise the current access time / schedule to be in line with an eventual jump to 50/50 time using the 2-2-5-5-.

                    I'm suggesting how best to change what I have now, add maybe an additional evening and present it as a logical plan to gradual 2-2-5-5

                    Not sure what you mean by a progressive approach in my situation?

                    The other party, and likely a judge whether offering opinion on it in SC or a judge ruling on it at a trial would have trouble giving me directly a 50/50 arrangement right from what I have today and listed above. Looking to add an evening now (a change in status quo) and jump to 2-2-5-5 maybe 6 months after that?

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by DontGiveUp View Post

                      Not sure what you mean by a progressive approach in my situation?
                      Progressive approach = graduated access increase, I believe.

                      Originally posted by DontGiveUp View Post
                      I'm trying to revise the current access time / schedule to be in line with an eventual jump to 50/50 time using the 2-2-5-5-.

                      I'm suggesting how best to change what I have now, add maybe an additional evening and present it as a logical plan to gradual 2-2-5-5

                      The other party, and likely a judge whether offering opinion on it in SC or a judge ruling on it at a trial would have trouble giving me directly a 50/50 arrangement right from what I have today and listed above. Looking to add an evening now (a change in status quo) and jump to 2-2-5-5 maybe 6 months after that?

                      If the child is not in school, maybe have the 50/50 access coincide with starting school.

                      FWIW, pretty much every conference judge suggested that we should use a graduated increase in access to get to a point that is agreeable to both sides.

                      SC (male) judge suggested we should eventually reach 50/50.
                      TMC (female) judge basically said there's no way I would obtain 50/50 access and should be happy with a slight increase over what I have now.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Yes, my SC judge (female) was not very pro my case on access and custody where as my CC judge (female) totally was. This is for an additional SC with the same SC judge as before.

                        Children are in school. I'm not sure what new access schedule to start with in the SC brief to then through progressive approach get to a 2-2-5-5

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Putting this comment from another thread in here because it is great:

                          http://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/f...tml#post213464

                          Four of the days are completely stable and known.

                          I can plan activities for the kids on Wednesday and Thursday because I have them. If I sign up a kid for dance lessons on Wednesdays, I know that she will be able to go because I have her every Wednesday. I don't have to even consult my ex.

                          I can go to my band practice on Tuesdays and have my pottery on Monday because I am kid free every single Tuesday and Monday. Parental stability has some value too.

                          One of my kids has a regular weekday playdate. See how I used the word "regular"? That is what makes 5-5-2-2 so incredibly wonderful.

                          Weekends are unstable, but weekends are unstable for almost every single possible custody schedule, since they all pretty much alternate weekends. You can't hold that against the 5-5-2-2.

                          As for the "settling down period" nonsense, isn't that some Judith Wallerstein crap? Anecdotally, my kids have a roughly 60 second settling down period, maybe less. They usually call me "mom" for the first hour and then laugh about it. All my divorced friends run 5-5-2-2, and none of us has had transition issues... and we all started with very very young kids.

                          Comment

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