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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #1  
Old 08-11-2022, 12:21 PM
kidsRworthit kidsRworthit is offline
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Default FRO unable to action court order (overpayment)

(SCJ ON) Court order recently received following submission of basket motion (consent).

Content: addresses child support overpayment (Jan. 2020 - present), with specific incomes to be used for child support calculations identifying basis of income to use for years 2018 & 2019 (Employer Letter of Income) specified in 2019 December court endorsement.

Why?: as a federal gov't employee, I was a victim of the Phoenix pay system and overpaid one year, while it was "clawed back" the next year.
CRA NoA was therefore inaccurate, and Employer Letter of Income was to be utilized as basis on which support owing could be calculated.

FRO stated they are unable to action two paragraphs in the court order; rather they need precise $ amount(s) or percentages.

Anyone have insight if FRO may be able to make these calculations, or rather; is a Clarification of Court Order required?
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Old 08-11-2022, 12:48 PM
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Tayken Tayken is offline
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Originally Posted by kidsRworthit View Post
(SCJ ON) Court order recently received following submission of basket motion (consent).

Content: addresses child support overpayment (Jan. 2020 - present), with specific incomes to be used for child support calculations identifying basis of income to use for years 2018 & 2019 (Employer Letter of Income) specified in 2019 December court endorsement.

Why?: as a federal gov't employee, I was a victim of the Phoenix pay system and overpaid one year, while it was "clawed back" the next year.
CRA NoA was therefore inaccurate, and Employer Letter of Income was to be utilized as basis on which support owing could be calculated.

FRO stated they are unable to action two paragraphs in the court order; rather they need precise $ amount(s) or percentages.

Anyone have insight if FRO may be able to make these calculations, or rather; is a Clarification of Court Order required?
I would get a clarification from the court. Solves the problem. Painfully official and solves the problem. Probably faster to get a clarification from the judge.
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Old 08-11-2022, 04:40 PM
rockscan rockscan is offline
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Agree with Tayken. Unless you both agree to a statement of arrears to be filed with FRO.

FRO does not do anything unless they have a number amount. They dont even calculate percentages.
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Old 08-11-2022, 08:40 PM
terryfyde terryfyde is offline
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Originally Posted by kidsRworthit View Post

Content: addresses child support overpayment (Jan. 2020 - present), with specific incomes to be used for child support calculations identifying basis of income to use for years 2018 & 2019 (Employer Letter of Income) specified in 2019 December court endorsement.

If this is the term that was added to the court order then FRO is unable to action it. FRO requires both specific direction and wording for the order to be clear to them.



Google how to update a FRO order. The Government has guides on how to do it. For wording please review the link below:



wording here https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/r08182


I don't think the judges or whoever take on the responsibility for making sure the wording is right. They are not clerks but I think with the consent and approval of the judge you did get you may have prevented a future headache of disagreement.


The rules about if a current order has to be updated or can simply be superseded by a new order can be found here:
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/96f31


It is not rocket appliances, give it a go.
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Old 08-15-2022, 07:56 AM
kidsRworthit kidsRworthit is offline
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Originally Posted by Tayken View Post
I would get a clarification from the court. Solves the problem. Painfully official and solves the problem. Probably faster to get a clarification from the judge.
Thanks Tayken! - indeed I will submit a request for order clarification (along with re-submitting the specified Exhibits) and a spreadsheet identifying the FRO garnishment (year & month), what amount should have been deducted (based on child support owed references the Employer Letter of Income; and the net monthly overpayment.

Hopefully: by presently this information (with an exact child support overpayment dollar amount), a judge will provide this clarification request order; which FRO shall then action.

Note: recognizing the order from last week, FRO placed a "freeze" on enforcement of the initial 2018 Divorce Order (child support); pending receipt of a "new order" following the order from last week. (dollar amount)
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Old 08-15-2022, 08:00 AM
kidsRworthit kidsRworthit is offline
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Originally Posted by rockscan View Post
Agree with Tayken. Unless you both agree to a statement of arrears to be filed with FRO.

FRO does not do anything unless they have a number amount. They don�t even calculate percentages.
Thanks ROCKSCAN! - indeed I will submit a request for order clarification (along with re-submitting the specified Exhibits) and a spreadsheet identifying the FRO garnishment (year & month), what amount should have been deducted (based on child support owed references the Employer Letter of Income; and the net monthly overpayment.
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Old 08-15-2022, 08:31 AM
kidsRworthit kidsRworthit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terryfyde View Post
If this is the term that was added to the court order then FRO is unable to action it. FRO requires both specific direction and wording for the order to be clear to them.



Google how to update a FRO order. The Government has guides on how to do it. For wording please review the link below:



wording here https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/r08182




I don't think the judges or whoever take on the responsibility for making sure the wording is right. They are not clerks but I think with the consent and approval of the judge you did get you may have prevented a future headache of disagreement.


The rules about if a current order has to be updated or can simply be superseded by a new order can be found here:
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/96f31


It is not rocket appliances, give it a go.
Appreciated Terryfyde!

Interesting links: appreciated!

It's certainly prudent to be mindful of the scope of any entity's legal jurisdiction. (the links you referenced provide this context).

Takeaway: present legal documents (orders) to FRO in terms they are able to action = reduction of child support in $ amount...
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Old 08-15-2022, 09:35 AM
rockscan rockscan is offline
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Originally Posted by kidsRworthit View Post
Thanks ROCKSCAN! - indeed I will submit a request for order clarification (along with re-submitting the specified Exhibits) and a spreadsheet identifying the FRO garnishment (year & month), what amount should have been deducted (based on child support owed references the Employer Letter of Income; and the net monthly overpayment.

If they have already garnished the amounts and you are in an overpayment situation, you will need a set amount for them to collect each month. For instance if you overpaid $120 and your monthly support is $150, you need your order to say $140 per month until one year from the date. Then have a new line that says the amount after that.

It is difficult when it involves overpayments. If there is an underpayment. Make sure it says the amount you have to pay as arrears and then the monthly amount going forward.

It sounds complicated but when you put it in terms of the amounts to pay, it works.
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Old 08-15-2022, 10:54 AM
kidsRworthit kidsRworthit is offline
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Originally Posted by rockscan View Post
If they have already garnished the amounts and you are in an overpayment situation, you will need a set amount for them to collect each month. For instance if you overpaid $120 and your monthly support is $150, you need your order to say $140 per month until one year from the date. Then have a new line that says the amount after that.

It is difficult when it involves overpayments. If there is an underpayment. Make sure it says the amount you have to pay as arrears and then the monthly amount going forward.

It sounds complicated but when you put it in terms of the amounts to pay, it works.
Understood, and thanks. Address the "dynamic" payment issue (ongoing payment/overpayment).
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Old 08-15-2022, 12:05 PM
rockscan rockscan is offline
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Originally Posted by kidsRworthit View Post
Understood, and thanks. Address the "dynamic" payment issue (ongoing payment/overpayment).

For examplemy husbands support payments were out of date for four years due to court. In the settlement conference they calculated what they were supposed to be as well as what they would be set at for the remaining two years. His minutes of settlement said something along the lines of the respondent agrees to pay xyz by date related to an underpayment of support for the years abc. The respondent agrees to pay $$$ monthly for support of child until date or such time as kid is no longer a child of the marriage.

That way the underpayment was enforceable as was the monthly support.
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