Ottawa Divorce .com Forums


User CP

New posts

Advertising

  Ottawa Divorce .com Forums > Main Category > Divorce & Family Law

Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 07-30-2020, 04:00 PM
pinkHouses pinkHouses is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 138
pinkHouses has a little shameless behaviour in the past
Default Reneging on deals

My lawyer told me that I could not change my mind on something because he made a deal that I was aware of. He said that would be reneging and that is not allowed.

Later on the opposing counsel agreed to a general term of splitting all benefits for the children but when asked to draw up the clause refused and said they would not agree to it. I did not give anything up for that item they agreed to and it was at the end of negotiating. Now that reneged on item and and one other thing is holding up the whole agreement from being completed.

What is the binding and what can be reneged?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-31-2020, 02:17 PM
Janus's Avatar
Janus Janus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,497
Janus will become famous soon enoughJanus will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkHouses View Post
My lawyer told me that I could not change my mind on something because he made a deal that I was aware of. He said that would be reneging and that is not allowed.
I'm not really sure what happened here. My guess is that your lawyer made a deal with opposing counsel. It will make him look bad if you renege, so he does not want that. You of course can fire your lawyer at any point if you feel that he is not representing you adequately.

Quote:
Now that reneged on item and and one other thing is holding up the whole agreement from being completed.
Depending on the "one thing", it is quite reasonable that you might have to renegotiate an entire agreement. Just recently we had somebody who had agreed everything except the house... which of course meant that they had not agreed to anything.

Quote:
What is the binding and what can be reneged?
This one is easy!

Anything you signed: Binding

Anything you didn't sign: Not binding

I mean, some verbal contracts are upheld in courts, but as a general rule nothing counts until it has been signed.

Quote:
I don't understand
ok, the above quote is fake, but I felt like giving some examples.

A. You have a four way meeting. After 8 exhausting and expensive hours, you hammer out an agreement. The lawyers will write it up over the next few days. You hug, and go home to a celebratory dinner. The next day, your ex calls and says that she has changed her mind. Is the agreement binding?

B. You send an offer to settle with some ridiculous terms. You even said that you would give her your dog! Unexpectedly, she agrees to your offer to settle. You were not serious, you were just trying to make a point. Is the agreement binding?

C. Your ex will not let you see your kids unless you sign an agreement. You sign the agreement. Is the agreement binding?

One of the above is binding, one is not, and the last is tricky.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-31-2020, 03:33 PM
LovingDad1234 LovingDad1234 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 289
LovingDad1234 is on a distinguished road
Default

Oooo, Ooooo, I'll play!!

Scenario B is binding, as you signed your Offer to Settle with a witness. Even though you did not mean it, it was not revoked, and therefore still "live".

Scenario C is tricky, as even though you signed it, you did so under duress, and without ILA. A good lawyer can argue out of this one but it'll be coin toss on what judge does with argument.

Scenario A is not binding as it was just talk. I have experienced many times my ex say one thing, only to backpedal later.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-31-2020, 06:35 PM
pinkHouses pinkHouses is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 138
pinkHouses has a little shameless behaviour in the past
Default

Thank you Janus,

So to get this straight. This was part of a larger agreement.

My lawyer asked for something in lawyer letter.

The opposing lawyer said they talked to their client and they agreed to it, this too was done in a lawyer letter. There was no duress but I did ask that this be settled with the ex directly and in writing.

This was not verbal talk. So my lawyer telling me when the lawyers agree something it is binding was false?
It was not binding?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-31-2020, 09:52 PM
pinkHouses pinkHouses is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 138
pinkHouses has a little shameless behaviour in the past
Default

I found this:

https://eisenlaw.ca/2017/01/30/heads...tschyk-estate/

In this case the minutes of settlement were not signed but the judge found the agreement to be in place.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-01-2020, 04:31 PM
Janus's Avatar
Janus Janus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,497
Janus will become famous soon enoughJanus will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkHouses View Post
I found this:

https://eisenlaw.ca/2017/01/30/heads...tschyk-estate/

In this case the minutes of settlement were not signed but the judge found the agreement to be in place.
Well, one of the parties to the verbal settlement died.

Unless you are divorcing a corpsicle, you may find this precedent tricky to use.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-06-2020, 02:13 PM
LovingDad1234 LovingDad1234 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 289
LovingDad1234 is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janus View Post
A. You have a four way meeting. After 8 exhausting and expensive hours, you hammer out an agreement. The lawyers will write it up over the next few days. You hug, and go home to a celebratory dinner. The next day, your ex calls and says that she has changed her mind. Is the agreement binding?

B. You send an offer to settle with some ridiculous terms. You even said that you would give her your dog! Unexpectedly, she agrees to your offer to settle. You were not serious, you were just trying to make a point. Is the agreement binding?

C. Your ex will not let you see your kids unless you sign an agreement. You sign the agreement. Is the agreement binding?

One of the above is binding, one is not, and the last is tricky.
The suspense is killing me....did I guess correctly to the quiz?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-07-2020, 12:07 PM
Janus's Avatar
Janus Janus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,497
Janus will become famous soon enoughJanus will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingDad1234 View Post
The suspense is killing me....did I guess correctly to the quiz?
Well, obviously yes

I was not trying to be tricky, it was more of a format decision to illustrate my point.

If you freely sign something with independent legal advice, it is binding. Otherwise, it is not. Like all things legal, the preceding sentence is not 100% absolute, otherwise lawyers would be out of a job.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-07-2020, 05:26 PM
pinkHouses pinkHouses is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 138
pinkHouses has a little shameless behaviour in the past
Default

Here is another.

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/do...8onsc3944.html

This one was for a whole settlement agreement and was based on minutes of settlement being accepted. One party made the offer, then reneged saying that they did not sign it.

Verbal contracts count in many areas of law but even a written agreement between lawyers does not in Family Law unless it is signed.

So when the OC is reneging on deals is it good to demand a signed document for every piece of a negotiation or will a judge frown on that?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-08-2020, 02:50 PM
Janus's Avatar
Janus Janus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,497
Janus will become famous soon enoughJanus will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkHouses View Post
So when the OC is reneging on deals is it good to demand a signed document for every piece of a negotiation or will a judge frown on that?
You negotiate.

If you come to agreement, you sign the agreement, everybody goes home happy.

If you do not come to an agreement, nobody signs anything, and a judge makes a decision.

I don't get the difficulty here.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:32 PM.