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Divorce Law are a Joke and Dads are the Punch Line
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Lumpy:
I understand that, according to the law, most couples have a very clean and methodical breakup. Where the father decides to get a lawyer, he researches the law and knows exactly the very specific steps and hoops he has to take to insure that he has the same access as the mother, who is basically guaranteed custody by default barring very very specific circumstances. (drugs, abuse, neglect)
In reality it is rarely that way. My situation was kinda messed up because I decided that the marriage was over after the separation. The separation occurred because of a mental health issue and she had to live with her parents because they were the only people she felt peaceful with. The best thing for the children at that time was to go with her because her family could help take care of the kids as I was still working 55 hours a week to pay the bills. As time went on I knew that it was over.
I know, hindsight is 20-20 and I shouldn't have let them go with her durring the initial separation. I should have quit my job and applied for social assistance and kept them, I am sure that any judge would understand and not look down on me for it (the last part is dripping with sarcasm). They were 4 and 6 at the time, man they were so young.
Anyway, I was told that a 50-50 split from an eight hour distance would be nearly impossible. My experience with this lawyer was that he was trying to save me the expense of a lost cause, I am sure that if I searched around I would find one that would be more that happy to spend my money in court.
Originally posted by lumpy View PostWhat do you mean that mom only "allows" you to see your kids twice a year? Do you have any legal agreement? If not - Why?
On the other hand, I have to spend thousands to make sure I have the right representation to have access to my kids, how is this fair? Well, it's because most likely CP is the mother so the politicians are safe to enforce CS, enforcing access is against mothers witch is not exactly politically correct.
So indeed the system by default is against the fathers. My conclusion was that if we had an agency for support AND access, things would be more balanced... but it doesn't exactly buy votes so I don't expect it to change soon.
Originally posted by lumpy View PostI think that you are wrong. My husband shares 50-50 custody. He has had 50-50 custody since the day that he separated from mom.
Most fathers would love to have 50-50 access but if they apply for it and get it, they would have a hell of a time lowering their CS because they am a full time dad half the year. Being a full time mom she doesn't have to work because, being a full time mom is her contribution. If a father does the same thing, the court treats him like a deadbeat, especially if he tries to then equalize the payments. To me that is just gender bias plain and simple.
Originally posted by lumpy View PostTo Canor Elfman - I wish you and your kids the best of luck - and hopefully more time together.
Lost Father:
It's frustrating when my children get out of their mothers car at pick up time, and see my GF who just adores them, stop and say "oh, it's you, why id she here dad?". The STBX is just smiling away. Nothing I can do about it and she knows it. They come around after a few days but still annoying.
Originally posted by LostFather View Postnot even a return phone calls (50% of my calls are not returned)
She has her in dance classes most of the week and play dates on the weekends so if I call she is always busy. My son is five so I need her to keep him talking on the phone and reminding him what he did today.
Man, I don't know what to tell you. Your situation, although similar to mine, is way way worse. The only way to fix some of that is to have a specific agency that enforces access and will remove the children from one home to another with every bit of gusto that they enforce CS with. If they continually have to intervene then a more permanent solution, removing the children from the CP to the NCP, would be addressed. Just having that agency there would definitely smarten up some parents.
Originally posted by dadtotheend View PostOMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG I love you.
Thank you for posting that. You read my mind.
RIGHT ON!!!
Holly crap was this long. Thanks for reading everyone. Have a great weekend.
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What about the other side of the coin!
[quote=Ihave2kidsIcannotsee;19591]Originally posted by sasha1 View PostWith regard to the complaints about the SOL for subsequent children being impacted by paying child support for the previous-born children... OF COURSE the standard of living is less for those subsequent children! You don't just wipe the slate clean when you start a new family! It's not like scrapping an old car, buying a new one, and still having to pay insurance for the old one.. The children from the 'old' relationship still exist! The fact that financial support is needed for those children is well within the scope of one's knowledge when they decide to create more children.
Funny thing is when the parent that has the children re-marries he or she does not have to worry about having more children because he/she has an extra income coming in every month. The support system is unfair to the non custodial parent. If the custodial parent is remarried why are they not able to keep a roof over their heads and support the children. I think that the support payed to the other parent should be drastically reduced when the custodial parent remarries and any support given should be put in a trust for the children to have when they turn 21. There is so much injustice in family court that it sickens me to death and so many Women (sorry to be biased) are gold diggers.
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Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostI know, hindsight is 20-20 and I shouldn't have let them go with her durring the initial separation. I should have quit my job and applied for social assistance and kept them, I am sure that any judge would understand and not look down on me for it (the last part is dripping with sarcasm). They were 4 and 6 at the time, man they were so young. .
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostAnyway, I was told that a 50-50 split from an eight hour distance would be nearly impossible.
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostWe don't have an agreement because she refuses to sign one. I am trying to rectify that. But you miss my point: To get CS she only has to make a phone call and I have an entire government agency all over me. She doesn't have to go to court, the law states that I made a certain income, therefore I pay, simple..
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostOn the other hand, I have to spend thousands to make sure I have the right representation to have access to my kids, how is this fair? Well, it's because most likely CP is the mother so the politicians are safe to enforce CS, enforcing access is against mothers witch is not exactly politically correct..
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostYour husband did things right from the beginning, I congratulate his foresight but I think his case is very specific and very rare..
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostMost fathers would love to have 50-50 access but if they apply for it and get it, they would have a hell of a time lowering their CS because they am a full time dad half the year. Being a full time mom she doesn't have to work because, being a full time mom is her contribution.
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostI am taking her to court for access this spring. So I am not giving up, just frustrated that I have to go fight so hard for something that should be my right to begin with.
Originally posted by Canor Elfman View PostThis is filled with may too much emotion for me to comment on, in so far as to the topic at hand. If you didn't want me to comment you would have private messaged your friend, lover, whatever instead of posting it here.
I'm not trying to rain down on you, but you made some critical decisions and may not have been aware of the serious consequences that flowed from them. Now you and your kids have to live with them, or spend a lot of energy and $$ changing it.
Good luck.
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[quote=Canor Elfman;55151] you would have private messaged your friend, lover, whatever instead of posting it here. Not judging, just saying that this thread is a serious running commentary on the divorce law, not a thread on trying to score brownie points, no offense. But I digress.
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Just to clarify - Dadtotheend and I have never met. We are just 2 examples of families that have had success with the court system...
I think that if you read the history of our families, you will find that it hasn't always been easy and parts of it certainly weren't fair - but it has worked out fairly well so far. I can't believe that we are the minority - that being said, we are very likely the minority on this site!
Have a great weekend.
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Originally posted by lumpy View PostJust to clarify - Dadtotheend and I have never met. We are just 2 examples of families that have had success with the court system...
And then having the nerve to blame the system later on?
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Originally posted by dadtotheend View PostYou made a choice to prioritize a heavy workload. One of the consequences of that choice is giving primary care to the other parent. Another consequence that flows from that choice is child support.
Your choice to allow the status quo to develop has consequences. One of them is that is very tough to change a status quo - translation ---> $$$.
I'm not trying to rain down on you, but you made some critical decisions and may not have been aware of the serious consequences that flowed from them. Now you and your kids have to live with them, or spend a lot of energy and $$ changing it.
Good luck.
Often the debts are left for the ncp to pay. My lawyer recommended I file for bankruptcy when my divorce started. I am glad I didn't because I don't know if I could have lived with myself, and I am not sure what problems I may have faced if I did, but I had to live a very meager life, and things have not improved much, despite my drastically changed situation. I don't think it is fair to blame anyone for working to pay down debts, and I don't think it is fair to hold back changing to a shared parenting situation once the situation changes.
Australia changed their laws to permit parents to earn extra money to help get them back on their feet after divorce without this income being considered for support calculations. This situation is time limited to 2 years.( it may be 3yrs) But it seems to have helped. Why can't Canada do this too?
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Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostIn many cases it is not possible to see the outcome of certain actions.
Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostBecause what may have been good for all involved at one point in time should not be held against you when circumstances change.?
Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostHow many men just give up, or don't even bother in the first place?
Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostOften the debts are left for the ncp to pay.?
Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostI don't think it is fair to blame anyone for working to pay down debts, and I don't think it is fair to hold back changing to a shared parenting situation once the situation changes.
As to changing back to shared parenting, is it fair to the kids to have one parent choose to take a severely diminished role and then reappear again, after new routines are settled into? Maybe so, but if battling parents have to resort to courts that know next to nothing about the family dynamic, isn't it fair that the courts err on the side of not disrupting the children's routines? Status quo. Status quo.
Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostAustralia changed their laws to permit parents to earn extra money to help get them back on their feet after divorce without this income being considered for support calculations. This situation is time limited to 2 years.( it may be 3yrs) But it seems to have helped. Why can't Canada do this too?
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Yes there has been criticism of the Aussie system, and it looks like the new government will return family law to the dark ages, but they did make some very good changes that had helped, and should be a model for the rest of the world.
Family law is often all about money. Whoever has the kids gets the money, whether it be tax benefits, or support, often both. I don't think anyone can argue the support guidelines are fair, and the way they are enforced is not fair either. This is one area that needs a drastic overhaul because the current system harms children.
I agree that not trying to do anything to get a better role in your children's lives is unacceptable, but for many the road there is near vertical. If you are a novice skier you don't go down double black diamond runs, or you risk your life. For some court is the same. Why spend thousands of dollars that you don't have just to get a lawyer to go to court and lose?
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Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostFamily law is often all about money. Whoever has the kids gets the money, whether it be tax benefits, or support, often both.
Deadbeat Mom abandoned her kids and is living 3 provinces away. She won't work and so isn't paying CS (I have both children 100% of time) but she's "entitled" to, and collecting, SS.
Someone tell me that's fair, or that the money is following the kids.
Cheers!
Gary
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In my case I don't get any money either, as the ex refuses to work, and our judge has yet to impute an income, and I have been too broke recently to go back to court to get support dealt with. And I am having great problems getting the CCTB as well. They don't seem to accept just the court order showing I have custody, and have had to get letters and other documents to prove that the kids live with me, and now am just waiting for them to approve my claim.
There are also some ladies here who also don't see any money despite having the kids, and they too feel let down by our system.
But for the majority, whomever has the kids gets the money.
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Originally posted by rwm1273 View PostAnd I am having great problems getting the CCTB as well. They don't seem to accept just the court order showing I have custody, and have had to get letters and other documents to prove that the kids live with me, and now am just waiting for them to approve my claim.
I will guide you through the abyss, as it seems I'm exactly what you need.
PM me, I'm a tax accountant.
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so only men who had wives that stayed home can be successful? What about all the women who do work? Does this mean they do not contribute to their husbands sucess? Is it only moms that stay home that are recognized as contributing to their husbands sucess. What about all the wives who married a rich guy because they didn't want to work?
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