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  • leaving sleeping kids unsupervised

    So I was over at a friends apartment the other day visiting and the neighbor came over for a drink with us.

    The apartment is in a large house that has been converted to a 7 apartment complex. 3 upstairs, 3 main level, 2 basement apartments. My friend and the neighbor were both on the main level.

    The neighbor has 2 children, 3 and 5 years old. They were left unsupervised at the apartment down the hall while we visited together. We spent about 2 hours together while the children slept (9:30-11:30 pm).

    It kind of struck me as being completely wrong and that a parent should never leave their kids like that, even if you are in the same building, even if you go back down the hall and check on them once or twice. At least have a baby monitor or something.

    Furthermore it struck me as wrong that my friend thought it was completely acceptable and allowed the neighbor into the apartment knowing the situation.

    Just wanted to hear other peoples thoughts and opinions on this situation. Is my friend in the wrong? Is the neighbor doing something wrong? What would a social worker or child custody adviser do with this type of information?

    My train of thought is that if you can't hear your kid scream or cry even if you are just down the hall it is the same as leaving to go to the store to get smokes for 10 minutes.

  • #2
    This is a child protection matter. Call the children's aid society and get their opinion on the matter. You don't have to reveal your identity if that's a concern.

    It is my humble opinion as a mother that this scenerio is highly unacceptable. If socializing was of dire necessity then the parent could have hosted.

    The thing with accidents is that you never know when they're going to happen. Prevention is just common sense.

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    • #3
      Definitely he/she should never leave his/her kids unsupervised, ever.

      Sent from my SGH-I717D using Tapatalk

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      • #4
        Being a receiver of several false allegations of abuse, all closed as unfounded. So lets look at this from a purely technical issue.
        Setting aside my parenting beliefs and your parenting beliefs.

        Originally posted by Canadaguy View Post
        The apartment is in a large house that has been converted to a 7 apartment complex. 3 upstairs, 3 main level, 2 basement apartments. My friend and the neighbor were both on the main level
        This was at one time was a single large house. As such children would be left in a room to sleep and parents would be going back and forth to check on them. Yes it has now been separated into several apartments. But more than likely the walls between the apartments are not concrete as such more than likely are just regular walls. And as such more than likely the children would have been heard if the children were crying.

        Originally posted by Canadaguy View Post
        The neighbor has 2 children, 3 and 5 years old. They were left unsupervised at the apartment down the hall while we visited together. We spent about 2 hours together while the children slept (9:30-11:30 pm).

        It kind of struck me as being completely wrong and that a parent should never leave their kids like that, even if you are in the same building, even if you go back down the hall and check on them once or twice. At least have a baby monitor or something.
        Did the person have a baby monitor? Could they have had a baby monitor. Was a baby monitor necessary to hear the children. Perhaps they did have a baby monitor in their pocket.
        Did you inquire with your friend who live beside this person if they have ever heard the children cry at night, if they have then their is proof that the baby monitor is perhaps not necessary.
        You didn't comment on if your friends door was left open.

        Originally posted by Canadaguy View Post
        Furthermore it struck me as wrong that my friend thought it was completely acceptable and allowed the neighbor into the apartment knowing the situation.

        Just wanted to hear other peoples thoughts and opinions on this situation. Is my friend in the wrong? Is the neighbor doing something wrong? What would a social worker or child custody adviser do with this type of information?
        A CAS worker would come in and insist on questioning all the people in the house. This would no doubt cause the parent embarrassment. The CAS worker would at most caution parent that perhaps this isn't the best way to do things. But I don't believe they would engage in a protection proceeding over this sort of thing.
        Likely the result of the matter would be that the parent is forced because of the way the other people in the house now look at her to move.

        Originally posted by Canadaguy View Post
        My train of thought is that if you can't hear your kid scream or cry even if you are just down the hall it is the same as leaving to go to the store to get smokes for 10 minutes.
        No this is not the same thing, not by a long shot. The person has not left the property.

        My ex rents a house which has been converted into a main floor apartment, and a basement apartment. She works nights.
        A year ago a friend of hers moved into the basement apartment. While my ex was at work this friend would look after the children. This person also had a baby as well. So this person would be looking after two children upstairs sleeping, while she was looking after one baby (her's) sleeping downstairs. She would most likely be sleeping downstairs. This went on for the entire year she lived there. Yet these were separate apartments.
        Last edited by involveddad75; 03-26-2014, 11:25 AM. Reason: editting

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        • #5
          Originally posted by paco View Post
          Definitely he/she should never leave his/her kids unsupervised, ever.

          Sent from my SGH-I717D using Tapatalk
          But I think we have all done this at some point to some degree. Going outside for a smoke while the kid is sleeping or in the garage, taking a shower while the kid is watching TV, or even shoveling snow while the freezing kid is inside warming up. All difficult things to do as a single parent. Obviously age plays a role in these situations.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Canadaguy View Post
            But I think we have all done this at some point to some degree. Going outside for a smoke while the kid is sleeping or in the garage, taking a shower while the kid is watching TV, or even shoveling snow while the freezing kid is inside warming up. All difficult things to do as a single parent. Obviously age plays a role in these situations.
            that's different, taking a small "break" is not a problem, but leaving for about 2 hours and not going to check on them, even in the same building and considering their small age there is no excuse for that, that's my opinion.

            Sent from my SGH-I717D using Tapatalk

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            • #7
              Originally posted by involveddad75 View Post
              This was at one time was a single large house. As such children would be left in a room to sleep and parents would be going back and forth to check on them. Yes it has now been separated into several apartments. But more than likely the walls between the apartments are not concrete as such more than likely are just regular walls. And as such more than likely the children would have been heard if the children were crying.
              i like your thinking. I agree, it is a "house" and if parents are going to do such they should have at least a baby monitor and even leave the doors open. All good points to mitigate the risk of the children.


              Originally posted by involveddad75 View Post
              The CAS worker would at most caution parent that perhaps this isn't the best way to do things. But I don't believe they would engage in a protection proceeding over this sort of thing.
              I think so too. They would get a slap on the hand. It all depends how often they do it, are told not too and involved CAS is with the lives of the family already.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by paco View Post
                that's different, taking a small "break" is not a problem, but leaving for about 2 hours and not going to check on them, even in the same building and considering their small age there is no excuse for that, that's my opinion.

                Sent from my SGH-I717D using Tapatalk
                Be careful here Paco.
                Three things are clear. The person did go back and check on them twice.
                We don't know if the children could be heard if they were crying.
                We also don't know if the parent had a baby monitor or if one was necessary to hear the children.

                There are to many unknowns here to make a judgement. When that's the case it's best not to assume. Involving the CAS is like taking a jack hammer to hammer a finishing nail, while the parent is holding the nail.

                I'm not saying they were right or wrong here. I'm simply providing plausible proof of the children not being in danger.
                Last edited by involveddad75; 03-26-2014, 12:53 PM.

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                • #9
                  I feel the same way concerning this issue as I would about leaving children in a car seat while stopping at the convenience store ... chances are nothing bad will happen - but why take that risk in the first place? They may not be bad parents though if something were to happen CAS certainly would be involved. Maybe I'm a 'mother-hen' but I would never leave children that young without supervision regardless of the situation. If they were my friends, they would expect a 'talking-to' from me.
                  Last edited by Janibel; 03-26-2014, 01:25 PM. Reason: typo

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Canadaguy View Post
                    We spent about 2 hours together while the children slept (9:30-11:30 pm).

                    It kind of struck me as being completely wrong and that a parent should never leave their kids like that, even if you are in the same building, even if you go back down the hall and check on them once or twice. At least have a baby monitor or something.

                    Well if he checked on them then I apologize for that, from his statement above it doesn't clearly say that he did and that he had a good range baby monitor.
                    Like involveddad75 mentioned, don't assuming something that you're not sure about it, and most likely involving CAS in something like this it's huge.

                    Sent from my SGH-I717D using Tapatalk

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                    • #11
                      Back in the early 80's there weren't any baby monitors. I can recall having coffee with my neighbour out on the deck while both our kids were having naps in their respective bedrooms. We had the windows open so as to hear them if they were to wake up. Someone could have broken into the front door and taken my child. I was young and it would never have occurred to me at the time.

                      I'm sure parents who have had their children kidnapped, would in hindsight, wished someone would have made made a comment to them to not leave young children alone.

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                      • #12
                        The law states that you must protect your children. There is no proof that the children were not protected and nothing bad happened to them while the parent was in the other apartment. That should be key *nothing bad happened*.

                        I also like the critical analysis that at one time this was a large house.

                        Btw, do you realize your children along with 200 other kids play in a playground and climb on HIGH structures that have bars and moving parts and even slivers on them while at school all day and there are TWO teachers walking the play yard to supervise ALL THOSE KIDS! Hey, on the school bus they sit with 30-50 other kids while ONE bus driver drives a bus and can't pay attention to what the kids are doing because the bus driver is too busy driving the bus... and yes, I've gardened while my baby slept, and yes I've been outside. Hell I've even let them sleep in the car in the drive way while I went about my business in side the house.

                        It may not be what you would do. It may not be what I would do. But I think we are far too sensitive these days and many of us are helicopter parents.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Serene View Post
                          The law states that you must protect your children. There is no proof that the children were not protected and nothing bad happened to them while the parent was in the other apartment. That should be key *nothing bad happened*.

                          I also like the critical analysis that at one time this was a large house.

                          Btw, do you realize your children along with 200 other kids play in a playground and climb on HIGH structures that have bars and moving parts and even slivers on them while at school all day and there are TWO teachers walking the play yard to supervise ALL THOSE KIDS! Hey, on the school bus they sit with 30-50 other kids while ONE bus driver drives a bus and can't pay attention to what the kids are doing because the bus driver is too busy driving the bus... and yes, I've gardened while my baby slept, and yes I've been outside. Hell I've even let them sleep in the car in the drive way while I went about my business in side the house.

                          It may not be what you would do. It may not be what I would do. But I think we are far too sensitive these days and many of us are helicopter parents.
                          Well said completely sensible and realistic.

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                          • #14
                            Great discussion folks. I don't think there is a clear definite answer for this scenario, all I know is that for me I wouldn't be across the hall apartment without both a baby monitor and the doors open. That's just me, just the way I am. The monitor would mitigate potential risk.

                            If the child(ren) was older the potential for something to happen would be even less, hell my 4 year old knows how to get out of his bed and walk down the hall to my room on the other side of the house and climb into my bed. In actuality this is further then two neighboring apartments.

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                            • #15
                              My advice here is get CAS's opinion on the matter. Take that feedback back to your friend. Weigh out the pro's and cons of drinking while leaving kids unsupervised. Even if its in a converted house, the child protection ppl might see it a different way.

                              No harm in getting some professional advice. Open doors and baby monitors are a great idea.

                              Comment

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