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  • Thoughts, Comments concerns...all welcomed...

    This is an email that I just received from my Ex's wife..

    Can anyone shed some light or input so I can stop shaking??

    Hello,

    We have consulted a family law attorney in XYZ concerning some questions and concerns we have regarding our rights. They are as follows:

    1. Child Support: The current child support is based on NCP imputed salary as a XXX in Canada of $38,250.00, which sets his child support at $550.00 per month for two children. NCP is now a resident of the United States and his current rate of pay as a mover is $13 USD per hour. We are requesting the child support be based on 40 hours per week at $13 per hour, which is approximately $27,040.00 and would set the child support at $397.36 per month for two children per the Ontario Child Support Guidelines. As you know NCP's T4 from 2013 reveals that his salary was only $30,828.84 for that year, a copy of which is attached. We are attaching NCP's W-2’s (the U.S equivalent of the T4) from last year, which shows NCP made $7,973.89 for the year, due to the fact that he went through the landed immigrant program in the States and was restricted from working while he was in the program. We are not requesting support be based on his actual earnings, but on
    the potential salary of $13 per hour (the customary hourly wage for a XXX position in the United States) and 40 hours per week for future earnings. We are attaching a copy of two paystubs showing NCP's rate of pay.

    2. Extraordinary Expenses: Due to NCP's pay change we are requesting that all extraordinary expenses, such as daycare, medical and sports, be set at a 50/50 split instead of the current rate of NCP paying 60% and CP paying 40%.

    3. Meeting/Exchange Spot: Due to NCP’s residence of USA the current meeting spot of the XXX is 3 hours travel both ways for NCP, which is a total of 6 hours to pick the children up on Friday and 6 hours to return the boys up on Sunday, for a total of 12 hours travel per visitation weekend. We are requesting the meeting spot be changed to Hamilton, ON, which is a halfway point for both parents. If an agreement cannot be reached regarding a new meeting spot, we are within our rights to request that we go outside the child support guidelines and reduce the amount paid per month to compensate for travel expenses.

    4. Clothing: You have stated that we are to clothe the children when they are visiting with us. However, you are the custodial parent, meaning you have the children 90% of the time. Due to this, you are to provide clothes for the children when visiting with us. If you do not wish to provide clothing for the children then we request that we go outside the child support guidelines and reduce the amount paid per month to compensate for clothing expenses.

    5. Daycare: You have stated that you will be changing daycare providers and are uncertain as of yet as to who it will be. We are requesting that whichever option you choose, that the daycare provider email or fax us directly the agreement for child care. We are requesting a statement from the provider stating Name, Address, Payment Arrangement, and days to provide care for the children.

    Our attorney has advised us these requested changes are well within our rights under the laws of Canada. Please feel free to take our concerns to an attorney and have them reviewed in a consultation. If you are in agreement with the proposed changes then we can file a Consent to Change Motion. This will preclude having to involve attorneys, as we can file the Motion ourselves, thus saving both of us time and money.

    Thank you.

  • #2
    Ok So I don't have a lot of experience in this area but here are my thoughts anyway for what they are worth.

    1. It seems that dad is the one that chose to move. Therefore I do not believe that child support would be reduced to have access as he made the decision. I am not sure what the access arrangement is. It may be in child's best interest to try and come to some type of compromise for visitation meeting place but I don't believe in my experience that you would be forced to by a judge.

    2. Child support is an iffy one. Did he leave a job that was well paying to move to the US? What job prospects are there? Child support is his obligation. Courts might reduce his child support, they might not I have found it to be entirely up to the judge. I had to take a leave from work because my youngest was born very premature and ill, and spent months in hospital and we didn't know if she would live, and yet I couldn't get even a slight temporary reduction in child support. If you are comfortable coming to some arrangement for a slight decrease to make peace, or because you feel if you keep it high and he is in another country he just won't pay and it will be hard to get you can compromise but he isn't guaranteed to win.

    3. As for Daycare provider what is your custody situation? Sole or Joint? Are they helping with payments? It does seem reasonable to have information about the provider, I would let that one go if you don't have a strong reason not to.

    4. As for clothing, I was always responsible to provide my child with clothing when she was with me and mom had sole custody. However I have heard that it is the custodial parents responsibility. Is there a reason not to provide clothing? Such as clothing never comes back?

    It seems like they are just looking for any reason to reduce child support.

    Comment


    • #3
      "They" do not have rights. The father has rights and if he wishes to discuss them or any changes he wishes to make he can do so directly with you. She has no claim for anything and your agreement is not with her.

      She uses the holy "we", "us" and "our" in all of the scenarios aside from "his income", perhaps she wishes to be included on that as well by providing her income and paying CS on it?

      As well, any motions to change must be filed and heard in the jurisdiction where the children reside. Let "them" take it to a motion to change and "they" can pay "their" lawyer to travel to Canada to represent "them".

      1 - CS: why did he leave his position and take a lower paying job? If he left his job voluntarily for whatever reason - especially moving away - it is appropriate to keep CS payments at the imputed level.

      2 - Section 7 expenses, same as above.

      3 - Exchange location: if he moved, which it sounds like he did given the comments about landed immigrant etc, then too bad for him. Seeing his children should have been his main priority and figuring out how he was going to facilitate that BEFORE he decided to move away from them. You are not obligated to accommodate if he moved away, especially to another country.

      4 - Clothing - depends on the arrangements and travel. If he has her for extended periods and a large amount of clothing would be required then no, each parent should be providing for their own home. If it's a random weekend here and there, a backpack with a couple of changes of clothes could go with the kid provided it is returned. This is a bit of a challenge for forgotten items as his being in a different country forgotten items are not easily retrieved.

      5 - Daycare: Simply provide him with the name of the provider and receipts. That is all that is required. The daycare provider should not be put in the middle and will not appreciate it. The provider cannot be made to email/fax etc anything to them.

      "Our attorney has advised us these requested changes are well within our rights under the laws of Canada. Please feel free to take our concerns to an attorney and have them reviewed in a consultation. If you are in agreement with the proposed changes then we can file a Consent to Change Motion. This will preclude having to involve attorneys, as we can file the Motion ourselves, thus saving both of us time and money. "

      Yeah, they can't force use to consult an attorney either. You are within your rights to simply respond or refuse on your own. They can push it to a motion if they wish but again, it must be done within the jurisdiction the kids reside, and then you could consult an attorney if you felt you needed.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thoughts, Comments concerns...all welcomed...

        Can you give us a bit more detail? Why was the income imputed here? Why did he move? How was it getting s7 expenses paid before? Was there an issue with clothing? Was there an issue with access? How did you work the cs updates before or is this the first time its been done?

        Next you need to take a deep breath. If they had any "rights" you would have received a filed motion to change not a bullshit email. And dont mistake it, this is most definitely a bullshit email. I would NEVER email my partners ex EVER. What kind of a coward is this guy.

        Im going to take the really ugly side and tell you to file your agreement as is with FRO and tell them to get bent. Hes the one with the problem here. He needs to man up and fix it.

        Now, thats a mean approach and others here will say to try to work together for the sake of the kids but from my cheap seat it sounds like he took off and could give a rats ass about them. Everything is nickled and dimed. Or the evil step mother has taken control of him and is now picking a fight with you.

        Depending on what your answers to my questions are, I would respond with a simple thank you for the email but this issue is between EX HUSBANDS NAME and I.

        When he responds with a similar bullshit email you tell him you will be filing the current oder with FRO and he can bring a motion to change forward which you will respond to. (If he HAD to move for work then there may be a more reasonable response but I have a feeling Princess Buttercup here dictated that move because who leaves for a $13 an hour job?)

        And before anyone jumps all over me my partner reduced cs after losing his job, calculated what he was supposed to be paying when he was working and provided arrears. His ex filed with FRO which backfired since his income was the same in the order (seasonal work) and he is currently overpaying CS while looking for a better job. He refuses to leave the province to leave his kids, he refuses to take a crap job and he pays all access travel costs. This woman is full of crap.
        Last edited by rockscan; 03-27-2015, 09:41 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thoughts, Comments concerns...all welcomed...

          * and by refuses to take a crap job I mean hide from his responsibilities. Imputed incomes happen for a reason so what was he doing before he left for the states?

          I went back and read some of your other threads. In them you had expressed difficulty getting support paid as your ex moved to the US to be with his American wife. You also posted about difficulty with medical expenses. And then the access issues with him not exercising his time.

          Based on all this info Im going to reiterate my stance on FRO. Youve been reasonable for what sounds like at least six to eight months with someone who provided shifty income proof and then left the country. He made choices that directly impacted his obligations to his children and is now letting his new wife be his bulldog. File your order with FRO. When you get S7 expenses you files those with them too. Things will get ugly but only because hes trying to have his cake and eat it. He needs to fix this situation that HE created. If I were you I wouldnt even respond to the new wife. File your agreement with FRO and let them do the leg work for getting payments. Hes been jerking you around for way too long.
          Last edited by rockscan; 03-28-2015, 12:07 AM.

          Comment


          • #6
            What an interfering busybody. I would write back with a simple "Thank you for your thoughts, but the separation agreement about the children is between NAME-OF-EX and me."

            No need to panic. She wants you to panic and give in to their demands. Poor bossy new wife has a hubby who has to give all his money and some of hers away to his ex-wife and children! Sounds like she made him move to be with her, so she can support his financial obligations that fall out of that move.

            I imagine there was a reason his income was imputed in the first place? Him choosing to take a lower paying job after that is his own fault, and your children should not suffer for it. He chose to move farther from the kids? His choice (and hers!), and you and the children should not be affected by it, either by accepting less money in CS or taking on greater driving.

            About the only thing she has a point on is clothing. Yes, if you receive full table CS, buying all the clothes is technically your responsibility. If there is a problem with things not being returned, however, you can say that you have already provided clothing that they kept at their place. Otherwise, get some secondhand outfits and pack a little suitcase. Don't send anything you won't miss if it doesn't come back.

            If he's unhappy with how his move impacts his finances, he can move back and find a new job in his imputed field and support his children properly.

            Comment


            • #7
              my advice is simple - do not deal with anyone but your ex. Nice he has a slave to do all the dirty work for him. She is and will always be a shit stirrer in your relations with your ex. Best to get this straightened out from the get-go. As others have pointed about before, the legal matters don't have the skank's name on the papers therefore she's not party to anything. She shouldn't be butting her nose in here.

              I have spent the past 5 years dealing with my ex's g/f and it is not fun.

              Id get this matter sorted out before you go any further. Would save you much anxiety later throughout negotiations.

              Comment


              • #8
                Thank you all for your input. I haven't had a lot of experience with the courts, but I have been reading about the Family Laws that pertain to my situation. I was pretty sure that none of "their" concerns would be much for me to fret over, but when an email like this comes through it sends your brain spinning. This email was sent from His email address and She obviously wrote it. This is the response that I sent....

                I have had a chance to re-read this email, and I agree, these requested changes are well within you rights under the laws of Canada, However I am NOT in agreement with the proposed changes, thus you will be required to file a Motion to Change with the XYZ Courts. There is a court orderd agreement in place, and until it is changed in a court of Law, there will be no changes made. NCP is court ordered for $550 in child support, as well as 60% of S7 expenses. (the main one being daycare costs) I provided you an email on 03-23-15 with the break down of child care costs, along with arrears owed to the county of XYZ. I would expect that the support cheques provided going forward will reflect the cost adjustments. Since I have yet to receive a response on which child care provider would be NCP's first choice, I have enabled the care of ABC. She will be taking the boys before and after school, beginning the XXX Date. I have been able to negotiate her down to $75.00 per week, unitl the last day of school.

                Now let me clear up the daycare.....I had managed to secure subsidy for child care 3 years ago. We were paying $30 per week for care. This month subsidy was terminated due to my new marriage. The center that the children are currently in is $185/week. I attempted to find a home day care cheaper. Found a woman who offered $125.wk. then found a teenager daughter of a friend who is willing to do it for $75. As we have joint custody I sent an email giving him an option. The original posted email is the only response I have gotten back.

                To answer some of the questions above...
                -income was imputed because of a lack of financial disclosure. NCP claimed that he only made 3600.00 one year...however he managed to pay 5600.00 in cash for CS. Judge called bullshit on him and imputed the 38000.00.
                -the only reason I know of for the move was to be with new wife. Choice was for his own personal reasons, not employment.
                -S7 expenses being paid is like pulling teeth. took 3 months to get paid for dental bill for the children.
                -clothing was being sent, but would return stained, ripped, pants cut into shorts, ect.
                -the only issue with access is that he doesn't exercise his access time. he is entitled to EOW and has had that since 2010. When he chooses to see the children I comply, provide a letter for border crossing. Most weekends he doesn't show or sends email stating "I have to work"
                -this is the first time that CS has ever been addressed. I'm not one to try and milk him for money. When we were together I was told "if you ever leave me, I will quit my job and you will get nothing. Half of nothing is nothing" Our agreement has been in place since 2012.

                I have a question...."they" claim that he is now only making $13/h and based on a 40 hour week would make $27040.00 per year. that is in USD. If this goes to court would the judge not exchange the USD amount to CND and base support on the CND amount? It was "strongly suggested" to my via the judge that I not file with FRO as NCP was working under the table and that trying to collect from him via FRO would be more of a challenge. I have heard too many horror stories about FRO...however I am leaning toward FRO more and more as we go.

                Thank you again for your responses...and I apologize for the long posts.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I highly recommend that you go through FRO. He pays or he loses his passport and/or drivers license. When my ex and I first separated he was of course order to pay me Interim SS. All it took for me to register with MEP was a cheque in the g/f's handwriting along with a note in her handwriting requesting a receipt). The money in question was my money that my ex had absconded with at the time of separation.

                  IF you continue to receive emails where g/f is pretending to be your ex you can try this which worked well for me at a time when I really needed to know his intentions: tell your ex that you will only receive faxed communication from him in his handwriting - no emails.

                  Order was made in Canada and with Canadian currency so yes I believe there will be a conversion.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    It doesnt matter where he works or what he makes. You have an order with an imputed income imposed on him for lack of disclosure. Do you really think hes going to win points with a judge for taking off to the states? He has an obligation to pay the amount in the order. If he wants to reduce it the onus is on him to show why. Theyre trying to intimidate you into doing what they want. Im more convinced than ever that they did this because they have no leg to stand on.

                    File the order with FRO. From the sounds of it youre barely getting cs on time. Let him rack up the arrears and have all the problems he gets at the border.

                    I dont know what happens when you register but try to talk to someone about what happens to his border crossings and other issues going back and forth when he gets into arrears.

                    This is disgusting. We were told by our lawyer that if my partner wanted to reduce his cs he would have difficulty with it and to just wait until he started earning more. For him, having people think hes trying to shirk his responsibilities is his biggest upset. Your ex (and his wife) should be ashamed of themselves.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hello All,


                      I just wanted to thank you all again for the replies comments and thoughts to this post. You all managed to calm me down and validate what I already thought would be true. After sending the email response back to let "them" know that I am not in agreement with any of "their" requests, I have yet to receive a response! Go Figure! I do believe that it was just a scare tact....however I wouldn't be surprised to see papers served to me in the middles of Easter dinner. I will most definitely update if or when papers are served! Thank you all again.


                      On a side note, I do have an appointment with the local FLC to talk about having the court order registered through FRO.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        There are rules around service - including when, how and where you can be served.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by blinkandimgone View Post
                          There are rules around service - including when, how and where you can be served.


                          How so Blink? I know that he cannot serve me papers to begin the case, however can he not have me served at my home? or place of employment?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Google the serving process. Plus it might take him a while. Depending on when you sent the email he would have had to go back to his lawyer and get the process moving. Plus file all the paperwork. He works in the states right? Has to take time off and come here? Im thinking if hes been working on that, you may be safe over easter.

                            As I learned last week, your employer can refuse to have you go see him. Unless you work at the front door, you may be able to have a coworker refuse him. I tried to serve someone at their place of employment last week and was told they werent there even though the persons car was right in the parking lot.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              His Wife is a Paralegal, albeit in the US, however I am certain that this process is well underway. I'm actually looking forward to having papers served to me!! I can't wait to get in front of a judge and see how this all plays out! Call me crazy....but this should be a fun ride...that is also only if he has the balls to actually go through with it all! Is it wrong that I am now finding his requests comical?

                              Comment

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