Mediation! - what a disaster!

[ddol1]

Question I have out there - it has been 4 months seperation - under the same roof do to finances. She wanted the divorce, I am on disability - I depend on her. I began to learn, learn, learn while she played video games, played face book and asked what i think is grossly misinformed questions to lawyers on the phone. I went to the mediator last week to update him from the first meetings (we both only saw him once and we both agreed to put off mediation as we or I did not have a handle on finances and perhaps a handle on my emotions) so last week i went over what i found:

While I was sick "physical and a series of mental breakdowns over the last four years - a couple of surgeries, a ton of work by the docs, plenty of med changes and psyc help and i have returned to this world"........ Because of my issues i for the first time passed on taking the lead on our finances, taxes and the like - defuring this to my able wife. We had led a conservative life, we saved for rainy days and retirement - did this for 20+ years. When I had to leave the finances to my wife I worked on SAVING MY LIFE.

While I was sick my wife in 2007 pulled 37K in two months and played stock broker going crazy on buying, trading and in 2008 "lost it all in the markets".

I discovered that my work accident came with 9 years on WCB - money for pain, income and money to return to school.

I discovered that whatever money was saved - "the lawyer's observation was.... your wife lived off your disability and long term and short term she well bled you dry - now that you are dry she wants out" perhaps a bit harsh but she never really focused on getting a good paying job - she was happy working minum wage theought the agencies because she didn't have to do any stressful job interviews and no sticking her neck out into unknown territory.......... But the cash - it is but just about all gone.

There is more but the mediator knew what was our, my position last week. This week - well he looked at me like a piece of dirt, spoke to me like I was a greedy, selfish unreasonable "LAW quoting not lawyer idiot" and my wife......well spent most of it spitting out misinformed crap and denials. She has to pay up nothing and I am just well Stealing what ever life HER kids have left - if i get what is mine she is going to live in the streets with HER kids! (just in case by the way I am the dad - they are our kids and I have been a good DAD!)

So my wife has made little effort on her end to prepare for anything - she figured the mediator would fix everything. I put every ounce of energy i could muster on learning this divorce stuff - reading and posting here (been a greaat help!), rreading 20 times the Ontario Family Law act, the Ontario divorce act, spousal support guidelines (I have been on CPP disability since 2003) the child support guidelines, as recommended here a investment planner with at least some divorce experience, tried to read cases on CANLII and gosh even more.

The mediator's best statement was i should give all my work and research to my wife so she can bring my four months hard work to "her" attorney to well do what her attorney would be paid to do - convince her that my attorney is giving bad advice (at least that is what is in my at this point paranoid head!) I looked them both in the eye and just responded with "I will confer with my attorney before i do anything".

It has been going on for months now and it hasn't even started! I have medical issues and I will admit this hasn't made anything easier! My wife thinks i am a "^***^&@^(#!%!@&*%" my wife laid so much unsubstatiated bullshit yesterday my backside still hurts today - she said and thinks that she wants to have a retired lawyer mediate - I think it is all a waste of time. My wife accuses me of trying to rape her of whatever money she has left on lawyers and going to court and since i have been "working so darn very hard at finding every single penny I can from her and what isn't left of our marriage to screw her and OUR kids - I am lower than scum!" I have planned all along to go to court and I never PLanned on giving mediation a chance. If I wanted mediation to work I should have just done nothing, sat there whilr the mediator mediated me to death by what giving my wife my half or the rrsps the house and well left the rest in my head!

At the end of it, and he could have said this the week before, my claims regarding WCB and CPP and the issues of my wife "recklessly" depleting three quarters of our savings, my mom's death inheritance money (yes since I have medical issues all our marriage, my wife was made joint on all my affairs and it was really required many times, the last three years for sure and over the last twenty years - one fateful evening i had a work accident and 8 surgeries later, countless probing, picking, stabbing, prodding and other fun medical proceedures - I am in the fight for my life - I have no retirement plan aside form my rrsps - I won't even get a 50% stake in the CPP 65 retirement plan because i spent so many years not working (paying cpp premiums) while I was on full disability with WCB and then the last 8 on CPP disability - none of those years was I allowed to contribute - WCB took the money but they never made the deposits! (the way they work out your 90% after tax earnings includes what one would pay for CPP!) I am getting side tracked now.......

I figure the only option is court, have for a while. We actually are not a rich family but we scrimped and saved every penny we could for security of our family (notwithstanding my wife clearing out 85K out of the savings before saying divorce!). The lawyer says there are - I got confused - but so many steps before a judge, at least 8-10K in lawyers fees before i even get to see a judge on my case...... can any of this be right?????? Am I in a dream - a really bad dream?????

[Mess]

Don't diss the mediator. You have only seen the mediator together once, and you went back once again, this is not going through the process of mediation.

The mediator is not there to represent you or ensure you get your best interests. The mediator may or may not even try to broker a compromise, the mediatior should just let you and your ex negotiate and make sure you are both informed and each get an equal voice in the discussion. But sure as hell, don't complain because the mediator isn't taking your side, this isn't the mediator's job.

Most of what you write is irrelevant, I am sorry to say. If you spent your disability supporting your family, that is not something you are going to recover now. Your ex was working minimum wage or not working, you should have divorced 10 years ago, either that or you accept what she did and let it go. This is not about the past, this is about right now. Get that through your head.

Get it through your head or you are going to blow what little money you have on senseless litigation. The ONLY thing to your advantage is to settle out of court with an offer that is reasonable to both sides. Anything else will screw you over and you will be crying in your beer (one beer will be all you can afford) for the rest of your life.

You have assets, you split them evenly. If you don't have assets, keep it the hell out of negotiations because you are only wasting money.

You are on disability, you pay no support. She has no work history to apply for high paying work, she can only be expected to work for minimum wage. You are both screwed, I am sorry for that, but fighting each other will not put either of you ahead.

Let it all go, make a reasonable offer and get the hell out and live your life. Your life is not about her anymore, move on and forget it.

[ddol1]

Hi Mess,

I heard your words and yup I am stressed. I suppose it is part of it. Much of what was put on the table was actually after checking with the lawyer - checking what was or is our financials and I am aware that there is just a little bit on the edge - it is as the lawyer described "on the fence to where he has seen it go either way". (and I did tell the lawyer i was only interested in getting what is clearly my right and not spend the next five years making the lawyers rich.)

I or we luckily do have some assets - we own our house and we have (after this downturn maybe 140K in rrsps - good for my wife the day of seperation there was 160K). Oh and my wife finally got a very good job in 2009 - with the ontario government so her pay is real good and the benefits are well the best i have ever seen. It doesn't make us rich and it doesn't mean money grows on trees in the back yard. I realize in the end we both need to live, make it to 65 and then hopfully "afford" retirement. Not forgetting the second and third child who is still in college for the next couple of years.

But the mediator - which I didn't say first time was - he just stepped aside. No charge, no bill - he will only mediate simple financials (stuff in the house, who cares - straight cash and loans, credit card debt - and of course the rrsp's.) I think anyone could do a good fair down the middle settlement - just fairly split it down the middle and move on.

I know that in my case, taking so much and well dropping it in the garbage can still leaves a substantial amount left that is by rights belongs to me (there was still 20K plus in our tax free savings accounts - the new one that started a couple of years back). I know there was a lot more that could be mediated, as i have read so many times, start with the stuff you can agree on and build from there - that would be my biggest disappoiintment. I recognized what was happening at the get go and I tried very hard to get some simple stuff on the table....... like to help us come up with some better rules of living in seperation - in the same house. People still need to live with respect and without wondering what bomb is going to be dropped tonight.

I have tried to talk with my wife and sadly it has been an issue for a very long time - to really talk and not just about the weather. I realize that that is mine to bear - I have beeen getting help the last five years, real help. This started when I moved to Kingston and I was lucky to find a great GP and yes it was the choice of my wife alone to get help and I asked her for a very long time - but it was always her choice. In the end her choice was clear. It is for me, over.

I also understand the let go of it but how does one negotiate when the other side well refuses - not one bit. This is where the issue for me is - I have tried to get it - she is well nothing - no effort, no attempt at understanding anything - not even the financials. And in the simpliest form there is money to cover the things on the table and she will still walk away with 100K - maybe 125K. She is not getting "taken for every penny. But she has yet to even learn on her own, take the financials or any form of the financials and seek "proper" legal advice - even the free part of the first 30 -60 min.......

This is my frustration..................
and if you didn't get to read one of the last posts - my last post i think - thank you for the effort you have given these last few months - it is appreciated.

[ddol1]

So today (Sunday) has been a day that was not a good day to be me - been tryin to get to this..... but even in the gloom there is light! I just dropped my pen and well was disturbed on how I was trying to get down there with great difficulty to pick it up and my 11 year old mixed lab ran over to me and with great excitement to pick it up (without my asking) and almost.... 2nd try and we did it! First time ever she did this without my asking - I didn't even look at her! What does this have to with divorce? Raven is my best friend - she is beside me almost every minute of every day for the last 8 years and I get so much strength - i really don't know what i will do without her...... Thank you Raven!!!

Been listening to you guys (and some gals too!) so much I would not have known what to do so again many thank you all (and if I can figure out how to one day sit with you for a bit as we enjoy our gin and tonics - it would be my pleasure to buy you that one, two or.....:-))) Even if the doc says no alchohol!! (ok I just need to be careful)

The living arrangement is not good here - it is a small house with two adults, and three adult children - when our eldest returned home following a runaway stint, my son gave up his bedroom and now has the basement. There just isn't any other spaces in an open concept home. The best thing i could come up with is rolling a bunch of big towels and creating a divider on the queen size bed...... For this it is advantage me as i have had so many years practice zoning everything out as part of my pain coping methods - this is just another thing to block out - It bothers me ZERO. I do my thing, i got my heating pad, the towels make an excellent back prop and during my worst times i have my little mini dvd player that i use to break the pain cycle.

Living seperate - not an issue for me - My best spot is actually leaning over the railing just inside the garage on the landing and taking the pressure off my spine - slept many hours and nights standing there hunging the rail! I also made my "command Center" there with a platform and shelves, electricity, light, phone, heater - better than a standard desk! Since the last blowout two weeks ago - my divorce work is stored in my car's trunk and the keys stay with me.

The one challenge that I did not have (thanks to this group) was all the proof and documentation - I actually have it all - the deed, marriage certificate, 24 years worth of taxes (3 copied 100% - totals for the rest) the bank accounts and rrsps, mutual funds and the Bank Manager was indispensable - for the first time I understand and now do for myself my own banking, rrsp trades and he went to the nth degree by figuring how to get banking data all the way back to 1990 in some cases. This is what will prove where my disability money went back then - mostly into the rrsp's - along with the tax returns back to the 80's it shows where the money flowed no matter where it went, the house (which is that auto 50/50 by law), rrsp, car all the way up to the last 4 years when I was in the darkest period of my life when I had to depend on, trust and rely on my wife to continue with our investment plan and strategies that worked for us for 20 years.

I had no cause to question what she did and untill this divorce had no reason to question her integrity. My wife offered what she thought was good enough for the date of marriage and valuation - I got tired of showing her the ontario rules of full disclosure and the ensuing arguements so while she was at work i went thru every corner box and bag in the house and it was everywhere - and now it is "mine"!!!!

So i read "The List" and have read that several times since - things like the kid's info, our family's photographs - I took my fair chunk - made sure none were one time unique ones and tried to get the ones that had doubles(many) and she has all the negatives - but i would never have thought that and would never have gotten any with my wife's attitude that "everything of value today" is hers - pictures of my kids and family growing up this past 25 years are worth more than anything in the house.

I called legal aid (not available if you have RRSP's - or a house - or a newer car that can be sold). Mediation - you are right on - I went to the courthouse and the lady who helped me actually signed us up for mediation at the getgo I was truely surprized when I got the call for an appointment! This where I was so disappointed in the mediator and the good thing - it proved 100% where my wife's head is at. The one fair thing of the mediator was when he looked at me, almost had a breakdown right in his office - but he said he would only charge me $5 a session - in the end he charged me zero.

You are dead on with the mediator, she has been paying the bills - I have been rocking her boat the last few weeks - I took her off the car (I actually own both and both were insured under me - regardless the second one is promissed to my eldest who has paid her own money to keep it on the road and i am not giving up "my" car that all know is Dad's car...... even if my stbreallyx! isn't really happy about it. I use it to get to my doctor appointments and the two older kids will take it on occasion. The money - again you were right on. She pulled another $1900 out leaving $90 in there - with an electric bill due yesterday. I just got back from the bank - our line of credit is now frozen at Zero so there is no way I am going to have to deal with that too. Last part as i sign off - she left a few papers on the table and she made the move (changed her beneficiaries on Saturday - just after she took the last 1900 out) - I realize this is her right but I seem to see a pattern developing here!

Have more questions but that will wait - thanks for a good start - tomorrow I am off to find one of those recorder things!