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  • #16
    Thanks rockscan for the backstory. I guess a divorce never ends. I'm sure I'll end up in the same boat in a few years, the ex will want to reopen everything

    Really messed up that they want to go back to changing custody / visitation after 5 years when all was good and he definitely doesn't seem stable...

    Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post
    Sure tellme how you know about the disorders. ?? How did you negotiate with someone who has one? Or did you give in? Or go to trial.
    I'm currently dealing with someone that has BPD-like and NDP-like behavior (I am not a doctor so cannot provide an official diagnostic... ) and it's a nightmare. Google "BPD divorce" to give you an idea.. they say divorce with a BPD is hell without kids, and even worse with kids. Suicide threats, assaults, jail, emotional abuse to kids, ... There's even a book about it (splitting, by bill eddy)

    I used to fear going to court but realized that I had no other choice when I saw that I couldn't negotiate. She was saying that she made lots of compromise in the separation agreement but I don't think that I could find a single one. She wanted to specify where I could live (within <3km from the kids school, until they are done university) because she did not want to live too far from the kids. I realized that you cannot reason with these people and they absolutely want to win. I just hope it won't drag out for years.

    I've never seen my kids so relaxed. They sleep well. Eat well. Don't get angry as much. What a change it's been for them. I just hope that the court sees things the same way.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Selfrepmom View Post
      I’m so on the fence on this one. I don’t think dad is asking for a ton of time though, just EOW with one night a week? I would say let him have the extra time with his kids, with a condition that there is parenting counselling done. If, as the kids get older, they decide they really do hate dad, then so be it. At least the OP can never be accused of interfering in their relationship down the line. Basically, give him rope to hang himself if he wants it.


      I even offered Sunday nights to Monday morning at school. Nope. No bite. I’m not saying no to mid week. Just in weeks he has no access would be best. And then we are stuck trying to find activities that don’t coincide with that day now since dad refuses to take them to their activities. Even though OCL said their activities should not suffer because they are with dad. And I do not agree to week on week off in the summer. Several lawyers have told me in no way should gf be used as a babysitter. OCL told dad the same thing. Few hours here and there sure!! Not while he is at work. Specifically because of what Ocl witnessed and heard was going on.

      I know it’s hard when you are looking in. I get why some of the opinions are what they are. Thanks.


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      • #18
        Originally posted by gettingexpensive View Post

        Really messed up that they want to go back to changing custody / visitation after 5 years when all was good...
        It's not the case here- with Mom2Two- but in general, I think it's actually a good thing to have the possibility of changing parenting time (custody and access) as children grow older.

        Given your back story- I hope that your wife can get the help she needs- and your parents can have their mom in their life in a way that works for them...

        I wish it wasn't through a court process- but I think having the ability to look at custody and access would be a good thing at least every 2-3 years.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post
          I even offered Sunday nights to Monday morning at school. Nope. No bite. I’m not saying no to mid week. Just in weeks he has no access would be best. And then we are stuck trying to find activities that don’t coincide with that day now since dad refuses to take them to their activities. Even though OCL said their activities should not suffer because they are with dad. And I do not agree to week on week off in the summer. Several lawyers have told me in no way should gf be used as a babysitter. OCL told dad the same thing. Few hours here and there sure!! Not while he is at work. Specifically because of what Ocl witnessed and heard was going on.

          I know it’s hard when you are looking in. I get why some of the opinions are what they are. Thanks.


          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
          Yeah- I'm reading this and thinking - "fuck that noise"....it sounds like you're going ot have to gamble with playing chicken to trial.

          What's with his lawyer? Why are they not trying to find more common ground?

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post
            I even offered Sunday nights to Monday morning at school. Nope. No bite. I’m not saying no to mid week. Just in weeks he has no access would be best. And then we are stuck trying to find activities that don’t coincide with that day now since dad refuses to take them to their activities. Even though OCL said their activities should not suffer because they are with dad. And I do not agree to week on week off in the summer. Several lawyers have told me in no way should gf be used as a babysitter. OCL told dad the same thing. Few hours here and there sure!! Not while he is at work. Specifically because of what Ocl witnessed and heard was going on.

            I know it’s hard when you are looking in. I get why some of the opinions are what they are. Thanks.


            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

            So what actually started these proceedings?

            You had a mutually agreed upon, signed-with-lawyers agreement that was filed with the court 5ish years ago that saw you with sole custody? And then ex stopped paying previously mutually agreed expenses and so you filed to enforce s7/CS expenses? Or you also filed for sole custody at this time?

            I just really think in this case you can have your cake and eat a bit of it too. Give up joint in return for an order that he does the counselling. My ex is very similar to yours- never showed to any parent/teacher meetings, doctors appointments, refuses extra time etc. Stopped paying CS the same month he bought the gf her rock. I filed for CS, but Gave him joint custody right off the hop, which made him immediately drop some of his other ludicrous requests (50/50 after 3 years status quo). Guess who didn’t bother to show up to the latest dentist appointment? Mr. Newly-Appointed-Joint-Custody-Holder.

            Give up joint= get an order for parenting counselling for dad and kids (hello best interest of children!) and save $$$$ (hello again best interests of children!!)

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            • #21
              Originally posted by iona6656 View Post
              Yeah- I'm reading this and thinking - "fuck that noise"....it sounds like you're going ot have to gamble with playing chicken to trial.



              What's with his lawyer? Why are they not trying to find more common ground?


              Yes exactly Iona. I mean what lawyer would think it’s ok to offer 0$ in arrears when the Op says they owe $4500. ???


              She sat in on disclosure. She is a newbie. Called to the bar this past Year. Works under a big name. And my lawyer says she full on admitted she has a problem getting a hold of my ex and getting him to reason with anything. Everything we have requested in letters all ignored. He won’t even confirm his work hours after he reduced his income.

              It’s all been his way or nothing to talk about

              Also given how bad the OCL report makes him look to allow him to say he will endeavour to get help??

              They are also claiming he need to support gf kids. That’s in their brief. And that I should be divulging my partners income??

              When he actually filed for undue hardship then I will respond.

              How can he be hard up when he purchased a more expensive home all in his name. He proclaims he pay for 75% of the bills.

              He put $150 month towards children’s activities. Yet the kids told OCL he does nothing with them. Although they witness her kids packing for many fun things when it’s time to return them to me.

              Says out of the blue he now has benefits for the kids which he has never notified me of?

              I wonder if he had committed insurance fraud by submitting all the invoices I have sent him for therapy/ dental through his insurance after they have gone through mine?

              So I am afraid it will be game of chicken with the judge. I don’t see a judge increasing his time too much more than what I offered. Why now? Why all of a sudden? Why after I brought a motion to change to enforce Sect 7? Why now after the kids told of all the awful neglectful things he had done

              Sure if he showed/acted like he cared with actions. Sure he deserves more time and it could increase as they got older. This is no where near the case.



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              • #22
                OCL Recommendations

                Originally posted by Selfrepmom View Post
                So what actually started these proceedings?



                You had a mutually agreed upon, signed-with-lawyers agreement that was filed with the court 5ish years ago that saw you with sole custody? And then ex stopped paying previously mutually agreed expenses and so you filed to enforce s7/CS expenses? Or you also filed for sole custody at this time?



                I just really think in this case you can have your cake and eat a bit of it too. Give up joint in return for an order that he does the counselling. My ex is very similar to yours- never showed to any parent/teacher meetings, doctors appointments, refuses extra time etc. Stopped paying CS the same month he bought the gf her rock. I filed for CS, but Gave him joint custody right off the hop, which made him immediately drop some of his other ludicrous requests (50/50 after 3 years status quo). Guess who didn’t bother to show up to the latest dentist appointment? Mr. Newly-Appointed-Joint-Custody-Holder.



                Give up joint= get an order for parenting counselling for dad and kids (hello best interest of children!) and save $$$$ (hello again best interests of children!!)


                I totally get what your saying. I really do.

                And the part about how it started. You are correct. Except I only filed to get his share of expenses he agreed to. Actually I only asked for half. Even though agreement says proportionate.

                Say I agree to joint??? I would bet my life on it he still wouldn’t trade off anything. That’s how they work. I agree that the custody part is none issue. Except he doesn’t give an inch. I have given lots. Even in the last hear of litigation. He has had way more access then the agreement states. He has given me nothing in return. No compromise on anything.

                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                Last edited by Mom 2 Two; 05-29-2019, 12:07 PM.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by iona6656 View Post
                  It's not the case here- with Mom2Two- but in general, I think it's actually a good thing to have the possibility of changing parenting time (custody and access) as children grow older.

                  Given your back story- I hope that your wife can get the help she needs- and your parents can have their mom in their life in a way that works for them...

                  I wish it wasn't through a court process- but I think having the ability to look at custody and access would be a good thing at least every 2-3 years.
                  I fully agree. I'd even like something generic in my agreement, no fixed days because if she's not doing well that day, I don't want the kids visiting her. They come back wrecked and I have to fix the damage. Ideally, I'd like to have a clause that says "no more than 40%" that way I still maintain control for when she goes downhill. It would allow the kids to see their mom a bit more on the weeks she is doing good.

                  One significant issue is that borderline mothers think that they are the best parent... and don't realize their negative behavior. There's also a book about it..
                  https://www.amazon.com/Understanding...=UTF8&qid=&sr=
                  Soooo much manipulation with them. They even manipulate the kids. And forget what they've done the next day so they expect you to forget as well. It's sad.

                  On the bright side I'm getting old which means that my kids are getting old as well.. in a few years they'll do what they want.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post

                    Say I agree to joint??? I would bet my life on it he still wouldn’t trade off anything. That’s how they work. I agree that the custody part is none issue. Except he doesn’t give an inch. I have given lots.
                    That’s the catch. Make the order non-severable. Offer up joint ONLY if he consents to parent/child counselling. If he says no to counselling, you say forget joint. You yourself agree that the custody part is a non issue, so why not hand it over if it means repairing your kids relationship with their dad.

                    I get the “screw him” attitude, but at this point it isn’t about him. It’s about your kids. Do everything in your power to make sure he can be an active, healthy, and supportive influence in their lives. Then at the end of the day, when they are 16/17/18 and they come to you and say “mom this guy is still a fucking prick”, you wipe your hands clean, knowing that you did everything you could for your kids (not for him, for your kids)

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Selfrepmom View Post
                      That’s the catch. Make the order non-severable. Offer up joint ONLY if he consents to parent/child counselling. If he says no to counselling, you say forget joint. You yourself agree that the custody part is a non issue, so why not hand it over if it means repairing your kids relationship with their dad.



                      I get the “screw him” attitude, but at this point it isn’t about him. It’s about your kids. Do everything in your power to make sure he can be an active, healthy, and supportive influence in their lives. Then at the end of the day, when they are 16/17/18 and they come to you and say “mom this guy is still a fucking prick”, you wipe your hands clean, knowing that you did everything you could for your kids (not for him, for your kids)


                      Some serious things to consider/think about. Thanks.


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