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  • #31
    Originally posted by arabian View Post
    I'm honestly gobsmacked here.

    I, for one, am not about to waste my time giving advice to people who are so adept at abusing the system. There are many, many people out there who genuinely need legal advice. I am stunned that you actually have access to a lawyer.

    I will continue to go in in life and give money to charity knowing that it helps the children of people like you. Very, very sad. You are living in a "welfare mentality" and raising children to go through life expecting everyone else to look after them. Take some basic parenting courses. Learn how to budget your expenses. Try not to sleep around indiscriminately. You should be able to support every child you bring into the world yourself. Relying on a bunch a losers for the rest of your life is simply stupid.

    If you want to go on a forum which is called "Ottawa Divorce Forum" you had better toughen up. If you want sympathy get a dog or access some of that wonderful free counselling.

    You get absolutely no sympathy from me.

    Listen lady, you are absolutely crazy. I am not on welfare, I am in the military and work my butt off so idiots like you can stay safe.

    I don't need sympathy, I need advice.

    So STOP posting anything on my posts. You are crazy, and really wish you would finish off that bottle of gin and go to bed. You actually don't even make sense, so stop posting back, go away!

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Nadia View Post
      I can empathize that you feel frustrated because it is very difficult to make ends meet when you have a family of 5 kids and are on a limited budget.

      But the posters here are trying to ask you some "hard" questions that ultimately will be asked when and if you decide to proceed on this claim of undue hardship. They would not be doing you any favors if they only told you what you wanted to hear. Try and not take it personally, they don't know you or your situation as well as you do. They are only responding to the information you are presenting and the way in which you are presenting it. Use their responses to better frame your own argument.
      Hi Nadia,

      Thank you!

      That is all I wanted, somebody to talk to me with respect.

      I don't expect anybody to agree to agree. I have been in court before and have never heard a judge talk to somebody the way some of these people have tonight. Either way I just wanted some advice, not a body slamming session. I should have started off saying I was new to this site, but I just had never done this before, and have never dealt with so many crazies in one night.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Tayken View Post
        11,000 legal bill for a lot of people is quite low. So don't expect too many people to be "boo hoo" about your legal costs. There is a member of this forum who is self represented who has gotten a cost award against another party for much more. So imagine if his time valued at $100 and hour was put into lawyer costs of 265-500 an hour.





        How many days/weeks/months/years ago was that? You went to court and didn't get costs awarded against the other party. 11,000 lesson learned?



        FYI: This is not a qualification guide. As stated by the guide:



        So I would really not use it as a "test" to prove anything.



        Based on your personal belief. The question is if you can provide the cogent and relevant evidence to the fact in support of your belief that convinces a judge that there is a material change in circumstance and that undue hardship should be considered.



        Obviously the client/lawyer relationship suffers similar issues to the poster/responder relationship demonstrated on this site.



        And you are under "undue hardship". I wouldn't put that statement into your affidavit when filing unless you want to have a judge toss it across the court room and order costs against you for even dragging the other parent back into court.



        So, you lost 2,000 so one could only assume that you have a monthly income HIGHER than 2,000 a month. Sorry to say there are parents on this forum who would probably like to have the income monthly to loose 2000 and make ends meet incredibly well with less. So don't expect too much sympathy here in my opinion.



        Household incomes. Clearly you don't understand what you are reading. The court will need FULL AND FRANK financial disclosure from all parties of both households. So your income + his income would be what is considered. Including whatever child support you get for the other 3 kids?



        Don't go to court looking for justice... Especially in family law matters. It is all about the best interests of the child. Clearly it was ordered at trial that the best interests of the child were best served by the other parent. Claiming undue hardship after the fact isn't going to win you any favour with the court or make re-opening the custody issues possible.

        Good Luck!
        Tayken

        Hi Tayken,

        1. I don't think I am asking for sympathy, but I would give it to anybody that went through this. I know people that have spent so much more than we did, I feel bad if somebody spent $500. It is just so unnecessary. I'm upset that we spent $11,000 on a bad lawyer, and that my step-son didn't get what he wanted and what he had to go through.

        2. I didn't try to get my costs awarded against the other party, it happened in May. I feel we are responsible for our legal fees and his ex is responsible for hers. Maybe i'm not catching what you are saying.

        3. I earlier corrected myself, saying "step" not "test". Yes, you are right, it is really only a starting point, just because a person "passes" the "steps" does not mean they will get a reduction, I get that.

        4. Yes, I do think (as well as on the advice of a few lawyers) that we qualify to have a judge to review our case and make a decision. I do realize it depends on the judge's beliefs.

        5. Thank you, I appreciate your advice in telling me not to put "undue" hardship in my affidavit, that helps me.

        6. My income is not much more than $2000 a month, after taxes, etc. I am not asking for sympathy, condolences, hugs or pats on the back, I am asking for advice. Something I would give in a heartbeat if I felt it would contribute in a positive way.

        Also, approximately half of my income goes to the government. I don't feel bad about how much I make, I worked my $ss off to do it. I was a single mother who joined the military. It was not easy, but I did what I had to do to put food on my children's plates. Nothing has been handed to me, ever. I expect any parent to pull their weight, it shouldn't just be one parent footing the bill, it takes two to make a child. I'm so tired of the poor single mother routine. I used to make less than $19,000, supporting two children, but I made the choice to do better.

        7. I realize my income, my husband's, his ex and her bf will all come into play, even the cs I receive. I have run the numbers, and I had a lawyer run the numbers, btw, the lawyer was shocked with the results. Our standard of living is much lower than theirs. I do understand undue hardship.

        8. No, I am sorry, I don't agree. My step son had a social worker, as soon as I talked to her I knew she was for the mother. It didn't matter what my step son wanted, and the social worker said that. My step son is left alone on Friday nights so mommy can go drinking. He wears sneakers that are falling apart and clothes that don't fit. The first four years of that child's life, his mother was out drinking and didn't come home on the weekends, and through the week she was recovering. His mother's bf was charged and plead guilty to having a controlled substance. It didn't matter, that poor boy's best interests were not considered. His mother has never held a job for longer than a year and a half, she is 35 years old. My husband has had the same job for over 13 years. The judge didn't make the decision, the social worker did, but our lawyer told us that the judge would most likely side with the social worker and all we would do is pay more money. Our lawyer recommended we don't go to trial. There is no justice, I already know that.

        Comment


        • #34
          I can't help but imagine that one of these days, my ex's wife (who has 2 kids w/him) will be on here singing the same song as the OP.

          Just curious: (I didn't see it anywhere) - how old is the son, for whom your ex is paying CS?

          Also: how is it that you "know" what his ex does on Friday night's and that she spends the entire week recuperating?

          Torn shoes, left alone for entire weekends, boozing and laying around and the CAS / Social Worker ignored that???

          Taking it all w/a big grain of salt. My ex has told his wife (who does NOT know me personally/at all) ALL kinds of bizarre things about me. All LIES. One day the dumb bitch will realize it too. For now, she can believe whatever floats her boat. The Reality Check is coming.

          On a different note: I cannot relate at all to having 4 or 5 kids to look after. One is enough for me, and after the hell I've been through, it is very difficult to make ends meet.

          Comment


          • #35
            OK - thanks for keeping me safe! From what?????

            Military has good psychological resources that all enlisted personnel are encouraged to use. I believe enlisted members have free health benefits as well - read between the lines.

            Ok I'm sure your lot in life isn't easy. But you have to admit when you are in your 30's and your spewing off about "your lawyer" and all the kids in your life it leaves us to wonder really what you're made of.

            Many hard working, honest, non-breeding people on this site would do anything to have a lawyer represent them for just 10 minutes in court - they would do all the background work. For you, the "military girl" it's a given I guess. You can access next-to-free legal services (cause if you're only making a few g's a month you're not paying the going rate) at a whim.

            Hard to take you seriously, really.

            If calling me a gin toting lady is all you got in your ammo - god help us who rely on the military to protect us! LOL Toughen up eh?

            Comment


            • #36
              Also love the OP's priorities - she has money for a lawyer but scrimps on the kids. Give me a break.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by arabian View Post
                OK - thanks for keeping me safe! From what?????

                Military has good psychological resources that all enlisted personnel are encouraged to use. I believe enlisted members have free health benefits as well - read between the lines.

                Ok I'm sure your lot in life isn't easy. But you have to admit when you are in your 30's and your spewing off about "your lawyer" and all the kids in your life it leaves us to wonder really what you're made of.

                Many hard working, honest, non-breeding people on this site would do anything to have a lawyer represent them for just 10 minutes in court - they would do all the background work. For you, the "military girl" it's a given I guess. You can access next-to-free legal services (cause if you're only making a few g's a month you're not paying the going rate) at a whim.

                Hard to take you seriously, really.



                If calling me a gin toting lady is all you got in your ammo - god help us who rely on the military to protect us! LOL Toughen up eh?
                So i'm not sure you know how much I paid for a lawyer, but I would like that discount you are talking about now.

                Oh, and the next ice storm, or whatever issue that comes up, PLEASE, PLEASE provide me with your address so that I can make sure we skip coming to your aid. Trust me, I wish I had that much authority.

                Listen, I have made less than $19,000 a year, and guess what, I still PAID for a lawyer when I went through my divorce. I was told I made to much for legal aid. If somebody wants a lawyer for ten minutes, and can't afford it, then they will have to start getting creative. Like say, maybe going to their community for some advice, not a personal attack from some crazy lady.

                If you are not going to be helpful then go away. I can't help what has happened in your past so don't go on blaming the world for what is going on in your personal life. If you are miserable, fine, just be miserable by yourself. I'm sorry your husband left you and you feel he owes you something, but at some point you will have to start taking care of yourself and get over it.

                Oh, and my "breeding" and you say in such a classy way, they will all be contributing members of society. I have a 19 year old son that is just starting university, and another to follow in a couple of years. My children will work for everything that I have had to work for and give back to Canada the way that I have. So please, get some help, and try and enjoy what's left of your little life.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by arabian View Post
                  Also love the OP's priorities - she has money for a lawyer but scrimps on the kids. Give me a break.

                  Do you even read before you post?? It makes you look like an idiot.

                  I don't scrimp on my kids, his ex does. I scrimp on myself to make sure my kids have everything they need.

                  Again, for the umpteenth time, go away. Maybe I will start to miss you if you just give me a chance! I bet you heard that before!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by hadenough View Post
                    I can't help but imagine that one of these days, my ex's wife (who has 2 kids w/him) will be on here singing the same song as the OP.

                    Just curious: (I didn't see it anywhere) - how old is the son, for whom your ex is paying CS?

                    Also: how is it that you "know" what his ex does on Friday night's and that she spends the entire week recuperating?

                    Torn shoes, left alone for entire weekends, boozing and laying around and the CAS / Social Worker ignored that???

                    Taking it all w/a big grain of salt. My ex has told his wife (who does NOT know me personally/at all) ALL kinds of bizarre things about me. All LIES. One day the dumb bitch will realize it too. For now, she can believe whatever floats her boat. The Reality Check is coming.

                    On a different note: I cannot relate at all to having 4 or 5 kids to look after. One is enough for me, and after the hell I've been through, it is very difficult to make ends meet.

                    Please people, try and put yourself in somebody else's shoes, and think before you speak.

                    The son is 12, not sure the relevance, but there you have it.

                    My husband and his ex lived together off and on for 5 years. After the child was about 2 months old she started the partying, my husband stayed for the child's sake. Since then his son has complained about how is mother will go on FB, or whatever site and hook up a babysitter for the night, sounds safe to me?? Also, I was there when she called my ex (their son was ten) and she wanted to leave their son home alone on a Friday night so she could go to a bar. I personally find that jaw dropping. I wouldn't leave my ten year old home alone to go get pizza, let alone go boozing it up. I also have emails from his ex to me admitting to her drug/alcohol use. All this didn't matter to the social worker her son had though. I actually have pictures of the shoes, my husband's mother was the one that went to visit him and noticed it. The poor child's pants usually pitch him at the waist. I buy him new clothes and she just sells them on a buy/sell site. It is frustrating to say the least.

                    I understand that people lie about their ex's, I am lucky I have never had that problem with my ex, we get along. Unfortunately, I have seen first hand what his ex does, and I know people that know her and of her, it is always the same stories with this girl. And maybe something really bad happened to her as a child, but still no excuse when you have to parent a child.

                    So please, before you pre-judge because of your own experience, just remember, everybody is not your ex. I'm sure you are a great mother, and take care of your child, but not every mother/father does, and I believe in accountability.

                    Tbh, this post really wasn't about anybody's parenting skills though, it was about undue hardship.

                    And yes, I have 5 children (which I shouldn't be judged in a negative way for, but people are. Shame on them), my first is 19, then 16, 12 (my step-son) then 2 1/5 and ten months. It gets crazy but I wouldn't have it any other way. I love them all to pieces. I just feel that they should all be treated fairly, in every way.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Why isnt CAS involved??How is the child doing at school?Is he showing any behavioural problems?How has he been doing all these years?If you want the child to have clothes why not buy them at Value Village-that way it doesn't look like you are trying to buy the sons affection and the mother more than likely wouldn't sell the clothes.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Unevenplayingground View Post
                        Listen lady, you are absolutely crazy. I am not on welfare, I am in the military and work my butt off so idiots like you can stay safe.
                        Conscription does not exist in Canada and you chose to do this job. Could you please provide the particulars as to what work you do "so idiots like you" (arabian) can stay safe?

                        Originally posted by Unevenplayingground View Post
                        I don't need sympathy, I need advice.
                        Based on the patterns of behavior and conflict you are creating through negative comments, limited "evidence" your are able to present regarding "undue hardship", the emotional tone to your messages, controlling requests (see quote below) against other posters on a public forum, and finally claims of "undue hardship" from the comments made by others...

                        Advice:

                        You have very little chance to be successful with an "undue hardship" claim before the court. This is in consideration to your already having gone to trial unsuccessfully, the emotionality of the arguments you present which are not grounded in logic, ration, reason or cogent and relevant evidence.

                        Further advice:

                        If you want help seek out a qualified Family Law Lawyer. Listen to what they tell you. Don't shop for one who will do what you want. If 5 lawyers say it is a bad idea and the 6th lawyer says "sure" you really need to think if they are just looking for an opportunity to make money. Weigh why 5 lawyers out of 6 advise otherwise prior to bringing forward your action in court.

                        Originally posted by Unevenplayingground View Post
                        So STOP posting anything on my posts. You are crazy, and really wish you would finish off that bottle of gin and go to bed. You actually don't even make sense, so stop posting back, go away!
                        This is a very controlling request and potentially demonstrates a highly conflicted pattern of behaviour/thinking. You should re-read your own statement made against the person in question prior to posting it.

                        It is highly emotional and in a very negative tone. You associate the person to being an alcoholic without any evidence to the fact. Having read hundreds of posts by the poster in question... Alcohol has never been an issue with regards to this issue nor have I read that they have a substance abuse problem. To draw this conclusion and make this statement is a far reach and not going to win you any favor or prove your point.

                        Good Luck!
                        Tayken

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by murphyslaw View Post
                          Why isnt CAS involved??How is the child doing at school?Is he showing any behavioural problems?How has he been doing all these years?If you want the child to have clothes why not buy them at Value Village-that way it doesn't look like you are trying to buy the sons affection and the mother more than likely wouldn't sell the clothes.
                          Because false allegations get you nowhere with these organizations generally... False allegations don't even get you sympathy on a public message board... For the same reasons and points you are making in a very logical pattern.

                          As always, murphyslaw, your logical rational and reasonable focus on the cogent and relevant evidence to the allegations made by a poster makes me smile.

                          One would also question why the OP continues to post in such a hostile manner. It may be that this whole "story" is untrue. The inconsistencies in the responses are starting to show through.

                          The conflict rating scale on the ratio of request for help to response in a negative tone by this poster is off the charts and similar to that of other highly conflicted posters which have graced this board with their presence. A resourceful person would just stop bothering where by a highly conflicted person who is unable to manage their internal up-setters will continue the fight.

                          A good example of this pattern of behaviour as persisted on this site can be found in these threads which this thread is demonstrating as well:

                          http://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/f...isputes-10638/

                          http://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/f...-access-11615/

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by murphyslaw View Post
                            Why isnt CAS involved??How is the child doing at school?Is he showing any behavioural problems?How has he been doing all these years?If you want the child to have clothes why not buy them at Value Village-that way it doesn't look like you are trying to buy the sons affection and the mother more than likely wouldn't sell the clothes.

                            Yes, the child has had a lot of problems with being bullied over the years. You can tell pretty quickly that he is a sensitive child. Do me a favour, google the age a child can be left alone without parental visitation, and if you find a firm answer on that please let me know. Even the child's social worker had nothing to say on that.

                            You know when you hear in the news that a child has been abused and dies as a result? This is why. CAS is a joke.

                            What I started doing in terms of the clothes is giving my step-son all of his old clothes. They are always in good repair, a touch to big, but I would rather that than his belly being pinched off by clothes that are 2 sizes to small for him.

                            Please know that I told the social worker everything, I do not embellish, or make it sound worse, I tell exactly what it is. None of it mattered, and trust me, living every day knowing is very painful. I may only be his stepmother, but it doesn't matter who he is, my heart breaks when I hear about stuff like this happening.

                            And I should amplify what I said, I don't think my step-son is going to die as a result, I don't think the mother physically abuses him. I am grateful that he is now 12 years old and he is a very smart boy that would now tell us if something was going on. The big issue is being in a position to do something to help him. The social worker made it very clear that his son cannot decide where he wants to live. She advised us that she was dealing with a case where the child was 17 and still could not make the decision on where they could live. The system is not all about the children.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Tayken View Post
                              Conscription does not exist in Canada and you chose to do this job. Could you please provide the particulars as to what work you do "so idiots like you" (arabian) can stay safe?



                              Based on the patterns of behavior and conflict you are creating through negative comments, limited "evidence" your are able to present regarding "undue hardship", the emotional tone to your messages, controlling requests (see quote below) against other posters on a public forum, and finally claims of "undue hardship" from the comments made by others...

                              Advice:

                              You have very little chance to be successful with an "undue hardship" claim before the court. This is in consideration to your already having gone to trial unsuccessfully, the emotionality of the arguments you present which are not grounded in logic, ration, reason or cogent and relevant evidence.

                              Further advice:

                              If you want help seek out a qualified Family Law Lawyer. Listen to what they tell you. Don't shop for one who will do what you want. If 5 lawyers say it is a bad idea and the 6th lawyer says "sure" you really need to think if they are just looking for an opportunity to make money. Weigh why 5 lawyers out of 6 advise otherwise prior to bringing forward your action in court.



                              This is a very controlling request and potentially demonstrates a highly conflicted pattern of behaviour/thinking. You should re-read your own statement made against the person in question prior to posting it.

                              It is highly emotional and in a very negative tone. You associate the person to being an alcoholic without any evidence to the fact. Having read hundreds of posts by the poster in question... Alcohol has never been an issue with regards to this issue nor have I read that they have a substance abuse problem. To draw this conclusion and make this statement is a far reach and not going to win you any favor or prove your point.

                              Good Luck!
                              Tayken

                              I'm sorry but this is actually unbelievable.

                              You do realize that "arabian" stated untruths about myself, right? Why are you not picking her apart and dragging her through the mud. I believe she stated that I was having babies to make money, i'm not sure how I would be making money of my children or how it was proved that I was? This whole post has nothing to do with "arabian's" life. If she is going to "smack talk" me, I will respond.

                              One thing I do notice on this site is that people tend to provide advice to people based on their own emotion and experiences, and just because the mother/father in your experience (possibly) did you wrong, does not mean the person asking the question did.

                              Asking "arabian" to stop posting is not controlling, I am trying to stop communication with her because it is doing neither one of us any good.

                              We were not successful in gaining primary custody, in which you don't know all of the details, and my original question had nothing to do with custody. It would be nice to focus on the original question.

                              I would bet money that you are not in a position that allows you to diagnose me or my "emotional" state. And I also doubt you are a lawyer that truly knows if I would be successful or not.

                              Prior to the custody settlement I talked to around 6 different lawyers. I had two separate lawyers run the "numbers". The issue was we knew finances were going to change, but we couldn't do anything until they did. Both lawyers that ran the numbers, and any other lawyer I had just explained the situation to, advised us to pursue. It was luck of the draw with the actual lawyer we retained, not everybody is good at their job, and she wasn't. We knows that we qualify under both steps, I was just wondering if that even mattered when in front of a judge.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Unevenplayingground View Post
                                I would bet money that you are not in a position that allows you to diagnose me or my "emotional" state. And I also doubt you are a lawyer that truly knows if I would be successful or not.
                                I personally would not start trying to degrade Tayken... take a moment to search this forum and see what Tayken actually has to offer. Tayken is one of the most intelligent posters on this board and is very good at providing good evidence to show the emotional state of other posters.

                                Comment

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