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  • Trying to understand Section 7 expenses

    Good Afternoon.

    I was wondering if anyone knows if a yearbook and graduation gown rental for grade 12 is considered to be section 7 expenses. i was not asked for this when my son graduated 2 years ago but today I am be asked and not sure why. My thought is it should be paid with with monies from child support.

    Thank you

  • #2
    Grad gown MIGHT be. Yearbook, definitely not.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by blinkandimgone View Post
      Grad gown MIGHT be. Yearbook, definitely not.
      Agreed.

      And the gown would only be s7 if both of your incomes are on the low side, like $20-25k each annually. If you both are making $40k plus and you pay cs, it is almost certainly not an "extra-ordinary expense".....unless for some reason your ex and your daughter have their eye on an $800+ dress.....

      Comment


      • #4
        Let me clarify. The gown is the rental gown from the school. It is a robe and cap that they wear for the ceramony and return.

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        • #5
          A gown rental isn't very expensive. I just gave it a quick Google and saw one day rentals for $10 + $50 deposit which is given back. Your respective incomes would have to be pretty low to make this an extra-ordinary expense.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ChrisB View Post
            Let me clarify. The gown is the rental gown from the school. It is a robe and cap that they wear for the ceramony and return.
            Oh, answer....no, not in any way shape or form is it s7 unless the school is charging $500+ for the rental.

            We are likely talking about $75-80, so like $40-$50 each.....those amounts would be covered under c/s (probably up to $250 would be deemed c/s for average income earners).

            But then again, if we are only talking about $50-100....Would it almost not be easier to pay it and not give the ex the opportunity to say "your [parent] doesn't care about you....see, they aren't even willing to contribute to your [insert name of significant but not expense event here]"....?

            Too me, not giving the ex reason or opportunity to denegrate me to my child, is well worth spending a few bucks here and there.

            Comment


            • #7
              I would agree but no matter what my ex will always and has always said very negative things to my kids about me and as sad is it is I have come to except that this is just how she is. I am gratful that my kids are much wiser/older now and see the truth. The reason I ask is my ex would have me pay for everything if she could so no matter what I have to say no at times regardless of how much it is. Not to mention she works for her new husband and lets say proportianant share is far from fair so my share works out to 78%. Funny how this works but not a road I want to go down at this time.

              Thank you for your feedback

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by HammerDad View Post
                Oh, answer....no, not in any way shape or form is it s7 unless the school is charging $500+ for the rental.

                We are likely talking about $75-80, so like $40-$50 each.....those amounts would be covered under c/s (probably up to $250 would be deemed c/s for average income earners).

                But then again, if we are only talking about $50-100....Would it almost not be easier to pay it and not give the ex the opportunity to say "your [parent] doesn't care about you....see, they aren't even willing to contribute to your [insert name of significant but not expense event here]"....?

                Too me, not giving the ex reason or opportunity to denegrate me to my child, is well worth spending a few bucks here and there.
                The gown and yearbook were already paid for in proportion to income via CS. The OP has already paid for it once, no need to pay twice!

                As for paying to keep the other parent happy. I disagree - unreasonable greedy exs are never satisfied by money, they'll always want more so best to just keep things straight forward and go 'by the book' for CS.

                They are obviously unreasonable and greedy to ask for money above and beyond CS for a gown rental and yearbook!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by billm View Post
                  The gown and yearbook were already paid for in proportion to income via CS. The OP has already paid for it once, no need to pay twice!
                  Agreed.

                  As for paying to keep the other parent happy. I disagree - unreasonable greedy exs are never satisfied by money, they'll always want more so best to just keep things straight forward and go 'by the book' for CS.
                  I agreed, but with some caveats. I would never agree to something I believe is unreasonable. I willing to contribute for minor expenses as I know, with my particular ex, it helps keep the peace.

                  Mind you, my ex also doesn't ask me for extra's often. Generally just for dance. There was 1 time she was pissed at me and asked for my share of a dentist checkup invoice.....$5.......I paid it....it just wanted worth dealing with for $5....(I didn't know then that only medical costs over $100 are s7).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Interesting...

                    Interesting read. ChrisB, I agree - you already paid CS that goes towards those type of things. What exactly is child support for, if not this? lol.

                    Thanks HammerDad for your comments. I just read up on the section 7 rules, and did not realize the $100 threshold, for the medical costs, that aren't covered by one's existing health coverage.

                    What about point b),
                    (b) that portion of the medical and dental insurance premiums attributable to the child;

                    So if one had to pay, for medical benefits coverage for the child, both parents should be splitting the cost of that, proportionate to incomes?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Rental Gown and cost of "graduation" is not included in CS as some some school charge a flat fee of $150-200 (includes cap, rental gown, flowers, cost of the certificate, etc..) and is part of Section 7 as an extra ordinary expenses;
                      Child Support includes the basic necessity of life: food, clothing, housing and not a one of a life time graduation, keeping in mind a lot of children do not graduate from high school.

                      Same with "Driver's License" course, fees incured to write the tests as not all children obtain a driver's license and/or take a driver's ed course, therefore, considered under Section 7 as an extra expense.

                      Yearbook is NOT

                      Health Care/Medical Benefits is spllit between the parents after being submitted to the parents/child's health care insurance if they have coverage.
                      It can be debatable dependiing on the Judge as they can also have the children covered under the parent's spouses, common law if have coverage. Whatever is not covered is usually split 50/50.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thank you TLCRN. You seem to be very firm on your response. Is this from past experience or have you seen in as fact? The gown is only $50, yearbook $50, and then $30 for some sort of school item not specific. Again its not he money it is the point as like I said in a earlier post I am asked to pay for everything on top of the hefty CS sent each month.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by TLCRN View Post
                          Rental Gown and cost of "graduation" is not included in CS as some some school charge a flat fee of $150-200 (includes cap, rental gown, flowers, cost of the certificate, etc..) and is part of Section 7 as an extra ordinary expenses;
                          Child Support includes the basic necessity of life: food, clothing, housing and not a one of a life time graduation, keeping in mind a lot of children do not graduate from high school.

                          Same with "Driver's License" course, fees incured to write the tests as not all children obtain a driver's license and/or take a driver's ed course, therefore, considered under Section 7 as an extra expense.

                          Yearbook is NOT

                          Health Care/Medical Benefits is spllit between the parents after being submitted to the parents/child's health care insurance if they have coverage.
                          It can be debatable dependiing on the Judge as they can also have the children covered under the parent's spouses, common law if have coverage. Whatever is not covered is usually split 50/50.
                          This is not true, does not agree with the general consensus of the numerous posts on this subject in this forum, and more importantly does not agree with the wording and intent of Section 7.

                          There is nothing 'extraordinary' about a one time $200 fee, unless as stated in this thread, the combined incomes of the parents is extremely low.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Same with "Driver's License" course, fees incured to write the tests as not all children obtain a driver's license and/or take a driver's ed course, therefore, considered under Section 7 as an extra expense.
                            Driving is a privilege, not a right, and as such does not constitute an extraordinary expense. (however you'd be a fool to NOT contribute to a driver's ed course, the savings over the first two years alone would pay for it)

                            Insurance is covered by CS unless the household incomes are very very low.

                            Health Care/Medical Benefits is spllit between the parents after being submitted to the parents/child's health care insurance if they have coverage.
                            Whatever is not covered is split pro-rata to income.
                            Fixed it for you. Also, If one parent has coverage and the other does not, then the cost associated with having the child on the benefits plan is a extraordinary expense if you want to get technical about it. But that's REALLY nickel and diming yourself to death there.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              ChrisB:
                              Haven't been to trial with the two Judges dealing with these issues with "final Court Orders" in place pertaining to these issues specifically (Section 7 expenses including issues in my post, child support and post secondary education monthly support).

                              Like I said in my post, it all depends on the Judges as they have the last decision with them writting the Court Orders...no anyone else!
                              Their decision is based on a many factors such as the income of the parents, who has health care coverage.
                              As most people who have dealt with the Court system and have gone to trial on any issue, the Rules are not always black and white!

                              Comment

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