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Support: according to my narcissistic EX

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  • #16
    Hello Hammerdad: yes. That's true. Individuals CAN file their domestic contracts. My point was that any order from Trial or Pre-trial done through court/lawyers resulting in an ORDER, goes to FRO. Domestic contracts without counsel can be submitted as far as I know yes, but that would mean the party/parties personally sent the "agreement" to the FRO. In my case: I had trial. There was a reserved judgment. That judgment was released in Sept. It is the Judge's Final Order. All 23 glorious pages of it. Signed and Sealed.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by hadenough View Post
      Hello Hammerdad: yes. That's true. Individuals CAN file their domestic contracts. My point was that any order from Trial or Pre-trial done through court/lawyers resulting in an ORDER, goes to FRO. Domestic contracts without counsel can be submitted as far as I know yes, but that would mean the party/parties personally sent the "agreement" to the FRO. In my case: I had trial. There was a reserved judgment. That judgment was released in Sept. It is the Judge's Final Order. All 23 glorious pages of it. Signed and Sealed.
      Alright, but you have to be more concise. You stated:

      [/quote] or a separation agreement that's been hammered out. [/quote]

      Which was what I was pointing out as incorrect as they are not automatically registered with FRO even if they are registered with the courts.

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      • #18
        I believe the Ontario Ombudsman would field/review any FRO-related concerns. I will definitely be jumping on any bandwagon I can if there is a problem for me (with FRO). I have a couple of friends who recv their CS payments through the FRO and they are, for the most part, satisfied. There have been a couple of issues, but nothing that wasn't dealt with once it was brought to their attention. I hate hearing that the FRO is not all that I'd heard about it. I really have no other hope for enforcement.

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        • #19
          Yes Hammerdad: I was vague. I should have been more concise. Agreed

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          • #20
            Support: according to my narcissistic EX

            Originally posted by CSAngel View Post
            I think you're right on that - however, chances are that if you've been through court then the parties are not agreeable and the chance of getting both to consent to NOT going through FRO would be slim to none.
            I totally agree with you. Most couple who get along and consent, are usually not in Court dealing with support. Most Judges will write in court orders for payments to go to FRO, with most legal counsels agreeing especially if representing the recipient. It is very difficult to obtain support payments and arrears from the payor without having to involve the Courts, and FRO. We all know FRO is far from being perfect!

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            • #21
              CSA Angel
              I think you hit this nail right on. Even if some couples do not make it right to court there is the ffew where abuse, threats, or even continued head games, or just nonn payments (maybe a few needs to increase to many??) would continue on for years.

              For this alone the FRO principle is the right one but even from my personal perspective who would want the buffer, the court FRO system is distorted and a completely different setup needs to happen. Different government body, management, perhaps a strong watchdog to keep things in check - flush out the stupidity and insert people who care about families, care to do what is right and stop the abuse of power they appear to use over and over.

              As far as payments before FRO processes an order - would not a payor trying to do the right thing be covered if a proof of payment is retained? Even better perhaps is the recipient signing a detailed reciept for funds recieved? Sometimes the recipient just needs the money (for a ton of reasons) to stop eviction, eat, medicine??? We are getting divorced but it seams some would think we must also lose our humanity or compassion in doing so?

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              • #22
                So after 3 yrs waiting for Trial, 5 months waiting for a reserved judgment - I discover that the "costs" issue (I was the successful party) is part of the final order so NOW: I'm waiting for ex's lawyer to respond to the cost submissions. Once he (eventually does), and he's taking his time: the Judge has to incorporate that into the final drafted order. Its been 2 months since the "decision" re: CS and SS was released. Now add at least another month, and then when it gets to the FRO, they will take 6-12 weeks. As well, my lawyer and I are speculating that the ex and his lawyer will try to appeal the SS aspect of the existing order. Ex's income was imputed, he lied multiple times at Trial (and got caught in each one) and the disclosure he did provide was inadequate. "Woefully inadequate" as a matter of fact. The Judge's order made it clear that ex has "serious credibility issues." I'll know next week where this is all heading. My understanding, unless I've got it wrong: is that appeal or no appeal, the existing order stands and already ex has short-paid for 2 months. He's in breach of the order, right out of the gate. Does the Court care? re: the Breach? Answer: NO. It's for FRO to deal w/his arrears etc once they become involved. If ex appeals, I will then be forced to be the "respondent" and ex will be the applicant appellant. An appeal court hears matters where the previous Judge may have applied the Law incorrectly to his/her decision. That is not the case with the decision released in my matter. What a circus. It is impossible to truly get out of the court machine and the whole thing makes me sick. On the weekend ex chuckled to child "your mother doesn't realize that if I go to jail, I won't have to pay HER anything." Yes what an amazing thought process. I'm sure his wife w/2 children (with him) under 21 months of age, would really love to hear that. I don't talk to ex and didn't want to comment (to him) on above ludicrous comment made to our child, and some others he's made since the decision was released. The 35k in costs likely has him feeling pretty unwell. As for the possible "appeal" - my take is, that the existing order (amt) stands and if he chooses to not pay the full amount, he's just digging himself in deeper. Then he will lose at his appeal, incur more "costs" and still owe whatever he's decided not to pay, in the interim.

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                • #23
                  As explained at the trial when my ex argued he was not gong to pay CS, post secondary education payments calculated by the Judge, mentionning "appealing" the decision, the Judge saidan "appeal is costly, will be incuring more costs, and in order to appeal one has to have good reasons for doing so, as one cannot appeal because they don't like the decision made, facts and proof are needed whilch were presented at a trial..the purpose of a trial.
                  hadenough: you right it is a circus....and a waiting game!
                  As a said in other post, we go to trial, and thnk or suppose to think it's over as there are "final orders", but no it's not when a party wishes to "ignore the Court Order".
                  After a lengthly, stressfull trial being self represented and final Orders in place, my ex has decided to make an "offer to settle", knowing he is in Breach of the Order. Without going into details, he first wants me to agree to withdraw from the FRO although there are arrears; the rest is not even worth mentionning as it's not even half of the amount ordered.

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                  • #24
                    That is just AWFUL! Well, I will know which way this is headed next week. Dumb and Dumber have to respond to cost submissions (35g!!) and we'll see where we land. I'm so tired of it all. Yeahhh- what a bargoon your X is offering you. Can't believe your not snapping that up! What an ass! So, just out of curiosity: why is he wanting to opt out of FRO so badly? I'm going to be none too pleased if this goes to an appeal. He truly has no grounds. The judgment is 23 pages with numerous Supreme Court of Canada Case Law references. That, and he LIED like there was no tomorrow over and over again. There is no error whatsoever in how the "law" was applied. If anything: he's lucky, as a more seasoned judge (ours was a newbie) would have been a lot worse on/for him. Its so true. This never ends. I'm finding it hard to "move on" with my life. My life has been Court for four years. Before that, it was w/that maniac. What life?!? I need to create a new one.. A new "me" - easier said than done. Thank you for the info you shared.

                    Comment

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