She's playing really dirty now.

[karmaseeker]

I barely slept a wink last night...

There was finally an agreement made that both parties wanted the involvement of the OCL so a paper consensual motion was to be processed through the courts. She and her lawyer prepared the motion. An email was sent with a copy of it.

Immediately our lawyer spotted the fact that the "consensual" motion was full of misleading allegations against my partner . Our lawyer immediately wrote them and said DO NOT FILE THAT! there was a flurry of emails between the two lawyers and her Lawyer ignored ours and filed it anyways and said basically if you have a problem redo it all and file your own counter. This was supposed to be a consensual motion.

Our lawyer then gave us 2 choices - file another one which would cost us a lot more money (we've already paid 11,000 and not even gone to case conference so told her to stop the unnecessary costs.)

or 2 wait til case conference in July and bring it up then to the judge adding the complaint to the brief (and hope that worse case scenario a judge doesn't order supervised visits - unlikely she said.)

Our lawyer is playing it above board - very thorough - very expensive. My fiancee is wanting to do option 2. Ultimately it is his decision - they are his kids.

All night I am having nightmares of the OCL now coming with preconceived notions against us and more false allegations being made against us all. I am so worried because we are dealing with a total nutjob with a mission for vengeance at all costs. She will hurt her own children to win and money is her food.

Now that this motion has been filed - how soon will the OCL show up at my door? How do they find the truth when they are being fed so many lies?

[lilspinx]

Seems to be it is far from over. The order for OCL involvement is on consent, but at the end of the day the OCL reserves the right to participate.

Put the K back into kick and kick their arse. Follow through with the OCl and surely, the allegations, half truths etc will be seen for what they are. Be the best parent you can be. ...

[WorkingDAD]

I barely slept a wink last night...

There was finally an agreement made that both parties wanted the involvement of the OCL so a paper consensual motion was to be processed through the courts. She and her lawyer prepared the motion. An email was sent with a copy of it.

Immediately our lawyer spotted the fact that the "consensual" motion was full of misleading allegations against my partner . Our lawyer immediately wrote them and said DO NOT FILE THAT! there was a flurry of emails between the two lawyers and her Lawyer ignored ours and filed it anyways and said basically if you have a problem redo it all and file your own counter. This was supposed to be a consensual motion.

Our lawyer then gave us 2 choices - file another one which would cost us a lot more money (we've already paid 11,000 and not even gone to case conference so told her to stop the unnecessary costs.)

or 2 wait til case conference in July and bring it up then to the judge adding the complaint to the brief (and hope that worse case scenario a judge doesn't order supervised visits - unlikely she said.)

Our lawyer is playing it above board - very thorough - very expensive. My fiancee is wanting to do option 2. Ultimately it is his decision - they are his kids.

All night I am having nightmares of the OCL now coming with preconceived notions against us and more false allegations being made against us all. I am so worried because we are dealing with a total nutjob with a mission for vengeance at all costs. She will hurt her own children to win and money is her food.

Now that this motion has been filed - how soon will the OCL show up at my door? How do they find the truth when they are being fed so many lies?

Motion for OCL involvement does not mean OCL will accept your case. First of all you will need court order saying that OCL should take case. than you have to send them Intake Form. Second OCL still may not accept it.

As for lawyers - I would not be so blind towards your lawyer. Look very fishy to me. I am not sure about that consent motion but don't you have to serve it first and than file it? Is it different process than ordinary motion?

And one more thing. You are far far away from real dirty yet ... So try to sleep. I know it hard because I can not to but you have to ...

[fireweb13]

I wish you all the luck. From what I remember, during a conference a Judge ordered that the OCL become involved but we both consented to it. Then my Ex's lawyer and myself had to send in our own intake forms. When the OCL social worker did some background interviews with myself and my ex and our daughter and then came up with her conclusion. Let me tell you now that unless the OCL worker feels that your Fiancee's ex will Kill the children, he is going to end up with every second weekend and a Wednesday evening visit with soul custody to mom. My ex brought out everything against me, her boyfriend also, in the interview with our child it clearly outlines parental alienation syndrome and even a case conference judge pointed that out without me saying a thing. The worker made her "every second weekend and Wednesday access and soul custody to mom" recommendation. I know of 5 fathers who have had this recommendation and we all have extremly different cases. They could very well believe the stuff that she will tell them. I hope that you have a bit more luck than I or anyone I know has had though.

[WorkingDAD]

I wish you all the luck. From what I remember, during a conference a Judge ordered that the OCL become involved but we both consented to it. Then my Ex's lawyer and myself had to send in our own intake forms. When the OCL social worker did some background interviews with myself and my ex and our daughter and then came up with her conclusion. Let me tell you now that unless the OCL worker feels that your Fiancee's ex will Kill the children, he is going to end up with every second weekend and a Wednesday evening visit with soul custody to mom. My ex brought out everything against me, her boyfriend also, in the interview with our child it clearly outlines parental alienation syndrome and even a case conference judge pointed that out without me saying a thing. The worker made her "every second weekend and Wednesday access and soul custody to mom" recommendation. I know of 5 fathers who have had this recommendation and we all have extremly different cases. They could very well believe the stuff that she will tell them. I hope that you have a bit more luck than I or anyone I know has had though.

yep
I am the one of them... It looks like they do not know other approaches )

[karmaseeker]

Do they not see the signs of parent alienation?

I have 64 pages of documentation.

Even if we got EOW surely they would give equal access in summer and Christmas?

We have the status quo of 3 years and a poorly written Separation agreement given us all weekends but one. but because there is nothing written about any other access she is denying access at x-mas and in summer. or any pd days or long weekends.

WE have only ever wanted to retain what is already written - joint custody and have a clear outline of access and everything else but she wont agree to anything. no to 6 offered amended agreements. No to mediation. No to arbitration. No to 3 settlement offers.

She is taken us to court for sole custody, limited access, more money, and spouting crap of him being unfit, a potential threat, mentally unstable. I can assure you he is none of what she says. He is a kind and loving man who dotes on his children. he teaches Sunday school and I volunteer with the ill. I am not saying we are perfect but we are a hell of a lot morally responsible and loving than her.

She on the other hand is "mommy dearest" who punishes her kids severely - we had to call CAS. She uses severe emotional abuse and PAS is obvious as she forced the kids to email us. What kid emails at age 7? She hacks off the little ones hair when she doesn't listen. She refuses them access to counselling. She refuses to communicate and creates her own conflict to attempt to prove non cooperation. And may I add she has broken up 3 marriages with her self satisfying behaviour displacing 6 children.

It is so hard for me to stay grounded. I just want to wrap up the kids and protect them. This isn't the life I envisioned at all.

[WorkingDAD]

Do they not see the signs of parent alienation?

I have 64 pages of documentation.

I begin to think that they do not really care. All depends on who you will get as investigator and what biases he has in his head...

Even if we got EOW surely they would give equal access in summer and Christmas?

mine give me summer week about schedule when kid is 5. I think it bullshit but there is a lot of people who think that they would kill for that... Cristmass and all holidays divided.

We have the status quo of 3 years and a poorly written Separation agreement given us all weekends but one. but because there is nothing written about any other access she is denying access at x-mas and in summer. or any pd days or long weekends.

WE have only ever wanted to retain what is already written - joint custody and have a clear outline of access and everything else but she wont agree to anything. no to 6 offered amended agreements. No to mediation. No to arbitration. No to 3 settlement offers.

that probably will be your biggest advantage. they do not like change things unless there is real need...

She is taken us to court for sole custody, limited access, more money, and spouting crap of him being unfit, a potential threat, mentally unstable. I can assure you he is none of what she says. He is a kind and loving man who dotes on his children. he teaches Sunday school and I volunteer with the ill. I am not saying we are perfect but we are a hell of a lot morally responsible and loving than her.

that will be her problem to prove all that. What is really important and help you if you concentrate on you and only you when you will deal with OCL. What I mean do not go into she is like that and did that. Just concentrate on what is good for kid.

She on the other hand is "mommy dearest" who punishes her kids severely - we had to call CAS. She uses severe emotional abuse and PAS is obvious as she forced the kids to email us. What kid emails at age 7? She hacks off the little ones hair when she doesn't listen. She refuses them access to counselling. She refuses to communicate and creates her own conflict to attempt to prove non cooperation. And may I add she has broken up 3 marriages with her self satisfying behaviour displacing 6 children.

Base on age of kids OCL will speak with them. So do not worry. Just make sure that kids understand that it nothing wrong about them that OCL to protect them and they should not be afraid of anything and just tell the truth ...

It is so hard for me to stay grounded. I just want to wrap up the kids and protect them. This isn't the life I envisioned at all.[/QUOTE]

[fireweb13]

So what is your status quo right now? I mean what has access been since they seperated?
Right now you need to document everything, keep track of everything you can, get a voice recorder and try and have a witness at every interaction between them. Also record the OCL interviews. My OCL report said that we should alternate weekends in the summer as well but nothing has happened yet with that. I am not argueing holidays with my ex yet either which makes it better.
I volunteered at our daughters school before she moved, and do as much as I can in the community. My Fiancee is in University to be a Child and Youth care worker and has worked at a daycare for 3 years. We are upstanding members of our community. My ex on the other hand, collects welfare, fails any course she tries to do, never volunteers or even goes outside with our daughter except to go to McDonalds. I have been accused of horrible things and nobody in the courts or CAS will do anything about it expect say that they are not true. Its crazy but we are in a world where false allegations are accepted and there is no burden of proof in family court.
Try and make sure the OCL investigator has copys of all the proof and evidence you have though so that it may weigh more towards the truth. When your having your interview never say anything negative about the ex, just stay positive about what you and your fiancee are doing for his child. Only bring out anything negative if they try and pry it out of you but state that you do not like talking or thinking negativly, and that working together is whats best for the kids and your not sure why she is doing all this stuff. Stay positive, if you go in attacking his ex it will make you look as bad.

[WorkingDAD]

So what is your status quo right now? I mean what has access been since they seperated?
Right now you need to document everything, keep track of everything you can, get a voice recorder and try and have a witness at every interaction between them. Also record the OCL interviews.

I do not think so... I asked about can I record it and replay was NO. I wonder why

My OCL report said that we should alternate weekends in the summer as well but nothing has happened yet with that. I am not argueing holidays with my ex yet either which makes it better.
I volunteered at our daughters school before she moved, and do as much as I can in the community. My Fiancee is in University to be a Child and Youth care worker and has worked at a daycare for 3 years. We are upstanding members of our community. My ex on the other hand, collects welfare, fails any course she tries to do, never volunteers or even goes outside with our daughter except to go to McDonalds. I have been accused of horrible things and nobody in the courts or CAS will do anything about it expect say that they are not true. Its crazy but we are in a world where false allegations are accepted and there is no burden of proof in family court.

That so true... I still can get over it how the hell in the country what claim to be one of the best for leaving in a world such horrible thing going on...

Try and make sure the OCL investigator has copys of all the proof and evidence you have though so that it may weigh more towards the truth. When your having your interview never say anything negative about the ex, just stay positive about what you and your fiancee are doing for his child.
Only bring out anything negative if they try and pry it out of you but state that you do not like talking or thinking negativly, and that working together is whats best for the kids and your not sure why she is doing all this stuff. Stay positive, if you go in attacking his ex it will make you look as bad.

That what I was trying to tell too ) Even so it's so hard to do ))))))))) Idea is give them the fact and let them decide ...

[fireweb13]

Just a note, you can record any conversation that YOU are a part of. You do not need to tell the other party/Parties. You cannot leave a recorder in a room and then leave the room though. You must be present while you are recording. If you tell the person who is doing the interview (OCL,CAS) or whoever it is, its funny to see their demeanor change. They may tell you that they do not want to be recorded, or even tell you its illigal to record them but its not. I have studied this part of the law before. You can even record while you are in a courtroom, most Judges do not want you to, and may even tell you that you are not allowed but it is against the law for them to stop you( Judges usually feel they are above the law)

[karmaseeker]

Status quo is 3 or 4 weekends in the month depending on how many weekends in the month. (so she gets one) : this was her requested and written agreement from 2008. That is literally the only thing about access written in the agreement - the rest is mostly money stuff and some not even legal nonsense. No financial disclosure, no lawyers, signed by my fiancee in a moment of duress at not being able to see his kids - he just found out about the year and half long affair she was having with her best buds hubby (not his strongest emotional or mental moment).

Status quo with other access is when she says we can have them (when she is away on holiday - we always say yes). When we ask to have them for holidays - she usually says no.

We do do lots of positive things for the kids. I will try my best to stay as focus on that and them like I always do ... it's just so hard.

[WorkingDAD]

Just a note, you can record any conversation that YOU are a part of. You do not need to tell the other party/Parties. You cannot leave a recorder in a room and then leave the room though. You must be present while you are recording. If you tell the person who is doing the interview (OCL,CAS) or whoever it is, its funny to see their demeanor change. They may tell you that they do not want to be recorded, or even tell you its illigal to record them but its not. I have studied this part of the law before. You can even record while you are in a courtroom, most Judges do not want you to, and may even tell you that you are not allowed but it is against the law for them to stop you( Judges usually feel they are above the law)

OK
I know about the court now but did not know about other part. Can you provide some links to the Law what did you research. would be really helpful not only for me ...

[fireweb13]

Karmaseeker, just checking that your Fiancee is getting 3-4 weekends a month ( Childrens mom gets 1 weekend a month). She always says no to long weekends and holidays? Well the order does not say anything about long weekends or holidays, so technically lets take this May 24 weekend, your Fiancee should get his regular part of the weekend and not the extra part of Monday. If Christmas or any holiday is on his time he would get it, since it is not worked out. I would ask for alternating holidays and long weekends, alternate 1 week and 1 week christmas, alternate March break, 4 weeks in the summer. You should be able to get that.

[fireweb13]

WorkingDad, I do not have my copy of the criminal code with me right now. Will try and reference it when I get home tonight.

[WorkingDAD]

WorkingDad, I do not have my copy of the criminal code with me right now. Will try and reference it when I get home tonight.

thank you
I was triing to find it in Criminal Code but did not have any luck...

are you talking about that?

Consent to interception

183.1 Where a private communication is originated by more than one person or is intended by the originator thereof to be received by more than one person, a consent to the interception thereof by any one of those persons is sufficient consent for the purposes of any provision of this Part.
1993, c. 40, s. 2.

I need translation here. It;s like I know all words bu can not put it together...