Forged Support Cheques

[HammerDad]

If you cash the cheque, and it turns out to be fraudulent, be aware that your bank has the right to seize your account.

You should at least speak to your bank about this matter because if the cheque is not cleared through your ex's bank you will be on the hook for any money you spent.

I would be extremely cautious about cashing these cheques.

While there is an extremely outside possibility of her account being frozen, the bank won't seize funds without conducting an inquiry into whether it was fraud or not. If they call the ex and he says "yes, I owed her the cheques and they are fine" nothing will happen to OP.

The chances that the OP's bank account is frozen or accounts seized because of this are slim to none.

If OP makes it clear to the ex that she knows that someone else signed the cheques, but that she's cashing them anyway, and that should anything happen as a result he is on the hook, OP will be fine. The ex may respond with "OK, no worries. Just go cash them" or "I don't f'n care what you do!" or "Don't cash, I'll get you new ones with my signature". Either way, she has evidence that she advised him of the issue and he gave instructions on how to proceed. And that should be adversely affected by him not signing the cheques, he knows she will come after him for damages.

[HammerDad]

BTW - knowingly cashing a fraudulent cheque is, in itself, a fraudulent act. If you don't believe me then check with your bank or local police department.

If there is consent there is no fraud. Fraud is if one deceives for the purpose of gain. There is no deception here, especially if the OP tells the ex they know the signature isn't his but she is going to cash them anyway. If she wants to be cautious, she could say she will cash them Wednesday unless he advises otherwise. This gives him notice of the issue and allows him to remedy it if he so chooses.

But this is definitely not fraud. This isn't the OP forging cheques in the ex's name and cashing them without his knowledge or consent.

[arabian]

The OP's monthly support cheques are in excess of $ 10,000.00/month.

I believe she has large financial commitments (pays for son's university overseas). She very well might be in a position to cover these cheques should they be returned, most of us wouldn't. Due to the amount of the money in question here, it is quite likely the bank will do an investigation. These sorts of investigations can take many months.


IMO attempting to cash a cheque (which you know is forged) could be considered 'fraudulent misrepresentation.'

[HammerDad]

IMO attempting to cash a cheque (which you know is forged) could be considered 'fraudulent misrepresentation.'

Unless you've informed the affected party of the issue and provided them time to remedy the issue.

One would have a very hard time arguing a criminal charge of fraudulent misrepresentation where:

a. A owes B X dollars
b. the cheque in question is for those X dollars
c. B has advised A of issues with the cheque and sought clarification, providing A with reasonable time to respond
d. a reasonable person could conclude that the cheque was signed by A's partner on A's behalf
e. there was no intent to harm or damage A by B

How would one prosecute this? Criminally, where OP told the ex that she found issues with his signature on the cheques, but she is cashing them anyway in a few days unless he instructs her otherwise. Where is the criminality in that?

Or civilly? How was the ex damaged? Ex owed OP money. OP had reasonable belief that the cheques came from Ex's house under Ex's direction. OP went further to communicate to the Ex that there were issues with the cheques and sought instruction on cashing them.

Notwithstanding all of the above, OP isn't completely aware of 100% of the practices that go on in the ex's household. It may be completely common for the g/f to sign cheques on behalf of the ex and the ex's bank may also be aware of this. Ex may have been a control freak during their relationship, but not all relationships are the same.

[Once.is.enough]

Are you a hand writing expert? Fraud is all about intent as well as action. You would not be guilty of fraud by cashing the cheque unless perhaps you signed them. Cash them at his branch and ask them to verify the signature before releasing the funds. Puts the responsibility on the bank.

[Wyntermcd]

I frequently sign my partners signature on cheques. No attempt at fraud just that I'm the one who arranges the bill payments etc.

In a previous job I also did the same thing for my boss. She was frequently away on vacation or not available when cheques were needed for suppliers, her signature was easy to replicate.

Realistically, what is the likelihood that a person is trying to be fraudulent?

[arabian]

I frequently sign my partners signature on cheques. No attempt at fraud just that I'm the one who arranges the bill payments etc.

In a previous job I also did the same thing for my boss. She was frequently away on vacation or not available when cheques were needed for suppliers, her signature was easy to replicate.

Realistically, what is the likelihood that a person is trying to be fraudulent?

During divorce anything is possible. Why take the chance?

Yes divorced people do all sorts of nasty things to each other all the time.

[HammerDad]

Realistically, what is the likelihood that a person is trying to be fraudulent?

More accurately, what is the likelihood OP's ex is trying to entrap her into perpetuating a fraud with his own money?

[Tayken]

More accurately, what is the likelihood OP's ex is trying to entrap her into perpetuating a fraud with his own money?

Here is how I would recommend handling it.

1. Have you lawyer stating explicitly that you have received the checks and thank the other party.

2. Attach to the letter true copies of each and every check. Have them notarized.

3. Advise the other party that you will be cashing said checks as dated and if there was an issue to contact your lawyers office.

4. Have a process server (not FedEx, UPS, etc...) serve the documentation in person right to the party who should have signed the checks.

5. Get an affidavit of service.

6. Cash the checks.

You have CYA on this one big time if you do the above. You gave sufficient notice that you were going to cash the checks, provided true copies of the originals you were shipped. (COPY THEM IN COLOUR AND ON A VERY GOOD COPIER!) If the other party wants to dispute the checks then they can... if they can't complain that they are "forged". They were provided painfully solid notice.

Good Luck!
Tayken

[arabian]

Good advice Tayken.

Maybe he'll think twice before he has the 'help' do his cheques up for him in the future.

[Berner_Faith]

Good advice Tayken.

Maybe he'll think twice before he has the 'help' do his cheques up for him in the future.

Why does it matter who writes the cheque if you get the money? Seems like a huge waste of time and money for everyone. A simple email to the ex could provide the information required. Talking about getting the RCMP and crap involved is nothing but stirring the pot. Sheesh... people complain about not getting their money but when cheques are provided it is not good enough... talk about drama!

[DowntroddenDad]

Why does it matter who writes the cheque if you get the money? Seems like a huge waste of time and money for everyone. A simple email to the ex could provide the information required. Talking about getting the RCMP and crap involved is nothing but stirring the pot. Sheesh... people complain about not getting their money but when cheques are provided it is not good enough... talk about drama!

Sorry to disagree Berner but it doesn't matter who writes the check, it does matter who signs the check. The signature must be from the owner of the account. Forging someone else's signature is fraud, as is knowingly cashing a check that you know to be fraudulently signed. I think Tayken's advice is sound.

[Berner_Faith]

Sorry to disagree Berner but it doesn't matter who writes the check, it does matter who signs the check. The signature must be from the owner of the account. Forging someone else's signature is fraud, as is knowingly cashing a check that you know to be fraudulently signed. I think Tayken's advice is sound.

If someone gives permission for them to do so, it is not considered fraud. I still disagree with it being considered fraud. I think Hammerdad has stated it well.

[momforever1956]

We do not communicate, period. He will not communicate and everything is done via our respective counsel.
It is not a joint account, it is a business account, but even so if it was, she did not sign her name--she forged his. I am pretty sure he gave her permission and I am also pretty sure he would not argue or say they are forged because then he would be in more trouble for not giving me the support he has to by our SA. My worry is that if the bank tries to verify the cheques--they are each a large amount, it is so obvious it isnt his signature.

[arabian]

That's one of the oldest 'tricks in the books' - fill out a form or cheque incorrectly so you know it won't go through.

Nowadays you should be able to get the cheque electronically certified by your bank. If they refuse then you have your answer. At least that way there will be no surprises.