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  • Summer Section 7 expenses

    Hi everyone,

    I have a situation regarding Summer holidays and section 7.

    Generally during the school year we split expenses 60/40. I pay 60% for before school/after school care, activities etc. I also make my payments directly to her based on total cost of the expense. So if an activity costs say $1000; then I pay $600.

    For the weeks my ex has the kids enrolled in summer camps during the weeks she has them and I have the kids enrolled in camps while I have them.

    The issue is that she has enrolled the kids in full week camps (so cost is for 5 days plus before/after camp care) but isn't actually taking the kids to the camps. She's taken the summer off from work and has a number of trips planned during her weeks. At this point she has 3-4 trips planned; 3 to US (4-5 days plus weekends) and 1 to Europe (2 weeks).

    All the trips are out of the country; for which she's asked permission letters for. I have no issues with the trips as it'll be good for the kids to spend time with her extended family. When she goes on these trips she doesn't expect any financial assistance from me for the kids cost. I do give them some pocket money so they can get souvenirs or anything they like.

    My issue is that the camps she's enrolled the kids for; she wants me to still split the total cost; regardless of whether the kids attend or not. Her argument is that camps are for when she may need to drop them off there. She books them for the week so that she has the flexibility and can change plans day to day.

    There is no separation agreement signed by us. This is something that is still ongoing nearly 4 years after we split.

    Any suggestions on how to do deal with this situation?

    Thank you.

  • #2
    I would tell her you will share expenses for days the children are in care only. That for days when they are in her care, daycare or camps are not required therefore you will not share in the expense.

    Then leave it at that. Why doesn’t she just get a babysitter for the odd day she needs care?? Enrolling them in camp they don’t attend is not only a waste of money but a waste of a spot another kid could have taken!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by rockscan View Post
      I would tell her you will share expenses for days the children are in care only. That for days when they are in her care, daycare or camps are not required therefore you will not share in the expense.

      Then leave it at that. Why doesn’t she just get a babysitter for the odd day she needs care?? Enrolling them in camp they don’t attend is not only a waste of money but a waste of a spot another kid could have taken!!
      Thank you for the response; she does have a babysitter who she uses on evenings and weekends. During the week the babysitter isn't available.

      Where you suggested share for the days children are in care; that's what I had requested to her. But she argues that she doesn't know what's happening that far in advance.

      She needs camps available "just in case she's got other plans come up"

      Comment


      • #4
        Then she gets a new babysitter who IS available. Camps are not daycare and if you are paying for care they need to be IN care.

        Does she need the care to go to work or school for work? Then its not an eligible section 7 expense.

        Its a simple response: The children are not attending the camps you are requesting me to split which points to them not being necessary daycare as outlined in the federal child support guidelines. If you need a sitter for days during the summer I am more than happy to share that cost but will not be paying for camps they are not attending.

        Comment


        • #5
          I don’t understand how she thinks you should be paying for ANY childcare as a section 7 if she is not working/in school. If they aren’t on a day trip/vacation with her why would she even send them to camp while she sits at home alone enjoying her time off work?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by tilt View Post
            I don’t understand how she thinks you should be paying for ANY childcare as a section 7 if she is not working/in school. If they aren’t on a day trip/vacation with her why would she even send them to camp while she sits at home alone enjoying her time off work?


            Yes to this. She’s taken the summer off. If she needs child care for her galavanting then she can pay for it.

            Comment


            • #7
              You've all provided me some great information.

              I looked up the law in Ontario:
              https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/970391

              and found the following:
              Special or extraordinary expenses
              7. (1) In an order for the support of a child, the court may, on the request of either parent or spouse or of an applicant under section 33 of the Act, provide for an amount to cover all or any portion of the following expenses, which expenses may be estimated, taking into account the necessity of the expense in relation to the child’s best interests and the reasonableness of the expense in relation to the means of the parents or spouses and those of the child and to the spending pattern of the parents or spouses in respect of the child during cohabitation:

              (a) child care expenses incurred as a result of the custodial parent’s employment, illness, disability or education or training for employment;


              Personally I don't mind sharing expenses for camp as long as the kids are actually going. Some of the camps they are registered for are quite interesting and they will learn something new (provided they attend).

              I'm going to keep a log for the summer to see which days they actually attend.

              I'll write up an email to her on this.
              Last edited by blueman2017; 07-03-2019, 03:15 PM. Reason: edit

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by tilt View Post
                I don’t understand how she thinks you should be paying for ANY childcare as a section 7 if she is not working/in school. If they aren’t on a day trip/vacation with her why would she even send them to camp while she sits at home alone enjoying her time off work?
                She argues that since the kids live with her majority of the time she's entitled to ensure they are registered into something in case she needs to do things on a particular day.

                She says she needs flexibility.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by blueman2017 View Post
                  She argues that since the kids live with her majority of the time she's entitled to ensure they are registered into something in case she needs to do things on a particular day.



                  She says she needs flexibility.


                  Then she pays for her own flexibility.

                  Maybe when shes paying for it alone she will make sure they actually attend. Its really not fair to the kids, the instructor or the kid who wasn’t able to attend as it was sold out to kids who don’t go.

                  As long as you condone her need for flexibility, she will continue to do it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by blueman2017 View Post
                    She argues that since the kids live with her majority of the time she's entitled to ensure they are registered into something in case she needs to do things on a particular day.

                    She says she needs flexibility.
                    hmm then the kids can come live with you and she can have all the flexibility she wants.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by blueman2017 View Post
                      She argues that since the kids live with her majority of the time she's entitled to ensure they are registered into something in case she needs to do things on a particular day.

                      She says she needs flexibility.

                      She is wrong. You are obligated to pay for (from the legislation):
                      1. child care expenses incurred as a result of the custodial parent’s employment, illness, disability or education or training for employment;


                      Nothing more, nothing less. Her wanting flexibility to do errands is her issue.



                      She may argue that it is:


                      (f) extraordinary expenses for extracurricular activities


                      But I would reply that you will pay for the days they attend said extracurricular activities.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Lol, since she says it is because the children live with her the majority of the time I would counter with a suggestion that you move to 50/50 immediately as she is clearly feeling overwhelmed, you very much want to support her ability to parent positively as a co-parent, and you have demonstrated your ability to parent effectively over the past however many years.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Wow
                          She is something
                          Stupid people never cease to amaze.
                          Literally the stupidest thing ever. “Flexibility” and at your expense lol. Ummmmmmm NO!


                          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                          Comment

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