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  • #16
    Nadia’s question was what to expect. I answered what to expect. And just because you have one cc doesnt mean you can automatically jump to something else. There have been other cases where another cc was ordered or a motion was moved into a conference discussion or the cc judge moved it to a motion court to have something ordered. The experience I have seen and heard (based on reading and talking with a lawyer) shows that many cases go to another conference (normally settlement) before going to a motion. There a number of posters on this forum alone who have experienced crazy conference situations that were completely unexpected INCLUDING having a second, third and fourth conference scheduled.

    For Nadia, she has a straightforward case with full disclosure. If her ex continues to drag his feet she has a case to go to a hearing. For others, if their ex refuses disclosure but additional conferences are needed, they will be held.

    And before you drag me for that, Ive asked about the conference process and have been told the different ways they are played out whether a second or third or settlement after dro/cc or going straight to a hearing. While you *CAN* file to push it through, if it is going to piss off the judge that you jumped the queue, I would always advise on the side of caution. I gave my opinion based on how things went and what our lawyer (who does this and is a certified expert in family law) said. Yes my fiancé could have filed for a follow conference or a motion but as we have seen, his ex refuses to provide disclosure even with an order to do so. They have a settlement conference booked for the summer. A DRO conference, a motion for disclosure and an order were unsuccessful in accomplishing what you said a hearing would.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by rockscan View Post
      Nadia’s question was what to expect. I answered what to expect. And just because you have one cc doesnt mean you can automatically jump to something else.
      It really does though. Once you have completed 1 cc, you can either book another cc, a sc, or a motion.

      There have been other cases where another cc was ordered or a motion was moved into a conference discussion or the cc judge moved it to a motion court to have something ordered.
      A 2nd cc can be booked, but most of the time the moving party doesn't want that. A motion and a conference are totally different.

      The experience I have seen and heard (based on reading and talking with a lawyer) shows that many cases go to another conference (normally settlement) before going to a motion. There a number of posters on this forum alone who have experienced crazy conference situations that were completely unexpected INCLUDING having a second, third and fourth conference scheduled.
      A 2nd sc or tmc is ok. You're making your way to trial. But it's very common for various motions to be brought along the way.

      For Nadia, she has a straightforward case with full disclosure. If her ex continues to drag his feet she has a case to go to a hearing. For others, if their ex refuses disclosure but additional conferences are needed, they will be held.
      ... yet you said book another cc.

      And before you drag me for that, Ive asked about the conference process and have been told the different ways they are played out whether a second or third or settlement after dro/cc or going straight to a hearing. While you *CAN* file to push it through, if it is going to piss off the judge that you jumped the queue, I would always advise on the side of caution. I gave my opinion based on how things went and what our lawyer (who does this and is a certified expert in family law) said. Yes my fiancé could have filed for a follow conference or a motion but as we have seen, his ex refuses to provide disclosure even with an order to do so. They have a settlement conference booked for the summer. A DRO conference, a motion for disclosure and an order were unsuccessful in accomplishing what you said a hearing would.
      I'm no lawyer or expert. I just have a basic understanding of the court process and what a cc is.

      Comment


      • #18
        https://www.separation.ca/help-centr...se-conference/

        https://vogel-llp.ca/what-is-a-dro/

        https://www.simpledivorce.ca/case-co...io-family-law/

        https://stepstojustice.ca/steps/5-co...ourt-process-1

        Your case may have been straightforward and did not require additional conferences but that doesn’t mean others have the same situation. Everything I have read indicates that an additional conference is required following a DRC or a cc which had an order for disclosure. Even a settlement conference.

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        • #19
          The first time around, I did multiple sc's and tmc's, ept, and all the motions in between before trial. None of which were possible without completing 1 cc.

          If you would like to play cautiously, I would suggest recommending people book a sc as opposed to another cc.

          http://www.ontariocourts.ca/scj/prac...nt_Conferences

          Comment


          • #20
            At the conclusion of the case conference, the presiding judge will either schedule a settlement conference or give directions to the parties about scheduling their next step. If a motion is required, the parties should agree to deadlines to file their material, so that all material will be filed no later than 2 p.m. three business days before the motion is scheduled to be heard.
            At DRO conferences the presiding member doesn’t order anything which is why I say book a CASE conference.

            Nadia’s case involves section 7 stuff which is always disputed. Depending on what happens in the DRC, a settlement conference may be the next step. Again, it depends on how reasonable her ex is and what happens if he does show up. Only she will know that and not until tomorrow. DRC are not like a conference where the judge says “we’ll book the next conference” which is why I recommended she book the next appearance following the conference because nothing is really accomplished at them.

            Comment


            • #21
              Read a little further down...

              Motions to Change

              A request to change a final order is made by filing a motion to change under Rule 15. The first case conference on a motion to change a final order or agreement shall be scheduled before a Dispute Resolution Officer (DRO) for those centres that have a DRO program (Barrie, Newmarket and Oshawa) in accordance with Part I of the Consolidated Provincial Practice Direction

              Originally posted by rockscan View Post
              At DRO conferences the presiding member doesn’t order anything which is why I say book a CASE conference.
              They accomplish the same thing as a cc with a judge. They'll have no issue booking another cc, or a sc if you want. The consequences are huge depending on whether you stay at a cc or move forward with your case.

              Nadia’s case involves section 7 stuff which is always disputed. Depending on what happens in the DRC, a settlement conference may be the next step. Again, it depends on how reasonable her ex is and what happens if he does show up. Only she will know that and not until tomorrow.
              Which is why she should schedule a sc and not another cc. Then it's up to her whether she brings a motion before or after the sc.

              DRC are not like a conference where the judge says “we’ll book the next conference” which is why I recommended she book the next appearance following the conference because nothing is really accomplished at them.
              I give up....

              Comment


              • #22
                Did you have a DRC in your case?

                If not then stop commenting on what happens at them. They are a special ring of hell that even lawyers hate.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by rockscan View Post
                  Did you have a DRC in your case?

                  If not then stop commenting on what happens at them. They are a special ring of hell that even lawyers hate.
                  I've mentioned several times that I have and why it is a cc with DRO yet still a cc. I think this is the 3rd thread I've tried to explain it to you, but I respect the idea of your post.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    For a Motion to Change one cannot schedule a motion hearing without first having some kind of case conference first. The idea is for reasonable parties to try and get what they can off the table so to speak. Obviously if one or both parties are completely unreasonable it is not helpful to schedule another case conference. If however, it appears the parties are close to an agreement on most issues, it would make sense to schedule another case conference to iron out the details, give folk more time to think and avoid costly litigation. In short. I think it is decided on a case by case basis. So, you are both most likely correct.

                    All That I know is that the only Orders made at a Case Conference are by consent. The case conference brief is removed from the continuing record. The whole point of a case conference is to get parties to reach some sort of consensus on issues they can and narrow other issues for litigation. Depending on who the DRO officer is, you could request and receive procedural orders related to disclosure.

                    I was led to believe that after the DRO and assuming nothing is agreed via consent, I can proceed to a Motion Hearing. And there are so many unknowns and no certainity. Will the OP turn up and attend tomorrow? I am assuming nothing is going to be straight forward. What biases will the DRO officer have? All I know is that it is going ahead. I’ll keep you guys posted.
                    Last edited by Nadia; 01-10-2019, 04:22 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      To make it even more complicated, at the motion date last year, while going through the docket first thing, the judge told a few cases to go back and settle certain issues based on his recommendation and then come back for his endorsement. My fiance’s case kept getting interupted by the lawyers coming in and asking questions.

                      Even if your ex does show tomorrow, unless he agrees on consent, not much will happen. Listen to the person overseeing the conference, see what your ex disagrees on, make an offer to settle after and then decide on the next step that works for you.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        [QUOTE=rockscan;233090]To make it even more complicated, at the motion date last year, while going through the docket first thing, the judge told a few cases to go back and settle certain issues based on his recommendation and then come back for his endorsement. My fiance’s case kept getting interupted by the lawyers coming in and asking questions.”

                        That is not unusual. Especially when there are several motions on the docket. A good judge will often send parties outside to see if they can reach an agreement by themselves. To be honest it’s probably the best way. Far better than asking a complete stranger to make a decision based on sworn affidavits and oral arguments only.
                        Last edited by Nadia; 01-10-2019, 07:26 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Nadia View Post
                          For a Motion to Change one cannot schedule a motion hearing without first having some kind of case conference first. The idea is for reasonable parties to try and get what they can off the table so to speak. Obviously if one or both parties are completely unreasonable it is not helpful to schedule another case conference. If however, it appears the parties are close to an agreement on most issues, it would make sense to schedule another case conference to iron out the details, give folk more time to think and avoid costly litigation.
                          This is why it's so important for you to complete your cc and not book another. What you are talking about is what a sc is for. It'll give you more time and you'll end up with a judge helping you settle. It'll also give you the power to bring a motion anytime. If you schedule another cc, it can get delayed and you'll be stuck.

                          All That I know is that the only Orders made at a Case Conference are by consent. The case conference brief is removed from the continuing record. The whole point of a case conference is to get parties to reach some sort of consensus on issues they can and narrow other issues for litigation. Depending on who the DRO officer is, you could request and receive procedural orders related to disclosure.
                          This is exactly the point of the cc, whether with judge or dro. Fight to move forward with your case and don't let it be adjourned. The sc is just like a cc, but more focused on settlement.

                          I was led to believe that after the DRO and assuming nothing is agreed via consent, I can proceed to a Motion Hearing.
                          Only if you complete the cc. If you adjourn or book another one, you can't!

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            This is what happened this morning.

                            1. The OP did turn up and told the DRO that he was blindsided by the case conference and only received the materials on January 1. Hence hasn’t really had time to prepare
                            2. I produced a copy of my emails asking OP whether he wanted to adjourn sent four days ago and whether he needed more time to file his materials.
                            3. The DRO explained to the OP how child support is calculated etc and encouraged OP to at least start paying what he accepts he should be paying based on his current income. He was strongly encouraged to seek legal support on this.
                            4. Settlement/TMC conference scheduled for June to discuss contribution towards special section seven expenses.
                            5. I was told should the OP not come to an agreement regarding child support I can proceed to a motion hearing on this.

                            Next steps: I am going to send him an Offer to Settle regarding Child Support and address the other issues related to special section seven expenses at the Settlement/TMC.
                            Last edited by Nadia; 01-11-2019, 02:44 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              If the section 7 expenses are straight forward (ie: daycare, medical, tutoring etc.) then put those in your offer to settle. He is obligated to pay specific section 7 expenses regardless of whether he agreed or not. Anything else could be negotiated at the settlement conference.

                              Think he will get legal advice? He was pretty stupid to play the disclosure game and then pull the “I didn’t know” excuse...

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Yes the special section seven expenses are straightforward. We already have three separate court orders stating that the expense is both necessary for the child and reasonable for the OP to contribute to.

                                Yes it was silly of him to produce that stunt. Will he seek legal advice? I don’t know but the DRO made a note of it in her endorsement. If he doesn’t and gets served with a Notice of Motion and refuses any offer to settle - then it might back fire on him.

                                Comment

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