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Elomelo8387 · #1 07-09-2020, 08:36 AM

Hello,
My ex is claiming undue hardship citing high costs pertaining to access. We currently live about 3-4 hours apart in different cities. My son lives with me and I have been responsible for him since birth. In your respected opinions how would this play out in a motion? I don�t want to fight and want to come to a settlement but I want what is fair. The father sees the kid maybe every two weekends ( prior to Covid) and holidays was split. He also has a 6 figure income. The numbers he is spouting for access costs are absurd. He had a couple of receipts and claims he pays the rest in cash money. I am assuming he is cash strapped due to his own financial mismanagement. Would the undue hardship claim have any merit? We are both in Ontario. Any advice appreciated.
-Elo

standing on the sidelines · #2 07-09-2020, 11:36 AM

did someone move?

Elomelo8387 · #3 07-09-2020, 11:40 AM

Mother moved away for work but this situation has been status quo for a while now. Undue hardship has been a recent phenomenon.

rockscan · #4 07-09-2020, 01:56 PM

If mom moved away and took kid then he gave permission for that to happen. There should have been an agreement about access costs and support as a part of that permission. As in, ok you can move but since it costs me $200 to travel to visit I want you to either pay that or reduce child support. That was his bad in agreeing to it.

As far as undue hardship is concerned to access his child, you can also disprove that one by doing your own travel search for sending kid to him or what it costs for him to come to you. He can find all the receipts he wants, if you can show �it costs $200 for one child fare from kids home to dads home� then his complaint is moot. You could also google standard mileage rates and calculate that for the distance. Again, he let mom move to he will need to argue that.

His salary, spending, financial management etc is irrelevant. What is relevant is that he let mom move and has left it as status quo. You could turn around and offer to send kid on transit to him for his parenting time or say you will reduce cs by $100 or so a month to accommodate this expense but ultimately since he has the problem he is obligated to prove the expense and why he didnt do anything about it.

Truly though, is this worth court costs and time? Can you work together so he can see his kid?

Elomelo8387 · #5 07-09-2020, 02:01 PM

Offsetting some travel expenses sound reasonable. It�s the kids best interest to stay connected to the dad. In fact I would be agreeable to that. However he is trying to use high access to try and virtually reduce all child support. It�s extremely unreasonable and hence why this is probably going to litigation.

rockscan · #6 07-09-2020, 02:08 PM

Then the onus will be on him to prove it and a judge will look at your offer, his income and expenses and how this was agreed to. He cant reduce child support for access if he agreed to it and you offer a share of the cost. 2-3 hours is not far. My husbands costs for kids to travel five hours was never more than $200 which he paid as he moved�including when he was unemployed.

Plus if your ex argues undue hardship his household expenses will be scrutinized as well which means if he has a spouse and they have an income, both their salaries will be considered.

Best advice from me (and Im not a lawyer) is to make the offer to share the cost and then let him file the motion. The onus is on him to prove hardship and if he is still earning an income he will have a steep cliff to climb.

StillPaying · #7 07-09-2020, 10:08 PM

If this went to motion, it would seem reasonable for me that dad would get his access costs fully paid for as it was mother who moved.

Not sure what the schedule is, but if he's doing all the driving then it would seem fair that he charge you for 16 hours gas/maintenance, plus 2 nights at a hotel every 2 weeks.

How much are you both offering? You can also do all driving yourself and keep the full table amount.

Elomelo8387 · #8 07-09-2020, 11:19 PM

But what if you are not staying at a hotel but rather friends or family. Similarly reimbursement of travel expenses is fair but I don�t think it should offset the entire child support amount.

rockscan · #9 07-10-2020, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StillPaying

If this went to motion, it would seem reasonable for me that dad would get his access costs fully paid for as it was mother who moved.

What is reasonable for you is not what is reasonable for the court. Dad consented to the move without any conditions. That is the key. He should have asked for a reduction in cs as consent for the move to offset these costs. He didn�t which means a judge will see it as he was fine with it so what has changed?

Quote:

Not sure what the schedule is, but if he's doing all the driving then it would seem fair that he charge you for 16 hours gas/maintenance, plus 2 nights at a hotel every 2 weeks.

There are other modes of transportation and as the child ages they are able to use those modes. If dad chooses to drive and stay in hotels to reap more money the court will not agree to it. More than likely they will look at the most cost effective way to allow parenting time and expect both parties to come to an agreement.

StillPaying · #10 07-10-2020, 04:43 PM

Your position is not reasonable and highly unlikely at court. Access costs are common, for much shorter distances than this.

Driving is usually the cheapest mode and you can't assume a friend's house will be available. Whether it's 16 hours plus 2 nights, or 8 hours and 4 nights at hotel, or bus/taxi/hotel... it's still going to be expensive, but unlikely to be the same cost as full table support.

What does the OP think an appropriate amount should be?

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