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  • #16
    Thanks Tayken, nice research, as always Lots of cases on Canlii ensuring Life Insurance to guarantee support in case the payor passes on (with an amount diminishing as the years pass). And to continue SS, not only CS.

    Thanks for the grounding view of how litigating for insurance may seem, but I totally understand Hadenough's need for SECURITY, not profit... And having first right to an Estate can become complicated.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by torontonian View Post
      Thanks Tayken, nice research, as always Lots of cases on Canlii ensuring Life Insurance to guarantee support in case the payor passes on (with an amount diminishing as the years pass). And to continue SS, not only CS.

      Thanks for the grounding view of how litigating for insurance may seem, but I totally understand Hadenough's need for SECURITY, not profit... And having first right to an Estate can become complicated.
      You always have to balance the cost of litigation and the risk of costs being awarded against you. Judges work on the balance of probability. So you have to possibly prove on the balance of probability that the other parent is going to die before you possibly. You never know what a judge is going to do. That is why litigation is challenging. Although the rules define things in civil litigation it becomes a he-said she-said challenge and judges often have a mind of their own.

      One of the things most litigants forget often is that you are placing your "security" with a third party who may not see your need or judge otherwise. For a motion or even trial of this nature (life insurance) you are somewhat gambling on what a judge will do.

      In a situation where there is one issue like this... It may not be worth the "security" as it can open the "other can of worms" and turn into a lot of mud slinging.

      My viewpoint on it is that if you are dealing with a high-conflict individual on the other side... Some times it is best to let sleeping dogs rest.

      Good Luck!
      Tayken

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      • #18
        Hi Tayken:

        Your input are so precious. I am in the same boat as hadenough. You are 100% right the high coflict individuals will through 300 pages of affidavit. They just want to waste judges lawyers time and do not want to see ex as a winner.

        I am sure my ex has some serious plan as he is not remitting child support even he has completed his probation time. It stresses me out when I get a message from him. Yesterday, the message was (through third party) that he will add kids to his health insurance but will either deduct his premium or his share of 20% from child support. Just want to know if this is possibe without consulting me. I am sure ha can not do this. The reason he is saying because my insur. covers 80% and I had /have been paying bal of 20% with out his input. Kids has always been on my insur, and I always have been paying bal of 20%. He is suppose to pay his share of 20% but had not. How cheap this is that in order to cover his share of 20% , he wanted to deduct either premium or actual share of 20% from child support. Let 's say 20% is 300 per year, and his share 50%. Then I would be better off to pay full 300 instead of him deducting 600 for the kids insur. premium. What a cheap personality.I am glad that I am no longer with him.
        I am very sure he can not do this.

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        • #19
          He (ex) "sounds" somewhat open to the idea. It's just difficult to believe anything he says. I am frustrated by the fact that Life Ins was not included in the Final Order. It was something that I was seeking but apparently my lawyer overlooked that and now it's just a big, loose end. I would like to avoid Court if possible. Like I said, I feel cheated by the order. It was sloppy and done in haste. Not only that, I found out later that the judge and ex's lawyer had worked on opposite sides, mind you on a huge appeal case (when the judge was still a family lawyer) - a case that actually got media coverage. It was unsettling to me. There's a few things, from my trial and order that make me wonder if Judge went a little easy on ex's lawyer b/c of the clock-cleaning he was given in the Appeal case. There are other matters that trouble me as well. But that would be a whole 'nother topic :s

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          • #20
            Originally posted by singlemom View Post
            Hi Tayken:

            Your input are so precious. I am in the same boat as hadenough. You are 100% right the high coflict individuals will through 300 pages of affidavit. They just want to waste judges lawyers time and do not want to see ex as a winner.

            I am sure my ex has some serious plan as he is not remitting child support even he has completed his probation time. It stresses me out when I get a message from him. Yesterday, the message was (through third party) that he will add kids to his health insurance but will either deduct his premium or his share of 20% from child support. Just want to know if this is possibe without consulting me. I am sure ha can not do this. The reason he is saying because my insur. covers 80% and I had /have been paying bal of 20% with out his input. Kids has always been on my insur, and I always have been paying bal of 20%. He is suppose to pay his share of 20% but had not. How cheap this is that in order to cover his share of 20% , he wanted to deduct either premium or actual share of 20% from child support. Let 's say 20% is 300 per year, and his share 50%. Then I would be better off to pay full 300 instead of him deducting 600 for the kids insur. premium. What a cheap personality.I am glad that I am no longer with him.
            I am very sure he can not do this.
            Nope. He cannot do this. If the order states he is to maintain insurance on the children he has to. But, if there is no order stating that he has to... He can remove them from his policy. You should be filing the extra costs for health care as S.7 expenses if they are extraordinary.

            There are many things high-conflict individuals do to avoid minor costs... But in the long run... Penny wise... Pound foolish.

            Good Luck!
            Tayken

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            • #21
              No that's correct. He can't do that. What a tool. Yeah my X once said he would deduct a pair of running shoes ($45) from the CS (he was "voluntarily" paying $300/month- that amt has quadrupled on his imputed income). Whaaatever. Don't let it stress you. Hot air from a hot head, bag of wind that has nothing better to do but be petty. Yes - thank Christ we got rid of these losers. I'm in a particularly emotional mood today, so I'm sorry if I sound a little extra pissy with my x-slamming, lol... It's all about control. These bs little things they threaten. They just can't stand it that they lost their control, and we kicked them to the curb. My ex was on probation too. Still, he denied all, throughout court and trial. Who cares? The only one that believes his crap is his new wife. The next "victim" - I really believe she'll be calling me one day.

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              • #22
                Speaking of "foolish" - the genius X has said n the past he'd rather spend every penny on lawyers than pay "me" more CS. This was usually attached to a remark that he'd see me penniless and homeless.. Yes. A total Genius. I have heard just about every threat there is. It took awhile before I became capable of laughing at some of them. FEE FI FO FUM. Omg. Total Idiot. How can you not laugh? The latest was how he will tell "fro" - "when they come knocking on his door, that he's broke." Yes, in his world, FRO knocks on the door. My my., isn't he in for a surprise? The way he tells it, (once they "knock on his door") he'll simply tell them he's "broke" and just like Jehovah's Witnesses, they will smile, say "thank you for your time sir" and be on their way. Must be kinda nice to live in such a fantasy world. :/ I wonder if the fro-fairies will at least give him a booklet to read, at his leisure??? Crrrrrazy!

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by hadenough View Post
                  Speaking of "foolish" - the genius X has said n the past he'd rather spend every penny on lawyers than pay "me" more CS. This was usually attached to a remark that he'd see me penniless and homeless.. Yes. A total Genius. I have heard just about every threat there is. It took awhile before I became capable of laughing at some of them. FEE FI FO FUM. Omg. Total Idiot. How can you not laugh? The latest was how he will tell "fro" - "when they come knocking on his door, that he's broke." Yes, in his world, FRO knocks on the door. My my., isn't he in for a surprise? The way he tells it, (once they "knock on his door") he'll simply tell them he's "broke" and just like Jehovah's Witnesses, they will smile, say "thank you for your time sir" and be on their way. Must be kinda nice to live in such a fantasy world. :/ I wonder if the fro-fairies will at least give him a booklet to read, at his leisure??? Crrrrrazy!
                  Yes well, you married him and had children with him. Doesn't speak well for you does it?

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Billm: very funny and no I actually did not marry him. I am embarrassed and ashamed that I was EVER w/him and often in Court even felt shame for having been w/him. But hey, on this site - I have yet to see anyone depicting their x's as some wonderful, caring being so the good news is, I'm in good company. Ppl don't come w/hazmat warning signs. Obviously I didn't know he was a complete moron when I first met him.

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                    • #25
                      As my wife likes to remind me when my ex's insanity ramps up...."You stuck your dick into crazy...or for our female members (so as not to make them feel left out)...You let crazy stick it's dick in you."

                      I have learned not to engage in the games. It's far easier to let her spout off, document it and just ignore her. I have thousands of emails and other documents to back my position up, but arguing with stupid just creates MORE stupid.

                      It's NOT about being right to the ex, it's about the thrill of the argument. Deprive them of that and they eventually will get bored.

                      From reading through this forum, I am definitely NOT alone in this.

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                      • #26
                        NBdad - so true. I don't argue w/him. I don't even speak to him. Having an argument w/him would be akin to trying to argue w/a developmentally delayed person. I do know, there is absolutely nothing to be gained from arguing w/him.. Luckily, our child is a wonderful, sensitive, kind person. He did not pick up the loony-gene that appears to run rampant in the ex's lineage. I believe it must have skipped a generation (my son's) as there's no other explanation.

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                        • #27
                          For some reason the last Child Protection Social worker looked all offended when I laughed at her for suggesting the "children would benefit from seeing the two of you having a rational conversation."

                          I had to explain that I hadn't had a rational conversation with her in years, and the whole reason my court order exists the way it does is to allow me the freedom to no longer have to attempt rational conversations with bat shit level insanity.

                          Unfortunately I'm not overly pleasant to the Social Development people these days....6 false allegations in under 3 years tends to have that effect. Anything new opened typically involves a game of "hot potato" as they bounce it from area to area, until it winds up with someone who is too new, or too specialized to be able to refuse it. They don't want to touch it, and in any other situation I'd find it vastly amusing.

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                          • #28
                            It's terrible that resources which are already stretched thin (and often not all that helpful) have to be abused by false claims/allegations. There are REAL circumstances that do require intervention and them running around on wild goose chases really is an abuse of the system. So is "bat shit (insane)" an Atlantic Canada term?

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by hadenough View Post
                              Billm: very funny and no I actually did not marry him. I am embarrassed and ashamed that I was EVER w/him and often in Court even felt shame for having been w/him. But hey, on this site - I have yet to see anyone depicting their x's as some wonderful, caring being so the good news is, I'm in good company. Ppl don't come w/hazmat warning signs. Obviously I didn't know he was a complete moron when I first met him.
                              My ex is an ok guy. Would I marry him again? Not a chance. But I like him, he's a decent, hard working guy. And he's proven to be a great father to our child. I left, because he didn't and could not ever make me swoon.

                              We now have some upcoming financial issues that are going to be argued. Doesn't take away from him being a great dad to our kid. And at the end of the day, I'll still think he's an ok, average guy.

                              eta: your original post is about insurance, and it reminded me that it is time I change the beneficiary of my life insurance policy.. I bought one for the ex (he was and is unaware), for $250,000 16 years ago to cover our kid if I died first and he obtained custody. Now that she is 16, going on 17, I'll change the beneficiary to my executor, in trust, for our kid's benefit.
                              Last edited by mcdreamy; 02-16-2012, 09:57 PM. Reason: eta: iinsurance
                              Start a discussion, not a fire. Post with kindness.

                              Comment

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