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What does: "until death do us part" mean to you?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by arabian View Post
    I do remember while walking down the aisle with my father I was thinking "what the f++k am I doing?"
    My mom came over for a coffee 2 nights before the wedding, and I told her then that I thought I was making a mistake. She fully encouraged me to call it off – but how do you cancel 250 guests who have pre-booked hotel rooms, a hall, caterers, florists? Water under the bridge now. However, if our kidlet calls me 2 days in advance of her wedding to share the same, I’ll be making all of the calls and cancelling everything for her.

    I posed the original question because at a recent graduation ceremony, I finally deduced that my ex will be in my life until death parts us. As a parent who separated when our kidlet was 1 and is now 22, the ex is still in my life. Do I see him daily/regularly? No, of course not.

    However when kidlet finishes her masters, plans a wedding, perhaps has some babies - those babies will have birthdays, dance recitals, and then weddings. And I fully intend on participating in all of the above – as does he.

    I suppose I’ll go to his funeral, if he dies first, and I trust he’ll come to mine, if I go first. He might dance on my grave , but I doubt it. He’ll hold himself back in front of the kidlet, and focus on being her parent, rather than on being an ex.
    Start a discussion, not a fire. Post with kindness.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Ange71727 View Post
      I don't like "til death do us part" at all. Vows should not be broken but saying I will be with you until my death is not realistic. If your spouse abuses you or cheats on you multiple times or does some other intolerable thing, the other spouse rightfully deserves an "out". My ex husband broke his vows but technically I broke them too by leaving him when I told him I'd be there until death.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      But what if the actual marriage dies...does that count?

      Marriages are contracts. If a person doesn't meet the basic contractual obligations, you should absolutely have the right to walk away.

      Or run away screaming, in my case....

      I must say though, being married for the 2nd time is beyond awesome. Its nice now understanding what marriage is supposed to be.

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      • #18
        The vows are a nice idea, but if you find yourself at 35, 45, 55, ... and miserable in your marriage, do you resign yourself to being miserable for the rest of your days and then dying? Or hoping your spouse dies young so you'll be free? Neither of these are things I wanted to think about.

        100 years ago, there was a ton of familial, church, and societal support to keep couples together, there were multiple generation under one roof, there were aunts, uncles, cousins living close by. There was no social safety net if you got sick. Children were your pension when you were too old, sick, blind, to work. Given all this, there was a lot more incentive to tough it out, mainly because there were no other options for many people.

        Today, couples are on their own, for the most part. We have government and private pensions, healthcare, savings, etc. Children are fewer and a financial minus. Families move around a lot more than they used to so you may have few to no relatives close by.

        Vows not withstanding, it's no wonder the divorce rate is up. Little external support and financial and social options.

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        • #19
          I think I heard the other day that a "starter" home in Toronto is around 550K.

          People who bought homes 20 years ago have quadrupled their investments in some cases. So older generation is doing quite well financially.

          There is huge financial pressure on people nowadays. Most people carry enormous debt-load.

          When people are working 2 jobs just to keep the roof over their heads there isn't much room for social activities or quality family time.

          Day care employees spend more time with children than their parents in many cases or children are "latch-key" kids. People are doing the best they can do but at what cost?

          It's a rat-race of enormous proportions.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
            But what if the actual marriage dies...does that count?



            Marriages are contracts. If a person doesn't meet the basic contractual obligations, you should absolutely have the right to walk away.



            Or run away screaming, in my case....



            I must say though, being married for the 2nd time is beyond awesome. Its nice now understanding what marriage is supposed to be.


            Lol PH. The death of the marriage should absolutely count!
            You're right - he broke a contract so I was entitled to run screaming......which I did. The loyalty in me had a hard time with it even though he had been about as disloyal as they come. But that just took some time to come to terms with.
            I'm happy you have found out what marriage truly should look like the second time around. I have too and I agree it's awesome to finally be at that place.


            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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            • #21
              LOL Marriage today a "contract" .....??? At first I was thinking, "No way its not a contract!! My ex broke the contract, terminated the contract and received a win fall for breaking the contract". Historically, standard business contracts require 2 or more parties to agree to a set of terms and sign a document which becomes legally binding. If one of the parties broke any of the terms of that contract, that same party would be liable for any damages, let alone entitled to any settlement funds. In my view this is ethical.

              Marriage did start out in the same way, with "Fault Divorce". When one spouse was caught either having an affair, committing a crime, was abusive etc... that spouse would not be entitled to specific luxuries such as spousal support, 50% of the property value, custody of children, retirement savings etc....depending on how the "contract" was broken. In my view this is ethical. Two people made a contract, agreed on that contract and should honor that contract. You break it...you loose your side of the investment. Cost of doing business.

              However, today we have the lovely "No Fault Divorce"; brought in first in the great state of California. The one state with the highest number of affairs per capita, as well as breast implants. I can see why they instated it. It changed the rules of marriage completely. For the first time ever, those that want to be deceitful, harmful and corrupt may do so with no penalty, no financial loss and no shame. Easy out. I'll let you guys research the percentage of politicians who have cheated on their spouse. THEN you add in the Feminists. What better way to empower a women than allow her to just get up and walk out of a marriage without any financial loss than to instate "No fault divorce". No commitments ever!! And today, 69% of divorces are initiated by women. Go women!!!

              My lovely ex wife cheated on me. I forgave her. My lovely ex wife cheated on me a second time. I forgave her. My lovely ex wife cheated on me a third time. I did not know about it. My lovely ex wife beat me. I forgave her. My lovely ex wife cheated on me a forth time and left me. Why did I stay with her? Many good friends of mine that have been through it already said....its cheaper to save the marriage than it is to divorce. Their right. Divorce cost me 50% of my kids, 55% my salary, 100% my net worth and 10% my retirement. I never broke the contract; but yet I lost. She had full control over if we divorced or not with no penalties toward her. My lovely ex wife, gets a grossed up salary of approx $70-80K from what I give her and the Trudeau Baby Benefit. Why would she try to save a marriage? She won the lottery!!!!!!!!


              So....to complete my rant; yes marriage is still a contract. Just the rules are not defined as one would assume in a standard business contract. Which is maybe why so many young people still sign the dotted line, they are assuming its a equal contract, like I did. Today the marriage contract holds zero benefit for anyone employed and earning a good salary. Why would anyone sign a contract so one sided in a business deal? You think Bill Gates would sign a contract with his business partners that state they can walk away with 50% his company, when ever they feel like it? Ya right!

              Marriage - Yes its a contract. Not a good one, actually a really bad one. "depending on your income of course "

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              • #22
                Every situation is supposed to be weighed on its own facts and then compared to previous cases (case law).

                You might find it interesting to read older case law (from 40 years ago). My "take" on it is that whomever got the kids got the house/whomever got the house got the kids.... and with it came $. Most women 40+ years ago (and many today) could not possibly come close to the earning capacity of their ex's. So naturally courts set up parameters to ensure that women and children were not "left at the curb" when husband decided it was time for a new model. I don't think that is unfair whatsoever. Call me a feminist (or whatever) but you have to realize that gone are the days when women have to live in silent servitude. You should hope the same for your daughters.

                EVERYONE pays for consequences of failed marriage.

                Alas "contract" law doesn't always protect one nowadays (as I found out). I was a full partner with my ex. When our marriage ended I was left liable for 100% of the business debt. Had I not been married to my partner I would have had recourse. Unfortunately for me (but bonus for my cheating ex) Family Law overrode contract law and I was unable to pursue my ex for the money I was defrauded. BTW I am female and while I am entitled to indefinite SS (yes even after he is collecting a pension) I will never recover financially from my losses from our business relationship.

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                • #23
                  Ice-T of Body Count and Max Cavalera have this to say:

                  ALL LOVE IS LOST!

                  [Ice-T:]
                  I thought you were my friend. I gave you my trust. I would've died for you
                  Then the second I turn my back, you fuck me over?
                  All love is lost!

                  Now you have the nerve to tell me you're sorry?
                  All love is lost!
                  You've got to be out of your motherfucking mind!
                  All love is lost!
                  You never loved me, you never fucking did!
                  All love is lost!
                  Once you betrayed me that is the fucking end!
                  All love is lost!

                  I don't give a fuck 'bout what you do with your life
                  I don't give a fuck 'bout what you do with your life
                  I don't give a fuck 'bout what you do with your life
                  I don't give a fuck 'bout what you do with your life

                  I don't give a fuck about you, you can fucking die
                  I couldn't fucking care less when you fucking cry
                  My heart's so cold, you left a broken soul
                  You destroyed everything I thought was true
                  And now you talk shit cause I don't give a fuck
                  And now I'm long gone, focus on you
                  I don't care where you are, don't care what you do
                  You say you hate me? Cool, I fucking hate you
                  (Hate you!)

                  All love is lost!
                  All love is lost!
                  You never loved me, you never fucking did!
                  All love is lost!
                  Once you betrayed me that is the fucking end!
                  All love is lost!

                  You see you the kind of motherfucker with no honour
                  The kind of motherfucker with no loyalty
                  Motherfucker you can't trust
                  Cross me, and then you want another chance?

                  One strike and I don't care about your fucking life
                  You're not no friend to me, you're fucking dead to me
                  Don't give a fuck about the shit that you was going through
                  You did some shit to me that I could never do to you
                  'Cuase I'm not no fake champ, I'm not no punk bitch
                  You're lucky I ain't put your ass in some dark ditch
                  And now you want some type of sympathy from me now?
                  If you were stabbed on the floor I'd watch you bleed out

                  [Max Cavalera:]
                  H - is for the Hell I unleash
                  A - arise the Apocalypse
                  T - I am your Terror
                  E - destroy the Enemy

                  [Ice-T:]
                  People say I'm cold-hearted
                  Why?
                  Cause you fucked over me?
                  Cause you broke every promise to me?
                  Because you said you were my friend and then you stabbed me in my motherfucking...

                  All love is lost!
                  All love is lost!
                  All love is lost!
                  You never loved me, you never fucking did!
                  All love is lost!
                  Once you betrayed me that is the fucking end!
                  All love is lost!

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Newfie76 View Post

                    However, today we have the lovely "No Fault Divorce"; brought in first in the great state of California. The one state with the highest number of affairs per capita, as well as breast implants. I can see why they instated it. It changed the rules of marriage completely. For the first time ever, those that want to be deceitful, harmful and corrupt may do so with no penalty, no financial loss and no shame. Easy out. I'll let you guys research the percentage of politicians who have cheated on their spouse. THEN you add in the Feminists. What better way to empower a women than allow her to just get up and walk out of a marriage without any financial loss than to instate "No fault divorce". No commitments ever!! And today, 69% of divorces are initiated by women. Go women!!! "
                    the definition of Irony: attempting to claim male bias, while referring to breast implants and the empowerment of women in the same paragraph.
                    Start a discussion, not a fire. Post with kindness.

                    Comment

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