Proportionate vs pro rated?

[roxyroller71]

What's the difference?
In the parenting agreement we agreed proportionately 75% and me 25%.

Now in the new final draft that was presented by my ex and his lawyer the above is not mentioned...which Makes me nervous..
Nor how it's to be handled or increased.
My calculations are now 79% and mine is 21%.
Luckily we are now doing the final draft agreement and can fix this.

This is for daycare/after school costs and many outstanding dental/medical costs as he doesn't pay anything else.
I need to be careful on this and want to make sure his portion is paid and mentioned for university etc.
That being said...I don't want to keep being taken for a ride. He has owed me so much money in the past that I have walked away from and "forgiven" ...I feel like payday loans! Never mind the house, furniture, cars etc. When we were together he nickelled and dimed everything and made me jump through the hoops.
I just want it black and white.

[FightingForFamily]

I'm currently arguing with my ex about something similar. Our agreement requires that we exchange NOAs and adjust our Section 7 split each year. However my ex is self employed and most of her income is actually CCTB and other government benefits. Her NOA has only a fraction of her income on it.

In the past she has disclosed her government benefits and we used them as part of the income for splitting S7 expenses.

Except this year for some reason she won't disclose it, except to demand that my proportion go up almost 20% with no explanation given.

So my suggestions are:

-Yes, include a method for adjusting S7 each year. Be specific (ie quote S7 of the CSG since it mentions how the S7 expenses include benefits, subsidies and tax breaks)

-No, don't include adjustments to it. Simply split all expenses 50/50 which is fair and no one can easily disagree with.

-Include a flat $$ amount each month for estimated S7 expenses so you don't need to ever ask for extra. You may need to update this periodically (ie yearly) when you adjust your normal CS.

[Beachnana]

Its going to be a constant battle. Best to put a specific amount for daycare. Calculate out an a average year and divide by 12. A few days either way will not really matter. Put a specific amount for extra curricular activities such as swimming, scouts etc. For medical expenses make sure you have his benefits details on record at the dentist and local pharmacy so normal expenses can be submitted by the care provider.

FRO can only deal with specific numbers. So putting % proportionate to income is useless for them to enforce.

[good_mom]

[QUOTE=roxyroller71;171531]What's the difference?
In the parenting agreement we agreed proportionately 75% and me 25%.

Now in the new final draft that was presented by my ex and his lawyer the above is not mentioned...which Makes me nervous..
Nor how it's to be handled or increased.
My calculations are now 79% and mine is 21%.
Luckily we are now doing the final draft agreement and can fix this.

This is for daycare/after school costs and many outstanding dental/medical costs as he doesn't pay anything else.
I need to be careful on this and want to make sure his portion is paid and mentioned for university etc.
That being said...I don't want to keep being taken for a ride. He has owed me so much money in the past that I have walked away from and "forgiven" ...I feel like payday loans! Never mind the house, furniture, cars etc. When we were together he nickelled and dimed everything and made me jump through the hoops.
I just want it black and white.[/QUOTE]

Look...4% That the diffrence. I guess making him jump through hoops for this seems like payback. Good cash for lawyers to make on this.

read Raftus v. Raftus, 1998 CanLII 6139 and think about it.

[Beachnana]

Or

Each parent can just simply pay for what they sign the kid(s) up for in their own parenting time? That is the status quo with me

Daycare of course is proportionate to income. I also pay 100% of medical and dental because am the highest earner

The other thread talks about parents not getting kids involved and telling them nonsense....my ex constantly tells our kid to go ask me for stuff. It's not worth me taking the bait, eventually the kid will come to see them for what they are

Agree good point only pay for what you sign the child up for in time. But with daycare I would offer that he will never pay his proportion so make a calculation you can live with,and get that exact amount put into the order and register it with FRO. Then it will be deducted. EVENTUALLY,

[roxyroller71]

[QUOTE=roxyroller71;171531]What's the difference?
In the parenting agreement we agreed proportionately 75% and me 25%.

Now in the new final draft that was presented by my ex and his lawyer the above is not mentioned...which Makes me nervous..
Nor how it's to be handled or increased.
My calculations are now 79% and mine is 21%.
Luckily we are now doing the final draft agreement and can fix this.

This is for daycare/after school costs and many outstanding dental/medical costs as he doesn't pay anything else.
I need to be careful on this and want to make sure his portion is paid and mentioned for university etc.
That being said...I don't want to keep being taken for a ride. He has owed me so much money in the past that I have walked away from and "forgiven" ...I feel like payday loans! Never mind the house, furniture, cars etc. When we were together he nickelled and dimed everything and made me jump through the hoops.
I just want it black and white.

Look...4% That the diffrence. I guess making him jump through hoops for this seems like payback. Good cash for lawyers to make on this.

read Raftus v. Raftus, 1998 CanLII 6139 and think about it.

[/QUOTE]

[roxyroller71]

Look...4% That the diffrence. I guess making him jump through hoops for this seems like payback. Good cash for lawyers to make on this.

read Raftus v. Raftus, 1998 CanLII 6139 and think about it.

[/QUOTE]

To be honest its in the writing stage. I want to make sure eveything is updated and clear in the agreement. No grey areas that he can use to sneak out of helping his son. You might help ur children but not each father or mother thinks to better their chidlrens life especially when they are narcistic sociopaths who dont want to go without their BMW and dont want to take their kid to the dr or dentist. If that doesnt make u want to kick someone in the pants...I dont know what will. How many dads want that and cant get it and Im the opposite end with my ex.

He is garnished 407.00 and makes $164,100.00. check out the federal support guidelines on that gap.

yes its 4% ...u think he is jumping through hoops for 4%?
Is that a joke?

Im getting zero now...as its been over 9 yrs and finally hit the final draft stage. Its been at the final draft stage for a year now. He throws money at his lawyer to keep this rolling and refuses to provide financial info until the judge threatens him. He has kept this rolling for over 9 yrs now and no parenting agreement until recently last year only because we were going to trial.

Im not too concerned about the portioned money but how it will play out for the next 8...and then university?

I cover section seven activities. all of them. I JUST got my son on his insurance for coverage as he refused, and as I paid for these dental/medical...he pocketed the reimbursements (first bday). I pay for the private school 100%. I pay daycare etc.

so ya ...the 4% is in the agreement for maintence enforcement and courts in the future and to help my son when he has to chase his dad for help when he attends university. becuase thats my sons reality and thats my sons money.

why would i sign off when its not even right nor any provision set for the future on how proportionedwould be addressed.
The good thing is that our family wizard uploads receipts and notifies him and court that these remain unpaid and emails go unanswered and no parenting..and why is it moving along? judge threatened him with costs for wasting the judges time, him and his lawyer being late each and every time, missing child support payments etc. Im just taking advantage of the sitation to try to get everything settled up while he is paying his lawyer and is responding.

no joke.
BUt yes, I will most likely lump the 4% among everything else.
I made a bad realtionship choice and im paying for it on my own.

[stripes]

With respect to the OP's question, "pro rata" (which is what I think you mean, not "pro rated") and "proportionate to income" mean the same thing.

With respect to everything else, I agree with other posters: either put a specific amount in to cover S7 so that FRO can collect it, and/or only sign the kid up for extracurriculars which you can cover independently. If it's been nine years without an agreement, history suggests he's not likely to be willing to submit all his financials every year so that you can recalculate S7 annually.

[roxyroller71]

With respect to the OP's question, "pro rata" (which is what I think you mean, not "pro rated") and "proportionate to income" mean the same thing.

With respect to everything else, I agree with other posters: either put a specific amount in to cover S7 so that FRO can collect it, and/or only sign the kid up for extracurriculars which you can cover independently. If it's been nine years without an agreement, history suggests he's not likely to be willing to submit all his financials every year so that you can recalculate S7 annually.

This strikes a cord with me. Thank you for stating that as you are completly right in the respect to his history and coming back to financials when he doesn't do it.
That's obvious and yet my lawyer wasn't too keen on it.
(Now I can see why!?)
I will take this stance and ask for this to possibly be places to avoid the ongoing hassle. Thanks for that and I hope I have that inputted into the final agreement.
Maybe a increase each and every year on bot child support and proportionate costs by 5-10%? Whats fair? 4% Is that fair? Or is that the 4% that comes into play? I settled on 75 when it was really closer to 83% last year when it was figured out. I'm just taking a wild guess.
And then basically call it good once it's calculated on the final order.


Thanks again for the ideas and assistance. I believe that this might be more in tune to the situation. His history is there on how often he has disclosed finances.

[Beachnana]

Work the dollars out. Year 1 $xxx cs Sextionm7 $xxx. Year 2. Cs $ xxxx plus $xxx('which represents 5% increase etc etc. Fro will not deal with calculations. It,has to be $ amounts. Its only 8 years of calculations. Then figuremout what University will cost and put that as a minum amount of contributions. At least your son will get that amount.

[Beachnana]

Is the kid actually going to university i.e. do they have a place / acceptance letter, and does the other parent have this info provided to them, or is this just an assumption being made for $$$$ sake?????

So if you want to avoid constant financial battles with someone who has a history of avoiding financials then put a clause in that states upon acceptance at a post secondary educational institute and proof is provided of registration a d payment each party shall contribute to the annual costs of post secondary education for no more,than 5'years with an annual amount of $xxx payable September 1 or in 3 equal payments on x dates.

The child does not go then there is no payment. But given what the poster has indicated she needs to put something into the agreement. Putting a clause that states they agree upon consent to pay proportionate to income University fees is useless if one party does not consent and also does not disclose financials. So I merely suggested that if she wants something concrete then put a dollar amount.

[Beachnana]

Totally agree. Except OSAP is based on both parental incomes. So again no disclosure form one party means no OSAP. So a set amount is better than no amount. And who knows by then the parent will have put aside differences and actually want to help child. " a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush". Parents should all be putting aside $ for University and who knows how much it will cost. I figure $30k per year with living expenses is often the norm. So if all agree to 1/3rd each,and put a specific amount that FRO can collect. At least that is something.

[DowntroddenDad]

Totally agree. Except OSAP is based on both parental incomes. So again no disclosure form one party means no OSAP. So a set amount is better than no amount. And who knows by then the parent will have put aside differences and actually want to help child. " a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush". Parents should all be putting aside $ for University and who knows how much it will cost. I figure $30k per year with living expenses is often the norm. So if all agree to 1/3rd each,and put a specific amount that FRO can collect. At least that is something.

Sorry not unless the child is 50/50.

My parents are divorced; who do I put on my OSAP application? | Ontario.ca

OSAP will first determine if you are considered to be a dependent student.
If you are a dependent student and the parent you currently live with:

• has remarried or is in a common-law relationship: the parent you live with and his or her spouse/common-law partner need to provide information
• is not remarried or in a common-law relationship: only the parent you live with needs to provide information