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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #1  
Old 10-26-2011, 08:16 PM
Femme Femme is offline
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Default under the table babysitting?

Because my friend's ex is refusing to provide any receipts for her child care, we are questioning if she is paying under the table.

Is he responsible to pay child care expenses if she is paying under the table?

She is claiming the child care fees on her taxes...so technically she should have receipts if the government were to ask her for them right? But she has not presented him with any.

The only thing she did do was give him a piece of lined paper that she wrote on stating weeks for each month with prices beside them---is that considered proper proof by her? (Anyone can write down a bunch of numbers like that)
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:06 PM
staysingle staysingle is offline
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Without proper receipts he should not pay a dime! Has he been reimbursing her based on her ' lined paper'?

Her and her family seem like a 'real piece of work'!
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:16 PM
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No, he hasn't gave her anything towards the child care expenses yet because she hasn't gave him any real receipts--didn't think her writing numbers down on lined paper was enough proof.
I believe they have been separated since 2008 at that time the agreement stated that there was no extraordinary expenses, he was simply to pay $400 child support monthly--which he has always done--it goes through FRO.
The agreement stated that should future extraordinary expenses arise--childcare expenses, that his ex was to notify him and provide him with receipts in which he would have 20 days to pay.

Well all this time she never asked him to pay child care costs/never gave him any receipts. This june is when she first asked for him to pay child care expenses--he told her "no problem, give me receipts and I'll pay" She gave him the lined piece of paper in August. He ignored that.

September comes and she gave him a letter stating that she was requesting his 2009 and 2010 income tax statements and a current pay stub.
She wrote on the bottom of it what her income was for 2009 and 2010 (didn't provide any income tax statements or pay stub of her own)

Their agreement states that when seeking information from eachother, they must provide it in writing, both provide it within 30 days and can only ask once a year.

He responded back to her letter, stating all that--and simply wrote his incomes down the same way she did for 2009 and 2010, told her a current pay stub was not applicable as she did not provide hers---told her how many days she had left in the 30 day limit to present this stuff to him, and he'd present it back to her.

30 day limit passed...8 days later he received a letter from a lawyer, stating ex had retained her/ lawyer letter was dated past the 30 day deadline. Lawyer letter did include her income tax summary's (odd that it wasn't notice of assessments??)

lawyer said she read his letter back to his ex regarding the time limits/can only ask once a year and that unfortunately he still had to provide his income tax summary's and that he had 10 days to do so or they will be taking him to court.

So can they go back and get child care expenses from him for 2009 and 2010 even though she hasn't asked all this time/never provided him with receipts??

He doesn't have the money to get a lawyer--and since she already has custody/his access is already court ordered--is it worth getting a lawyer? what else can he lose? They can't take his access away with the children right?
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:23 PM
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Sorry for all the questions, such long responses---thank you staysingle for answering all these. Because of how dirty her and her family played at the start, he really isn't in a position to gain anything--which is why he doesn't think it is worth getting a lawyer for himself--cuz really what else can he lose. She got the house, all contents, custody of children. She has scammed him out of money through FRO.
It is a mess!
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:39 PM
staysingle staysingle is offline
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No, they are unlikely to remove his access with the children.

He should comply with her lawyers request and provide his 2009 and 2010 Notice of Assessments. Don't bother with the pay stub.

Do note that because she is the primary parent she need not provide him with her NOA or income tax info. As the payor of child support he needs to comply, on time, with providing his income documentation. Most people do this around June or July of every year. Don't engage in the " I'll show you mine, if you show me yours" dialogue. He must legally show his info for Child Support purposes alone.

Having said that, where she needs to 'legally" show her income info to him is when the question of section 7 expenses shows up. This makes sense because of the grade 6 math involved in determining each parents 'percentage' of the expensed owed based on income.

If his agreement states he is exclusively responsible for child care costs( I hope he didn't agree to this) than she doesn't 'legally' have to produce ANY income info!

If she cannot produce any legitimate receipts for the incurred expense than ignore the request for any retroactive expenses period!
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:56 PM
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His agreement states that they are to pay for child care expenses proportionately at the time of the expense and he has 20 days to pay after receiving receipt of invoice.

So if she doesn't have to provide NOA's or any of that stuff...why would they even put that in the agreement--that both of them have to provide the same information within 30 days and can only ask once a year?

It was her who solely had that agreement made for them too.

Just doesn't make sense to put all those time limits in, if it doesn't even matter.

So if the agreement states 30 days to give his income tax summary's and the lawyer requested 10 days, should he present it to them in 10 days?
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:19 PM
staysingle staysingle is offline
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He should provide his tax info tomorrow! Don't worry about her stuff at this point. Her lawyer will file in 10 days and your friend will lose plus pay for costs!

He needs to comply with the request purely on the fact he is the payor of child support.

Simply comply with the lawyers request for the info. Sit back and see where it takes him after that.

A question, what is actually going on with the child care expense ? Do you think they are trumped up or is she realizing some sort of expenses?
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:32 PM
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Her NOA's would be relevant to determine each parents proportional share of s7 expenses, so he should be providing his and requesting hers.

If it were me, I would ask to be provided with invoices for the babysitting costs so I could remit payment directly to the provider or copies of legitimate receipts for which I would cover.

Receipts that do not provide the daycare providers full details and/or a breakdown on costs will not be acceptable.
  #9  
Old 10-27-2011, 12:10 AM
beebie beebie is offline
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I am kind of thinking that whatever "agreement" they signed is what determines their obligations. Unless everybody in Ontario signs agreements which is not the case in my province.

At the same time, can you opt out of s.7?

if you can then arguably that was not part of the Agreement/contract.

but her disclosure was.
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Old 10-27-2011, 12:14 AM
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Oops sorry read it wrong.

I guess my point is: how can you determine proportionate sharing for s.7 child care expenses without NOAs for both parties?
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