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  • Peace bonds and phone access, anyone?

    Does anyone here have experience with having phone access with children while a peace bond is in place?

    There is to be no contact with my ex and I, but I've spoke to the crown three times and they've told me that doesn't include the children. I've offered my ex phone access multiple times, and asked for access when the children are with him for more than two nights as they're still quite young. He refuses to give me phone access to the kids, stating the peace bond as a reason and won't call the kids on my time either.

    I'd really like him to call the kids twice a week while they're with me. They don't mention a word about him between weekends with him and I think they need more continuity in communication. Likewise, I'd like two phone calls when the kids are with him for 7 days while they're still young. I know when they get older and have a better grasp of time and days it stops being as much of an issue but we have a few more years before that point.

    Can anyone tell me if the judge will order phone access while a peace bond is in place?

  • #2
    This is a criminal court peace bond or a restraining order from family court?

    He has an order that there be no contact. If he phones the children at your home he is breaking that order. He doesn't trust you, he is worried you would have him charged with breaking the bond. The phone records would be enough to convict him (if this were a criminal court bond.)

    How old are the children? Get them their own cell phone and both parents can use it to call them. Alternatively, the order allows email communication. Interperate that broadly and communicate with the kids through Skype or Yahoo Messenger. Or get the order recinded.

    Comment


    • #3
      I agree with Mess, He is making sure that his ass is covered and I dont blame him. You could be all okay with it then all of a sudden turn and use it against him because he pissed you off about something. Not saying you would but that is how he is thinking.

      You are probably the one who got the bond put in place so now you have to live by the rules also.

      Comment


      • #4
        I wouldn't mind getting the kids their own phone, but I doubt it would help any.

        And yes, I did have the bond put in place. He was criminally charged with a few things but I didn't see how him having a criminal record would help things at all so I asked for a peace bond. It seems if there isn't a legally binding reason for him not to harass me, he starts up again. As it is he gets as close to the line as he can in the emails

        I understand his desire to cover his ass, but on the other hand, the reason he got into this mess is because he was threatening me, and there was proof (recordings and online). If he'd just stop doing it, there wouldn't be any problems. I had intended on recording my calls with the kids to be sure I couldn't be accused of trying to talk to him. I guess I just don't see why he wouldn't protect himself that way and then he'd get to talk to the kids too.

        Thanks for your suggestions Mess.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Abeona View Post
          I'd really like him to call the kids twice a week while they're with me
          I had intended on recording my calls with the kids
          I wouldn't mind getting the kids their own phone, but I doubt it would help any.

          Offhand, you seem like a very dangerous person, legally speaking. I think that you don't want to get the kids their own phone, because then you would lose the ability to record conversations, and would be unable to stick it to your ex in court.

          I don't think you can actually (legally) record the conversation between your kids and your ex, but he may not be aware of that. I guess the kids can agree to have the conversations recorded? Not sure how it works with minors.

          If I knew that my ex recorded phone calls, I would never call. In fact, since I have no way of knowing if my ex records phone calls, I never call. All communication is through a written format. You record phone calls and you get peace bonds taken out on your ex. I wouldn't call you unless it was a matter of life and death. I think your ex doing the right thing in this case.

          Comment


          • #6
            Janus

            This is taken directly from the OP last comment

            " I had intended on recording my calls with the kids to be sure I couldn't be accused of trying to talk to him."

            In my opinion the calls she wants to record are her calls to the children, not their dads calls!

            Comment


            • #7
              i am with mess on this one, the man is on the right track, he should not make the calls you are expecting him to make, and the fact that the kids dont say a word about him may be an indicator that they comprehend that it could get him in trouble.

              plus how do the children get to him? if he comes to pick them up then is that allowed in the order? if they go to him by themselves then they are not that young.
              Last edited by sahibjee; 11-25-2012, 12:16 AM.

              Comment


              • #8
                You could request an order from the court to have a visitation supervisor (or a third party agreeable to you both) initiate a conference call between you and the kids, when they're with Dad, and between him and the kids, when they're with you.
                If either of you choose not to exercise the phone access, then the third party will keep a record of such.
                Visitation supervisor (if doing their job) would also prevent any attempt at alienation of the children by either of you.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Fedupwithcrap View Post
                  Janus

                  This is taken directly from the OP last comment

                  " I had intended on recording my calls with the kids to be sure I couldn't be accused of trying to talk to him."

                  In my opinion the calls she wants to record are her calls to the children, not their dads calls!
                  I agree, that is her stated aim. I was reading between the lines. She wants the father to talk to the kids, she doesn't want the kids to have a cellphone. She wants the husband to be with the kids, she has a peace bond taken out.

                  Something just seems off.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I've previoulsy had a peace bond against me with respect to my ex and direct/indirect communication.

                    I would not accept calls from her, nor would I call her house. Even if it were for the only reason of speaking to the children.

                    For him to do so would be in direct violation of his peace bond. If he is anything like me, I doubt he would trust the person whom took out the peace bond against him.

                    There is just too much at stake to trust you on the subject.

                    I suggest you wait until it expires, or approach a Justice of the Peace and attempt to have the conditions altered.

                    You could have the children call his residence, as there are no conditions on you - If he chose to answer and heard your voice instead of the expected childrens' voices its an easy thing to simply hang up. But again, I doubt he trusts you enough to do so.
                    Last edited by wretchedotis; 11-25-2012, 03:23 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by wretchedotis View Post
                      I've previoulsy had a peace bond against me with respect to my ex and direct/indirect communication.

                      I would not accept calls from her, nor would I call her house. Even if it were for the only reason of speaking to the children.

                      For him to do so would be in direct violation of his peace bond. If he is anything like me, I doubt he would trust the person whom took out the peace bond against him.

                      There is just too much at stake to trust you on the subject.

                      I suggest you wait until it expires, or approach a Justice of the Peace and attempt to have the conditions altered.

                      You could have the children call his residence, as there are no conditions on you - If he chose to answer and heard your voice instead of the expected childrens' voices its an easy thing to simply hang up. But again, I doubt he trusts you enough to do so.
                      I agree with WO on this one. If the original poster is so concerned about the children's access then, they can do something about the peace bond then they can request the crown drop it. If the crown won't do it... Then the OP can bring forward a motion before the family law court, create a book of authorities and attach the following:

                      Shaw v. Shaw, 2008 ONCJ 130 (CanLII)
                      Date: 2008-03-25
                      Docket: 34/08
                      Parallel citations: 62 RFL (6th) 100
                      URL: CanLII - 2008 ONCJ 130 (CanLII)
                      Citation: Shaw v. Shaw, 2008 ONCJ 130 (CanLII)

                      These events have become routine and predictable in almost every allegation of spousal assault such that there is presumably some policy guiding the police and the Crown attorney and forestalling professional discretion in all such matters, no matter how remote the assault may be in time or indeed how trivial the contact. Spouses of every walk of life and often with completely unblemished prior character are routinely detained for a formal bail hearing for such assaults. Invariably, the defendant (not yet convicted) is excluded from his or her home and prevented from exercising custody of or access to the defendant’s children without any consideration of the factors that this court must apply by law before determining incidents of custody or access.
                      And they should ask this of the Family Court because:

                      Family courts decide custody and access issues on the basis of statute and case law defining the best interests of the children. The criminal justice system pays no attention to such interests because it is not geared up to do so nor are the participants widely trained in how the actions of the system — from the officer who refuses to release the defendant at the station, to the duty counsel who allows the defendant to agree to inappropriate conditions of release out of expediency — effect the lives of the members of the defendant’s family.
                      My recommendation is that if access is so important between the parents to the OP that they bring forward a motion on an urgent basis and ask the family court what it can do... Being the only court that can "decide custody and access issues on the basis of statute and case law defining the best interests of the children."

                      Good Luck!
                      Tayken

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Abeona View Post

                        Can anyone tell me if the judge will order phone access while a peace bond is in place?
                        This can only be done if the peace bond contains language that it is subject to variation by family law court order.

                        If no such language exists, a family court Judge lacks the ability to supercede a peace bond.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by wretchedotis View Post
                          This can only be done if the peace bond contains language that it is subject to variation by family law court order.

                          If no such language exists, a family court Judge lacks the ability to supercede a peace bond.
                          Actually, I'm speaking from personal experience and have sort of mixed details accidentally.

                          I know conditions of recognisance cannot be altered unless it is stipulated as such. I do not know this for a fact re: peace bonds. But it would stand to reason.

                          Comment

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