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  • Section 7 expense requests ignored

    What do you do when the ex refuses to have any input on section 7 expenses?

    Scenario: Course selection for school - Kids choose their courses, we ALL sit down together to review, including the ex, and he refuses to have any input at all. Each of the kids chooses 2 - 3 courses that cost $250+ per course (on top of regular school fees). Ex refuses any input. Kids go ahead and submit course selection for the year and ex refuses to help pay for any of it stating that he's not required to pay as he didn't consent. Is he 'off the hook', so to speak, if he refuses to have any input?

    So far I've covered the cost of the courses for one kid myself up to this point which has been a stretch. Now with two kids in high school it`s just not realistic.

    I've sent him three different offers to settle and two different parenting plans, to which he's responded every single time that he refuses to discuss/negotiate anything with me unless I get a lawyer or arrange for mediation at my expense. He knows I can't afford either of these options.

    Suggestions?
    Last edited by blinkandimgone; 04-13-2012, 08:16 PM. Reason: the voices told me to...

  • #2
    Provide him with all your reasons as to why the expense is necessary and a reasonable proposal on how you are willing to share the cost proportionately.

    More importantly ask him if he could explain what "specific" objections he has to the child attending these courses? This will force him to think of some justification as to why he is refusing to consent to the expense other then sheer unreasonableness.

    Maybe something like the following?

    Dear Mr. Unreasonable,

    As you know we sat down and discussed the courses that our son/daughter was going to select this year as a family. You were invited to provide you input at the time.

    Our son/daughter has made the selection because these courses get signed up very quickly.

    I am fully supportive of her/his choices because...I think it will of enormous benefit to him/her in the following ways....

    As you know there is a cost attached to these courses and I suggest we could share the cost in the following way...If you have any thoughts on how you would like to share the cost, please let me know. The courses have to be paid for in advance and there is a time issue to consider.

    If you do not agree with daughter/son taking these specific courses, please let me know what your "specific" objections might be.

    I would like to settle this as soon as possible as it is causing daughter/son considerable distress.

    I would prefer to settle this outside mediation or lawyers because I believe we can settle this between us and avoid the cost of mediation or legal fees.

    I look forward to hearing from you soon.

    Comment


    • #3
      I should have perhaps prefaced the above with the following questions:

      1) Is the cost unreasonable in respect to your family finances? In other words can "he" afford to contribute financially? Can you afford the cost as a family?

      2) In respect to the necessity of the cost - Are the additional courses a requirement in order to graduate high school? Will they assist with entrance to further education (e.g. University)? How will they benefit the child/children academically?

      This will determine (in my opinion) whether as you state "he is on/off the hook" for the expenses.

      Best of luck
      Nadia

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Nadia View Post
        Provide him with all your reasons as to why the expense is necessary and a reasonable proposal on how you are willing to share the cost proportionately.

        More importantly ask him if he could explain what "specific" objections he has to the child attending these courses? This will force him to think of some justification as to why he is refusing to consent to the expense other then sheer unreasonableness.

        Maybe something like the following?

        Dear Mr. Unreasonable,

        As you know we sat down and discussed the courses that our son/daughter was going to select this year as a family. You were invited to provide you input at the time.

        Our son/daughter has made the selection because these courses get signed up very quickly.

        I am fully supportive of her/his choices because...I think it will of enormous benefit to him/her in the following ways....

        As you know there is a cost attached to these courses and I suggest we could share the cost in the following way...If you have any thoughts on how you would like to share the cost, please let me know. The courses have to be paid for in advance and there is a time issue to consider.

        If you do not agree with daughter/son taking these specific courses, please let me know what your "specific" objections might be.

        I would like to settle this as soon as possible as it is causing daughter/son considerable distress.

        I would prefer to settle this outside mediation or lawyers because I believe we can settle this between us and avoid the cost of mediation or legal fees.

        I look forward to hearing from you soon.
        pretty good except I would take out the part about it causing distress to the kids. No where did the blink say it was and to me that is using emotional blackmail.

        I would just send one asking what his objections are, why he didnt voice these objections as the kids were picking the courses as he was right there and asking to talk about it to resolve it ASAP. Give him specific dates when the money has to be paid and see what happens. To me if he didnt object when the courses were picked right in front of him, his silence was implied consent to the courses.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by standing on the sidelines View Post
          To me if he didnt object when the courses were picked right in front of him, his silence was implied consent to the courses.
          This is my biggest dilemma right here^^. If/when we do get an agreement hammered out, I assume it will include that he must give his consent for S.7 expenses prior to incurring the expense. If he absolutely refuses to give any input one way or the other is it implied consent?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by blinkandimgone View Post
            If he absolutely refuses to give any input one way or the other is it implied consent?
            This seems logical to me in your situation. The ex was fully aware of the courses but didn't object in anyway. What retort could he possibly have?

            Comment


            • #7
              His 'retort' is that he didn't consent.

              Comment


              • #8
                He didn't not consent either, and it's patently obvious that the kids have to choose subjects to take at school. Any discretion about which subjects to take is severely limited by their interests and their career goals. School is not an optional expense with discretion to tell the kids "sorry, we can't afford it," as though it were hockey.

                If it was tuition, he'd be on the hook even if he didn't consent to the kids going to university. The same should hold here.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Been there. Had to resort to a meeting with our lawyers. His lawyer told him that he had to pay if he was given the opportunity in advance to take part and since it is for his children's educational best interests.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Rioe View Post
                    He didn't not consent either, and it's patently obvious that the kids have to choose subjects to take at school. Any discretion about which subjects to take is severely limited by their interests and their career goals. School is not an optional expense with discretion to tell the kids "sorry, we can't afford it," as though it were hockey.

                    If it was tuition, he'd be on the hook even if he didn't consent to the kids going to university. The same should hold here.
                    Yeah, this is going to be an issue as well. He's already informed me and the kids that he has no intention of supporting them financially for post-secondary expenses.

                    Oy.

                    Thanks to everyone for the responses.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      He's in for a nasty wake up when he's ORDERED to pay post secondary expenses. Divorced parents are on the hook for the first degree. Good luck and stand fast...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks T, I'll probably need it!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by blinkandimgone View Post
                          His 'retort' is that he didn't consent.
                          Well, I don't believe that retort would be justifiable. As Rioe pointed out, he "didn't not consent either", even though he was fully aware of the courses that the kids chose. His actions show ill will.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Wow - Can you say Passive Aggressive?

                            What sucks is that you have to be on the winning side of the cost/benefit or it's like pissing into the wind.

                            My lawyer has advised me to keep a tally of all the section 7 expenses that I have paid and when it gets to be a substantial amount (and that will vary by situation), then I will file a form whatever at the courthouse and he will be notified that I am taking him to court over the amount.

                            The poopy thing is that usually the Judge can only order a set amount after the expenses have already been incurred.

                            But - it will get him to the table ????????

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Ummmmmm - just thinking here - and no it doesn't hurt all that much - but since when do Section 7 expenses only become split when there is agreement or consent?

                              I know that extra curricular and extraordinary expenses usually have the "consent" factor, but post secondary eductation does not, nor does child care, and they are both section 7 expenses.

                              You may want to take a look at whether he actually needs to consent at all!

                              Comment

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