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Parenting Issues This forum is for discussing any of the parenting issues involved in your divorce, including parenting of step-children.

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  #1  
Old 07-30-2011, 03:11 PM
winterwolf7 winterwolf7 is offline
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Default Hurt ay Daycare, apprehended by CAS??

A friend of mine had her child returned from daycare with a serious injury to the babies penis. We have no idea what happened, but some kind of trauma either biting, kicking or pulling was done, leaving blood in the diaper and severe bruising. It was discovered at bath time that evening.

Not knowing what else to do, my friend took her baby to the emergency room. Now, a week later, Children's Aid society has removed both of her kids without even a word when she might get to see them again. They pressured her to sign a temporary custody agreement with them awarding supervised custody to her ex husband.

Her child was a victim at daycare, and now she is been made even worse a victim. Her and her ex husband had a good functioning arrangement with access and there have been no concerns of abuse by anyone in the situation. The baby is just learning to walk and thus has a good number of bruises, not to mention the normal amount of marks on him for being an active boy in a home daycare environment. Citing the bruises and the penis injury was the CAS worker's motive for removing the child from her mother.

What should my friend do? There has been no indication of what CAS has in mind other than to pursue a witch hunt of my friend and her entire family. Everyone (friends, family, daycare providers) are being ruthlessly investigated by CAS and have polygraph tests of everyone has been demanded until they "get to the bottom of this".

If everyone CAS and the police are questioning decides to lawyer up, we will all go bankrupt. We have just barely survived our family court matters in resolving our separations. We still owe tons of money to our family lawyers, and now we need MORE lawyers?

Personally I believe all of us have been through enough and I'm not willing to be subjected to a polygraph.

Thoughts please.
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Old 07-30-2011, 04:37 PM
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If CAS does nothing and the child ends up later being found bludgeoned to death or living chained in a basement, they will be pilloried. They are not engaging in a witchhunt, they are investigating a situation in the manner they are required to do.

For all you know your friend took a razor blade to her babies penis. Of course you take her side, that is what friends are for. The CAS has to eventually file a report, the report is based on facts, not on your opinion.

If my child came home from daycare with an injury like that and there was no report from the daycare, I would have called the police on my own and had the daycare investigated. Your friend didn't do this. Hence the investigation.

The situation sucks but the fact is, your friend has to see the investigation through to the end.
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Old 07-30-2011, 04:54 PM
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Polygraph tests? Really? It was my understanding these are inadmissable in court. If thats the case I wouldn't have thought it was a tool they would use.

Sounds horrible, I can't imagine how intrusive that would be. I hope it sorts itself out soon.
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Old 07-30-2011, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winterwolf7 View Post
Not knowing what else to do
a parent would usually call the police and have them investigated right away.

And why wouldn't you take the polygraph in this situation, they can't be used in Court but they can point the investigators in the right direction and clear your friend of any wrongdoings. The sooner you take it, the sooner your friend will see her kids. Obviously there's some misunderstanding here.
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Old 07-30-2011, 09:20 PM
winterwolf7 winterwolf7 is offline
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Simply put, why would I put my fate in the hands of a test that is only 60% effective when a flat guess would be 50/50. At best it's a tool for intimidation. If you won't do one, you become a target, if you do one and pass the investigation goes nowhere, and if you do one and fail, you become a target anyways. There's no advantage to participating especially when every person involved is being asked to do one yet no one is being charged. Every single lawyer we have consulted (5+ lawyers) all advise to never take a polygraph under any circumstances for any reason. Most of them advised all of us to stop talking to the police altogether.

This might be good defensive advice, but it won't help my friend get her kids back any time soon and I really want to help her.

The problem is, they have isolated everyone and made everyone think they are a suspect, so everyone is very nervous even if they have no knowledge of what happened or didn't even see the child that day (I was at work for example).

I don't have to take my friend's word because I was there in the room when the diaper was removed and she started screaming. Even if you are completely innocent, any kind of serious allegations or charges of sexual abuse can basically end your life. And once CAS has their hands on your kids, they will never close the file, even if everyone is cleared and no charges are laid.
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Old 07-30-2011, 09:33 PM
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So you took the diaper off, saw the blood and didn't notify the authorities. What exactly are you complaining about?
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Old 07-30-2011, 09:49 PM
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Nope sorry, we were too busy attending to the injury of a 15 year old baby to stop and call a family lawyer at the time. And whether or not we called the police, as soon as the baby arrived at the hospital, I think the same thing would have happened anyways. Social worker, CAS and police were brought in almost immediately.

I just can't believe we've survived a year in divorce hell to barely get our heads above water and now be faced with this. All we want to do is put our lives back together and build a future, and the intensity and emotional strain of this kind of investigation feels like the worst part of the divorce all over again... ESPECIALLY THE PART WHERE YOU LOSE YOUR KIDS!

Except this time there's no opponent on the other side to negotiate with. This is a private agency empowered by the government and above the police who you have very little rights when it comes to dealing with.

It's just unbelievable torture to finally settle custody with your ex, and then watch it all go out the window as soon as CAS steps in, tosses your agreement out the window, and arbitrates whatever they feel like to the parents who worked so hard to come to an agreement. My friend lives for her kids, they changed her life and she has done everything for them, yet tonight they are still sleeping somewhere else not understanding what's happening or why they can't see their mom.

Did I mention they took her still-nursing baby away? He hasn't even been weaned but that didn't stop them.

Maybe I'm just venting about the situation and how unfair it is now.

I think, objectively, two mistakes may have been made so far in how she and I handled the situation. As you point out, calling the police immediately may have helped. Secondly, my friend should not have signed any agreements with CAS that caused her to lose custody, especially as she had not consulted a lawyer, no one has been charged, and no evidence had been produced for examination by a judge. She has made it all too easy on them for them to do whatever they want with her kids instead of forcing CAS to go before a judge, present their case in order to get a court order first.

I believe in general the way to "deal with CAS" is to do exactly what they ask you, no matter how repugnant or pointless, because there's simply no way to fight them or win. You can only appease them and hope it works and you'll get your kids back. The problem is that it may still take week or months.
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Old 07-30-2011, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winterwolf7 View Post
Nope sorry, we were too busy attending to the injury of a 15 year old baby to stop and call a family lawyer at the time.
So what was the reason to call to a family lawyer? The baby is bleeding and she calls a family lawyer? Little lost here
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Old 07-30-2011, 11:07 PM
winterwolf7 winterwolf7 is offline
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We didn't call anyone, we ran straight to the ER. It's a bloody diaper and a penis that looks like raw meat, for God's sake!

Mess is insinuating that we should have been covering our asses instead by calling the police instead. And to deal with CAS it's best to have a family lawyer.

But bleeding babies have a way of overriding the desire to do anything other than get them help asap.

And I meant 15 months, not years old lol.
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Old 07-30-2011, 11:39 PM
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I remember one time one of my friends children was riding a toy truck (tonka truck) and he pinched himself fairly bad in that area, so it could easily be something like that. What did the doctor say? I would work very hard to get the report from the doctor ASAP, and I mean get that as of yesterday. The CAS is way out of line with this and you and your friend need to act fast. Get that report and head to a judge as this is insane, do not take a polygraph test as that is BS. This is absolutly crazy, first off it it happened at daycare why would they take the children away from the parents, and second off if the parent did this to the child why would they take them to the ER? I mean really, not rocket science and now you have this agency that is trying to "protect" children who is completely ruining a childs life. Just one of the many examples of the stuff that they do. I urge you to check out the Canada Court watch website. What area are you living in? If you are close to where I am I can try and help you and your friend with this.
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