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LMum · #1 10-08-2021, 02:47 PM

My ex's lawyer has asked to amend his pleadings to ask for SS. My income is significantly more then his. He did work throughout our whole 13 year relationship/marriage, except 1 year when he stayed home with our then 2 year old.

He has been supporting himself quite comfortably and has moved in with this significant other this year.

During the common law and marriage I paid most of the household bills. Not because I offered, but because he was a spender and spent money only on himself. Purchased big items behind my back, didn't pay his own bill half the time, etc. I would have to bail him out.

Now that the marriage is over he's even worse with spending his money, and he doesn't pay CS even though our child lives with me. OCL sided in my favor but there has been no settlement or court order yet.

My questions, or rather looking for opinions maybe. Does he meet the criteria to get SS?

rockscan · #2 10-08-2021, 03:04 PM

Are they trying to get you to accept an offer to settle? It could be a threat tactic. Make you settle because you don�t want to pay spousal.

Based on what you said I don�t think he is entitled and if he was still able to work and achieve promotions/career changes then he is more than likely not entitled.

LMum · #3 10-09-2021, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockscan

Are they trying to get you to accept an offer to settle? It could be a threat tactic. Make you settle because you don�t want to pay spousal.

They have offered and CS/SS swap. Which we will say no. Otherwise yes (hopefully) it maybe a threat tactic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockscan

Based on what you said I don�t think he is entitled and if he was still able to work and achieve promotions/career changes then he is more than likely not entitled.

He doesn't hold down jobs well. He mostly quits, but can find another one pretty quick (he a grass is greener type of guy). In our time together he's has 15 different jobs. This last one seems to have held though as its been over a year.

rockscan · #4 10-09-2021, 01:21 PM

Explains it. He wants to avoid cs so hes asking for ss to even it off. Doesn�t mean he�s entitled.

If he quit his jobs then it�s not sacrificing his career for yours. You could also look at what he is capable of doing and counter that you will request an income be imputed. That way with a final order he�s locked into cs and would need to keep a job.

pinkHouses · #5 10-12-2021, 12:53 PM

Spousal support, that will be tax deductible for you. Child support is not.

No one cares what his spending habits were during the marriage. yeah, marriage is a bad deal.

If your income is 200K and his is 30K you owe him spousal. He will have an imputed income, IDK how that goes may be on the last job he quit or was fired from.

Get a termination clause for spousal support. Sometimes a payout works; also get it in a separation agreement if you can.

rockscan · #6 10-12-2021, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinkHouses

If your income is 200K and his is 30K you owe him spousal. He will have an imputed income, IDK how that goes may be on the last job he quit or was fired from.

Get a termination clause for spousal support. Sometimes a payout works; also get it in a separation agreement if you can.

I don�t know if this is necessarily correct. He would have to prove entitlement and refusing to work or having a pattern of quitting jobs may work against him.

As for the termination clauses, he has a new partner so this is sometimes a termination clause in agreements which means his household income could be different.

Best to ask your lawyer about entitlement and tell the lawyer you want brutal truth not a �welllllllll�.� kind of response.

pinkHouses · #7 10-12-2021, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockscan

I don�t know if this is necessarily correct. He would have to prove entitlement and refusing to work or having a pattern of quitting jobs may work against him.

They have no agreement and so not clause yet.
He is still employed and if he is seeking spousal it means she was and still is making more.

What is the entitlement thing to be proven?

rockscan · #8 10-12-2021, 06:20 PM

Spousal isn�t a given just because she makes more. He has to prove entitlement to spousal. It�s not automatic like child support.

Agreement or not, he has to prove he is entitled to spousal and it�s not automatic because she earns more. Plus she can counter that he is purposely under employed and not entitled to spousal.

ETA from the Divorce act:

Factors

(4) In making an order under subsection (1) or an interim order under subsection (2), the court shall take into consideration the condition, means, needs and other circumstances of each spouse, including

(a) the length of time the spouses cohabited;

(b) the functions performed by each spouse during cohabitation; and

(c) any order, agreement or arrangement relating to support of either spouse.

Marginal note:Spousal misconduct

(5) In making an order under subsection (1) or an interim order under subsection (2), the court shall not take into consideration any misconduct of a spouse in relation to the marriage.

Marginal note:

Objectives of spousal support order

(6) An order made under subsection (1) or an interim order under subsection (2) that provides for the support of a spouse should

(a) recognize any economic advantages or disadvantages to the spouses arising from the marriage or its breakdown;

(b) apportion between the spouses any financial consequences arising from the care of any child of the marriage over and above any obligation for the support of any child of the marriage;

(c) relieve any economic hardship of the spouses arising from the breakdown of the marriage; and

(d) in so far as practicable, promote the economic self-sufficiency of each spouse within a reasonable period of time.

pinkHouses · #9 10-12-2021, 07:46 PM

He isn't under employed as far as the post goes.
She said he worked the whole time except for one year taking care of the kids.

They put up with their ex all these years and as the responsible, more capable partner will have to pay SS.

Are you saying the new house and partner will reduce what a judge will award?

rockscan · #10 10-12-2021, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinkHouses

He isn't under employed as far as the post goes.
She said he worked the whole time except for one year taking care of the kids.

If he quits as a way to argue entitlement then yes he is underemployed.

Quote:

They put up with their ex all these years and as the responsible, more capable partner will have to pay SS.

Again, not how it works. Not every spouse is entitled to spousal and her earning more is not a golden ticket.

Quote:

Are you saying the new house and partner will reduce what a judge will award?

A judge will only award what someone is entitled to. Not to mention that in some spousal awards it is to support them moving forward. If he has a new partner who is earning good money and contributing to his lifestyle then he may not be entitled. Much like many men who have to pay spousal, there is a clause option that should the ex cohabitate or find a new partner, ss ends.

All of this is why I asked about the timing around the demand. Ex sounds like he wants to avoid child support or push his agenda so he is claiming spousal as a way to scare OP into giving him what he wants. A good lawyer will be able to determine entitlement and argue against it.

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