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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #1  
Old 07-19-2021, 09:46 PM
nofrills nofrills is offline
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Default Passports

Hello everyone,
Hoping you can give me an opinion or some advice.

In my agreement, I keep the passports and provide the passports to the ex when she wants to travel. We also exchange consent letters when traveling outside of Canada.

It's been about 6 years since the agreement was signed. We agreed I would have the passports and she would have the health cards.

Now, the ex want to take me to mediation or court to get the passports. I said no and she says she going to win and make me pay for court costs.

I have always provided the passports and signed the consent letters.

Two years ago, she went out of country and told me she was going to keep the passports after returning. I told her that's a bad idea, she returned them a few days afterwards.

Is there any precedence on someone being able to change who holds the passports.

thanks
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  #2  
Old 07-19-2021, 11:35 PM
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What % of parenting time do you have?
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Old 07-20-2021, 09:17 AM
arbortrail22 arbortrail22 is offline
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This sounds like a ridiculous thing to take some to court over. Threats...

If you do share custody- I would send a formal letter that she has the passports the first half of the year and you hold the medical cards. Then at June 30, you switch and you hold the passports and she holds the medical cards. Seems like a very fair approach and I doubt you would be awarded costs if you present an offer such as that.

This is assuming you share custody.
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Old 07-20-2021, 11:58 AM
cleanSlate cleanSlate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arbortrail22 View Post
This sounds like a ridiculous thing to take some to court over. Threats...

If you do share custody- I would send a formal letter that she has the passports the first half of the year and you hold the medical cards. Then at June 30, you switch and you hold the passports and she holds the medical cards. Seems like a very fair approach and I doubt you would be awarded costs if you present an offer such as that.

This is assuming you share custody.
That sounds fair and even and I too do not understand why this is a thing.
Oh wait, I do understand that this isn't really about those items at all, this is about something else.

All you are doing is fighting over physical custody of non-tangible items. Especially the Health Cards, I have always gotten by with a picture of the health card.

Personally, I would not give an inch. That was the agreement and they seem to simply want to cause problems right now for some reason and bully you in to this, then it would be something else. This is just based on my experience....Arbortail sounds move level headed.
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Old 07-20-2021, 12:10 PM
rockscan rockscan is offline
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Your ex has a history of being combative and uncooperative. Let her spew her nonsense. Tell her simply that in accordance with the agreement you keep the passports and she has the health cards and there have been no issues with providing either document when needed so you see no need for a change.

If you wanted to take it further you could add that if she feels that it is necessary to bring the matter to court then you will be seeking relief on several other issues over the years including her withholding the children and making false allegations.
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  #6  
Old 07-20-2021, 07:47 PM
nofrills nofrills is offline
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thanks for everyone's input.

@coolGuy41, I have the kids 6/14 days, shared custody.

My alternatives that I'm thinking about.

1. I say no. She keeps the Health Cards and I keep the passports.
2. I give her the passports, but ask for $2000 collateral per passport.($2000 covers the cost of a vacation and my time booked off)
3. I split the passports with her annually.

I feel I can make this go away by giving in, but there's no upside for me.

sorry, this is just so stupid.
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Old 07-20-2021, 10:55 PM
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In your case you have a signed separation agreement that settles the issue, so I would think she would need to meet a higher threshold to get her way from the courts. I do not recall having seen case law on passport possession where the party that is seeking the passports also has to overturn an existing agreement. The reason why there is no such case law could be because it is a losing proposition to the court.

But your ex has out of court options for pissing you off such as:
1) simply not returning the passports after a trip as you said she previously threatened to do,
2) refusing to sign your travel consent letters, and
3) refusing to sign future passport applications.

Note that a child who is 16 or older may apply for their own passport (and presumably possess it).

I think she is unlikely to accept your option 2 (the $2k/passport collateral option) and I don't imagine the courts ordering such an arrangement.

I don't know what I would do in your situation (it would be either option 1 or 3). Perhaps someone else can add some words of wisdom.
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Old 07-29-2021, 12:51 AM
alongjourney alongjourney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolGuy41 View Post
I don't know what I would do in your situation (it would be either option 1 or 3). Perhaps someone else can add some words of wisdom.
Words of wisdom when dealing with someone high conflict?
When facing a choice, take the path of least effort. The result will be the same: they'll blame you and will be unhappy so might as well save your energy. Remember: you can't reason with them, even if you use facts or logic.
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Old 08-03-2021, 02:48 PM
cleanSlate cleanSlate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nofrills View Post
thanks for everyone's input.

@coolGuy41, I have the kids 6/14 days, shared custody.

My alternatives that I'm thinking about.

1. I say no. She keeps the Health Cards and I keep the passports.
2. I give her the passports, but ask for $2000 collateral per passport.($2000 covers the cost of a vacation and my time booked off)
3. I split the passports with her annually.

I feel I can make this go away by giving in, but there's no upside for me.

sorry, this is just so stupid.
Yep, stupid but not your fault.
#2 shows weakness and requires some legal agreement. They will see it as "they said yes to the passport" and they will forget their end to fulfill.

Personally...well I gave that opinion. You get nothing but grief by giving into them, and grief for not. No matter what you do they will cause you grief.

You can always file a motion to get them back and assess them costs.
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