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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #11  
Old 03-04-2019, 06:41 PM
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arabian arabian is offline
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It doesn't say much for a parent who would walk away from relationship with child over having to pay CS.

Compromise is a good thing, however, it sounds as though you have been doing more than your share of that to date.

Self-respect... stand your ground. Legal system is there for a purpose (as are maintenance enforcement agencies). Both parents ought to support children.
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  #12  
Old 03-04-2019, 09:00 PM
tunnelight tunnelight is offline
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Compromise. Such as if the other parent wants to be the holder of the child's health card (even it is a control thing) as part of a good agreement, then just agree to. I would not walk away from a good agreement that needed some silly compromise.

Don't agree to terms that don't work for you. Agree to what you know is best for your family.

If you compromise and they keep trying to take stuff being totally unreasonable , stand your ground and say it may be best to have a judge decide this for us, and follow through.

Custody and Access are worth fighting for. For me, from the beginning, I indicated I would agree to joint custody and a 2.2.5.5 shared parenting regime.
I stocked with it through and indicated there is no room for compromise on those issues. The itty witty stuff, I didn't really care about. in end end, I got what I wanted and compromised on stuff that doesn't matter, like who holds the childs health card and vaccination records, I even wanted to offer to buy her a binder. My lawyer almost fell of his chair laughing .

Recently, child support. agreed to give her all the little wierd clauses and even agreed to her past made up daycare expenses she was asking for without receipts, but she didn't want CS to be adjusted to date of material change. She wanted to scam me and incur debt to me. So we ended the discussion and set it for a motion because she was just taking everything and not wanting to compromise on anything. My lawyer labeled her as greedy.

Lastly, don't get intimidated or bullied into a unfair agreement by your ex, their lawyer, or case management judge.

Last edited by tunnelight; 03-04-2019 at 09:18 PM.
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  #13  
Old 03-05-2019, 06:01 AM
Mom 2 Two Mom 2 Two is offline
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Wow this sounds like my ex... I have been made to give in to almost everything so far. And they have done nothing. I offer a compromise. They donít take it. So I guess what your saying is if they donít take it then stand your ground.

I too have SC at the end of the month. I have had sole custody for almost 6
Years. No change in material circumstance other than the ex moving 45 mins away and getting a new family. My kids donít want to live half the time with dad and his gf and her three kids. This is not in their best interest because dad doesnít parent. They struggle on the weekends they are there as it is. Iím sure they wonít give up... but I wonít either. I have to go to this conference without knowing what OCLís recommendations are. Because the ex has done nothing but stall and avoid them.

Do we have to include and offer to settle at this point?


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  #14  
Old 03-05-2019, 10:47 AM
otttawa_dad otttawa_dad is offline
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I'm a little late getting to this, having been though countless SC, I have a few words to share based on my experience
  1. Establish a list of thing you are "none" negotiable on (Parenting Time, Custody.....)
  2. Be ready to negotiate, flexible and accommodating on none issues. (Travel, Holidays, Passports.....)
  3. Make sure your SC Brief is "BRIEF"; I got nailed for cost during one of my SC's because my "BRIEF" wasn't brief.
  4. Make sure you SC brief outlines the "MAJOR" issues, don't get into the nitty gritty
  5. Produce an offer to settle based on the above
  6. Server offer to settle and make it revocable 1 Min prior to beginning of SC
  7. Seek Costs
  8. DON'T SIGN ANYTHING UNLESSS YOU ARE 100%
If unable to negotiate a deal;
then
  1. Get endorsement for outstanding disclosure
  2. Get endorsement to be place on TRIAL list
    1. I wish I would have done this earlier, I had to wait almost a full year to proceed to trial;
    2. and several other SC, prior to TRIAL
  3. Get your case "CASE MANAGED"
    1. This ensures that you get "continuity" throughout the process, and later SC
  4. SAVE YOUR RESOURCES/MONEY for trial
Here's the thing with SC's, you get a judge, he voices an opinion on the matter, "his/her" job is to encourage you to settle and avoid trial at all cost. This is 100% the truth, I've had a Judge and or Master try and pressure me to sign something right there and then, I didn't sign, I didn't agree to what he was suggesting. He threatened that I would loose at trial. Best thing I ever did was "NOT SIGN"

Another issue is, you'll likely attend another SC, and get a different Judge with a different opinion. This IMO is the real "issue" with the court systems, there is no "continuity" thought out the process, thus the parties change the "vision/expectation" on route.

IMO, SC are a complete waste of time, public funds and families resources. IMO SC are only "successful" if both parties are willing to make a deal, if one party is stuborn and unwilling to dilute their wine, then the end game is "TRIAL"


I know 1st hand, just finished a 7 day trail (took me 5 years of my kids life to get there)
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  #15  
Old 03-05-2019, 10:55 AM
Selfrepmom Selfrepmom is online now
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Mom2Two: I¬íve been following some of your posts- our situations sound very similar with some slight differences. From my experience so far though (and the knowledge I¬íve gained from this forum) stay far away from the ¬ďmy kids don¬ít want to live halftime with dad/gf/3kids, not in their best interest¬Ē argument. To a judge it will just come off as you being difficult and unwilling to help foster a relationship between your kids and their father. Don¬ít mention gf/gf¬ís kids at all.

Believe me I get it, my ex moved in with his gf last year (and her 4 kids) into her MASSIVE, very expensive home that she got to keep after her previous divorce. Oh and did I mention that he stopped paying CS the same month that he bought her the ring? It’s very easy to become bitter over this stuff, but I’ve chosen to find the small nuggets of positive hidden within:
A) I actually like his gf. She’s a nice person. She’s great with kids. Sure I find it annoying that she seems to be ok with the fact that he refuses to pay CS, but that doesn’t make her an evil person
B) Because he’s not paying CS, they have a ton of money to do fun stuff with the kids (lol) Even if it’s not me getting to do this stuff with my kid at the moment, at least she is still getting to have these experiences
C) My daughter is an only child. She now gets to experience what it¬ís like to have siblings. Yes she complains about them occasionally. But if she had actual siblings, they would probably fight like cats and dogs 24/7. At least with ¬ďbonus¬Ē siblings, she gets a break from them

If you focus on the positive, your kids will follow suite. Children absorb EVERYTHING around them, and can be influenced very easily. I do a countdown on my calendar with my daughter until her next ¬ďdaddy time¬Ē. It is awesome how something so simple has such a positive effect on her.

As for an offer to Settle: you must submit one before your settlement conference.
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  #16  
Old 03-05-2019, 11:18 AM
kate331 kate331 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otttawa_dad View Post
I know 1st hand, just finished a 7 day trail (took me 5 years of my kids life to get there)
How did that go? Do you know the outcome or are you waiting for a decision?
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  #17  
Old 03-05-2019, 11:19 AM
otttawa_dad otttawa_dad is offline
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Still waiting!


Quote:
Originally Posted by kate331 View Post
How did that go? Do you know the outcome or are you waiting for a decision?
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  #18  
Old 03-05-2019, 11:25 AM
Mom 2 Two Mom 2 Two is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selfrepmom View Post
Mom2Two: I¬íve been following some of your posts- our situations sound very similar with some slight differences. From my experience so far though (and the knowledge I¬íve gained from this forum) stay far away from the ¬ďmy kids don¬ít want to live halftime with dad/gf/3kids, not in their best interest¬Ē argument. To a judge it will just come off as you being difficult and unwilling to help foster a relationship between your kids and their father. Don¬ít mention gf/gf¬ís kids at all.


What/ how do I argue this then??? As itís really not in their best interests.


Believe me I get it, my ex moved in with his gf last year (and her 4 kids) into her MASSIVE, very expensive home that she got to keep after her previous divorce. Oh and did I mention that he stopped paying CS the same month that he bought her the ring? It’s very easy to become bitter over this stuff, but I’ve chosen to find the small nuggets of positive hidden within:

A) I actually like his gf. She’s a nice person. She’s great with kids. Sure I find it annoying that she seems to be ok with the fact that he refuses to pay CS, but that doesn’t make her an evil person

Trust me my exís gf is an evil person... I have so many reasons why... I know nothing I can do about it except teach my children to cope.


B) Because he’s not paying CS, they have a ton of money to do fun stuff with the kids (lol) Even if it’s not me getting to do this stuff with my kid at the moment, at least she is still getting to have these experiences

Great point. My ex took our kids for 4.5 days extra at Christmas break. Great!! As soon as they came home he took gf and her three kids to Toronto for 3 days in hotel and did some site seeing... and made sure to tell his kids thatís what they were doing once he dropped them off.


C) My daughter is an only child. She now gets to experience what it¬ís like to have siblings. Yes she complains about them occasionally. But if she had actual siblings, they would probably fight like cats and dogs 24/7. At least with ¬ďbonus¬Ē siblings, she gets a break from them



If you focus on the positive, your kids will follow suite. Children absorb EVERYTHING around them, and can be influenced very easily. I do a countdown on my calendar with my daughter until her next ¬ďdaddy time¬Ē. It is awesome how something so simple has such a positive effect on her.

Trust me... I am always trying to ďtalk dad upĒ to the kids.... it doesnít work as they know how he treats them... I tell them to just focus On spending quality time with him and they sayĒ he doesnít. He leaves us to play with her kids all weekendĒ



As for an offer to Settle: you must submit one before your settlement conference.


While our situations sound the same. They are very different. The gf is horrible to my kids. She was nice before they lived together and was trying to be helpful in getting their dad to parent. I agree some of what the kids complain about is sibling stuff. But other things are down right awful almost mental abuse. Is it normal for an adult to ask a child ďI heard you donít like meĒ. Then continue to yell at them and make them Bret our of her car. Then yell at their dad in public making a scene and dad making kids apologize for something they never said. My 6 year old was terrified of her for months after this.

There are so many more examples but I wonít defend myself as the kids are in therapy trying to Keene coping skills to deal with how they are treated by dad and gf.

How is it best to uproot a child after 6 years of living with mom for no apparent reason other than dad lying and saying he has been denied access. And that he canít afford to pay for said kids because he has a new family. A change is custody is all financially motivated. A father who had delayed OCL twice. Now is not answering CAS allegations, which are true. Refuses to participate in the childrenís therapy and demands he take them to his own therapist and that I am to follow all his therapists recommendations even though I wonít be included in the therapy.

I get what your trying to say. And your prob right. I Should t focus on the kids donít like gf and her kids. Itís not in their best interests to change to 50/50 because dad doesnít parent them. Doesnít go to appointments. Or school interviews. Recently I sent report cards and interview sheet. He called made appointments on his own with the teachers. I thought great.!! Guess what. No show for both kids. And he should get shared custody?? Or how about denying his kid orthotics when one of his legs is shorter than the other because itís above his means?? His share was $25...

Or after 3 years of playing paying and supporting hockey this year all of a sudden he doesnít consent and refuses them. The OCL lady found that very concurring.

Anyways. Those are the reasons why itís not in the childís best interest.


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  #19  
Old 03-05-2019, 11:31 AM
Selfrepmom Selfrepmom is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otttawa_dad View Post
IMO, SC are a complete waste of time, public funds and families resources. IMO SC are only "successful" if both parties are willing to make a deal, if one party is stuborn and unwilling to dilute their wine, then the end game is "TRIAL"


I know 1st hand, just finished a 7 day trail (took me 5 years of my kids life to get there)
Thanks for all the tips!

My ex is convinced that he will not be paying CS. He got pressured into signing a temp consent order at our CC that has him paying a SMALL amount, but is attempting to hide income now. On the bright side, he finally retained a lawyer about a week ago, which I think will actually work in my favour slightly. Iím hoping they will convince him not to drag this out more than it needs to be.

What were the main points of contention that brought your case to trial? How do you feel it went?
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  #20  
Old 03-05-2019, 11:31 AM
otttawa_dad otttawa_dad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selfrepmom View Post
Iíve chosen to find the small nuggets of positive hidden within:
A) I actually like his gf. Sheís a nice person. Sheís great with kids. Sure I find it annoying that she seems to be ok with the fact that he refuses to pay CS, but that doesnít make her an evil person
B) Because heís not paying CS, they have a ton of money to do fun stuff with the kids (lol) Even if itís not me getting to do this stuff with my kid at the moment, at least she is still getting to have these experiences
C) My daughter is an only child. She now gets to experience what itís like to have siblings. Yes she complains about them occasionally. But if she had actual siblings, they would probably fight like cats and dogs 24/7. At least with ďbonusĒ siblings, she gets a break from them

I applaud you for taking this position (IMO this is child focused), this should be the default for every parent and child living in two home.


ps... I fixed all the funky characters in your post


Quote:
Originally Posted by Selfrepmom View Post
I do a countdown on my calendar with my daughter until her next ďdaddy timeĒ. It is awesome how something so simple has such a positive effect on her.
This is a great method to help kids manage their expectations, I have two young boys and we count the amounts of sleeps until they go back to their "home" at moms.
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