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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #1  
Old 06-22-2009, 10:27 PM
teluan teluan is offline
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I am heading towards financial ruin and have to believe that others in my position have found workarounds to save themselves. Here is my story...I pay $1700/month in child support, $1000/month for spousal support (until the end of 2009 as per a court order), $252/month for tutoring (s7 expense), $150/month for karate (s7 expense), and starting in September about $1250/month for before and after school care (s7 expense).

I make after taxes $6000k/month after tax and currently am paying $3102 in child,spousal and s7 expenses which me with $2898/month to live off of.

If I am also to pay the before and after school fees I will only be left with $1648/month to live off of.


Can this be right? I am not going to be able to live with that low an income. I am not eligible for any government assistance because I make over $100k (on paper). With my huge legal bills (which have tapped out even my credit card), I am facing a financial and a personal crisis.

What can I do?
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Old 06-23-2009, 02:29 AM
first timer first timer is offline
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You should be able to get some of the extra expenses back:
If -------- receives a tax refund for any child related expenses in which -------- also contributed, ------- is entitled to the percentage of the refund equal to his contribution over the total amount claimed.fficeffice" />>>
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Old 06-23-2009, 05:59 AM
doingmybest doingmybest is offline
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Wow...talk about expensive monthly costs for karate and tutoring...does the tutoring go all summer?

Also you said your spousal support only goes til the end of 2009, and the before/afterschool care starts in Sept, so really there is only a 4 month overlap of those expenses....

I agree with first timer, you can claim lots of what you are paying on your taxes...up to a certain amount or if you ex is claiming then you should get a % back. Ask your accountant.

Look at the bright side? (hard I know)---for living on $1648/month, that seems to only be for 4 months....lots of people live on much less and can manage, if your lifestyle is too pricey for 4 months...focus on the extra $1000 you'll be saving come Jan 2010!
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Old 06-23-2009, 08:47 AM
HCA HCA is offline
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I understand your plight as I have and am in the same position and make about the same money. My ex who has a better education and teachers degree has supposedly not found work and its nigh on 7 years. She has not disclosed despite many requests and I am now taking her back to court, essentially rolling the dice on whether a family court judge will be in a reasonable mood that day. The system is broken and needs to be fixed. The constant bitterness shown by my ex and her constant demands for money, special expenses etc. I work a part time job at essentially minimum wage so I can put gas in my car and food on the table, and haven't disclosed that I work close to 80 hrs a week as she will want a piece of that too. The kids are now approaching university and there is this perception that kids from a broken marriage have a "right" to have their education paid for. I put myself through school, worked full time and went to school full time, took student loans to get my degree. I cannot believe that a system would automatically assume they have a automatic right to this. Don't get me wrong I love my kids, but the sense of entitlement that my ex and others like her exhibit truly grates on me. Take responsibility and get on with helping to support your family rather than riding the gravy train.

With all I have heard about the FRO, I am very concerned that when spousal and child support is ceased they will screw this up due to their collective incompetence. I am not sure how this office got created but after hearing all the horror stories, only in govt would this occur. If they were in private realm, they would be sued out of business. But I digress. The system is skewed and screwed up and all you can do is basically bend over until your kids reach majority or finish school.

I know that this post may cause some friction and some people saying but what about this and that. Its about fairness and balance - there is none in the system. This is my experience and there are others like me. I know there are deadbeat parents out there and those who don’t live up to the responsibilities. I am not one of them and have continued to provide at the detriment of my current family/relationship, because it’s the right thing to do. I try to remain in my kids lives even though my ex continues to undermine me as a parent. I am a cash cow. The system needs to be fixed as my quality of life close to 7 years afterward is diminishing while hers increases with buying houses and new cars. I may sound bitter, but I am not. I have dealt with the baggage and have moved forward with my life despite the obstacles that the system has thrown in my path. The system has to realize that it takes two to make a marriage and two to break a marriage.

However, I am pragmatic and realize it will take alot for the system to change and some balls at the prov and fed political level. That probabaly won't occur, so I will get comfortable, lube up, bend over and grab my ankles and hope it will stop sooner rather than later. Only a few years left to go.
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Old 06-23-2009, 10:09 AM
About_Time About_Time is offline
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Well, I have mixed emotions about your post, teluan.

I agree that shelling out more than 50% of every dime you earn is problematic - especially as that's before child care expenses. I'm not sure how many kids you have or what the mother's financial situation is, but that's a fairly steep kick in the budget. Too often, non-custodial parents get zinged for an unreasonable amount relative to their income. Kids need financial support obviously, but sometimes common sense gets thrown to the wolves in court.

I'm not sure why the heck you would be paying $1250/mth for before and after-school care. That would be steep for full-time day care - for before and after care, that's criminally high. Do you not have any say in this in your agreement? My guess here is that she has sole custody and you pay a very high percentage of costs (ie: she doesn't work) - clarifying this might help the discussion here.

That said, at the end of the year you claw back $1000/mth, which is nothing to sneeze at. You will find few sympathizers on these boards about living off of $2900/mth. That's about what I earn IN TOTAL before any support payments and expenses hit my wallet. I, and most people here, are managing to survive and even thrive on way less. Will it impact your lifestyle? Absolutely. Will it mean making some hard financial decisions? Yes. Will it lead you to financial ruin? It shouldn't.
  #6  
Old 06-23-2009, 10:52 AM
Suchislife Suchislife is offline
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teulan, there is not much you can do. It is unfortunately a case of financial ruin and mounting debt for most support payors.
Consider yourself lucky that you have an end to Spousal as not everyone does.
The only avenue open to you is an adjustment on the court order regarding sec. 7's.
You didn't mention your agreement. Some support payors have an option to agree or disagree when an expense exceeds a certain amount. I'm all for kids having a rich, full life. However, when growing up I didn't have karate or tutoring, I love my parents, and turned out fine.

HCA a.k.a bent over Cash Cow:
Too funny. Your post, not your predicament! My wish for you at court is the dice are rolled and your Ex has a large amount imputed to her for both Spousal Support purposes and any extraordinary expenses.
Riding the gravy train for nigh on 7 years is time enough.
FRO is not all horror stories. My suggestion to you is to be in contact with a case worker. For example, letting them know you've been to court, asking them if they got the revised support deduction order etc....get the workers name AND fax #, keep in touch and make sure some important document is not sitting on the wrong desk.
A support recipient is supposed to provide disclosure for the purpose of continued ENTILTLEMENT. How they get away with not doing so is beyond me. If the situation were reversed the outcome would be very different.

I would like to believe that the shift is happening. It's a slow process to unscew the scewed. We've gone from many woman being left in a difficult situation with young kids. No support. Some, no education.
Now the laws put in place to ensure that kids are not left high n' dry has been extorted by people like your Ex. And my partners Ex.
Spousal support is not an entitlement. I'm only in favour of Spousal support when there's very young pre-schoolers involved. Time-limited.

My partner was successful in a 40% reduction in Spousal support last year. No end, unfortunately. His Ex was awarded an exorborant amount of Spousal on top of CS based on an inflated income from ONE YEAR pre-separation. When a person cannot maintain that level of o/t you find arrears accumulating and then need to deal with FRO....
Point is, the more people that go back to court and take a stand, the more the Judges will take a look at derailing the gravy train.
  #7  
Old 06-23-2009, 10:52 AM
AtALoss AtALoss is offline
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HCA
With all I have heard about the FRO, I am very concerned that when spousal and child support is ceased they will screw this up due to their collective incompetence. I am not sure how this office got created but after hearing all the horror stories, only in govt would this occur. If they were in private realm, they would be sued out of business. But I digress. The system is skewed and screwed up and all you can do is basically bend over until your kids reach majority or finish school.

I know that this post may cause some friction and some people saying but what about this and that. Its about fairness and balance - there is none in the system. This is my experience and there are others like me.

Please take heart that change is happening. There are many things that are currently happening behind the scenes that are going to make a differnce to cases like ours and for those in the future.
  #8  
Old 06-23-2009, 11:47 AM
sprdad sprdad is offline
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I was left with 60K in debt...and my ex supposed to take care of her 50%..she didn't She works for her best friend and her best friend claimed she was laid of....but she wasn't she's getting paid cash under the table. I was paying my share but since my ex "wasn't working" I became 100% liable ..collection agencies were after me left and right.... I ended up filing bankruptcy...... I've been working up to 3 jobs and finally I'm better......4 years later....
  #9  
Old 06-23-2009, 02:42 PM
RF0508 RF0508 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HCA View Post
The kids are now approaching university and there is this perception that kids from a broken marriage have a "right" to have their education paid for. I put myself through school, worked full time and went to school full time, took student loans to get my degree. I cannot believe that a system would automatically assume they have a automatic right to this. Don't get me wrong I love my kids, but the sense of entitlement that my ex and others like her exhibit truly grates on me. Take responsibility and get on with helping to support your family rather than riding the gravy train.
This rots my cabbage more than anything. This sense of entitlement. Both my dh and I worked our way through post-secondary, and fully expect our two children to help themselves as well. My ss gets to sit on his rear with his hand out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HCA View Post
I know that this post may cause some friction and some people saying but what about this and that. Its about fairness and balance - there is none in the system. This is my experience and there are others like me. I know there are deadbeat parents out there and those who don’t live up to the responsibilities. I am not one of them and have continued to provide at the detriment of my current family/relationship, because it’s the right thing to do. I try to remain in my kids lives even though my ex continues to undermine me as a parent. I am a cash cow. The system needs to be fixed as my quality of life close to 7 years afterward is diminishing while hers increases with buying houses and new cars. I may sound bitter, but I am not. I have dealt with the baggage and have moved forward with my life despite the obstacles that the system has thrown in my path. The system has to realize that it takes two to make a marriage and two to break a marriage.
Amen. I call my dh the Biological Wallet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HCA View Post
However, I am pragmatic and realize it will take alot for the system to change and some balls at the prov and fed political level. That probabaly won't occur, so I will get comfortable, lube up, bend over and grab my ankles and hope it will stop sooner rather than later. Only a few years left to go.
I am howling! How many times have I said this very phrase? Our collective arse's are bleeding over here already!

You are definitely not alone.
  #10  
Old 06-24-2009, 07:32 AM
HCA HCA is offline
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The only way to deal with it is to keep perscpective. With each passing day, my situation while bad now will eventually get better, while my ex's will diminish. My hope is that the judge will see that she is perfectly able to work or is working, and at least the Spousal Spt will be suspended. I bleed green from my eyes and wallet every time I see a letter or email from my lawyer.

Moooooooooo
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