Excuse for not paying special expense

[Kenny]

I figured I would share my Ex-spouse's answer on General Chat because it is almost comical.

Both my kids are in serious need of orthodontic work, but my daughter in particular.

For my daughter only, extractions, molds, braces, etc are an even $8,000. Both my common law wife and my dental plans cover $2,500 each and my Ex-spouse's plan covers the same. Too easy right? Not according to my Ex-spouse.

Even though she gets most of her money back through insurance, she REFUSES to contribute to the orthodontic work unless I can get a letter from the doctor stating that the entire work is medical and that there is no cosmetic work being performed!

WTF! My Ex-spouse can see as well as I can that the child has two teeth growing straight out of her gums. It is not rocket science here.

That is a new low is trying to get out of supporting a child.

Just thought I would share this.

Ken

[torontonian]

Just a thought... might be the insurance's request?

[ddol1]

I have been through this three times.... not an insurance request. Part of the assumption of the insurance is the doctor's initial paperwork that includes the purpose of the work, the payment plan and the insurance, should they request any technical informetion will contact the doctor directly. Braces are quite common today and the insurance assumption is if the work is being done it is justifiable - any round with braces will include the altering/correction of the patients bite pattern - that is not a cosmetic issue. I do remember asking this kind of stuff but respectfully it is now 15 years ago.

But Kenny,
Sounds crazy - but how about a mom who is freeking out because I wouldn't make an appointment for my daughter to have her jaw deformity reassessed? I took her to the first one and since she was almost 17 she had a large say in what she wanted too do. I told the doctor not to speek to me but to my daugghter - I was there to learn and possible ask a question or two. Doctor freaked my daughter out dedscribing the surgury which called for cutting open the roof of her mouth, breaking her jaw, removing parts and putting it all together. It could only be done in Toronto and the biggest midicating factor was, "Do you have any pain at any time iin your jaw, neck or bad headaches". Answer, "No, never". My daughter may require it one day should things change and it would not affect the difficulty of the surgury in any way.

Daughter in big eyes, NO!!!!!! Question to doctor, advice? "I would not have my daughter assume any of these risks in a difficult surgery without any symptoms described. Settled, we were both happy - my daughter understands what to watch out for and to speak up if she needs it even if it is in 8 years and she could not afford the cost (estimate was $15,000 to $20,000) if I remember right - way more thatn a set of braces. Right in the office I told her eother way momm and dad would sell our rrsp's if we had to. You are and will always be our daughter and we will help you if the time came.

Mom wants her reassessed now - lots of screaming on her part (so I can pay for it too - and in the end if I understand expenses like this is ratio of incomes which under CPP I am not rolling in income for sure) Fine, I hunt down the paper work - date of visit June 2010! - at the time 10 months previous. We told her at the get go she just had it, daughter reaffirmed she didn't want it and even giving my stbx the bill she one didn't believe it and the doctor was called to insist she be seen.

Thankfully, I asked the doctor to look at the file and he came back with No, I won't see her after only 10 months! Nothing would have changed, nothing even the symptoms which my daughter said " do not have any!!!!" More screaming by stbx - seems she screams alot these days!

Now my wife goes around telling people that I am cheap and I refuse to help my daughter! Along with my taking her house away and she and the kids will have nowhere to live..... She brings this up with every confrontation which thankfully people here have taught me how to live by 100% avoidance - when she tries I say the same thing and walk away, "show your concerns by email - I will respond to all valid issues"

[DunnMom]

JUST went through this ... ex has normal dental coverage through work (no cost to him) ... I have medical but no dental. Kids' have been seeing an Orthodontist for 6+ yrs. The 14 yr old had an appliance put in 4+ yrs ago in prep for braces. Ex's benefits paid that out of the $2,500 per child per lifetime in "Ortho Fees". Ex was 100% on board with all the "monitoring' (it was free)

Fast forward to April 2010 when the Orthodontist informed us that it was time for boys to start full treatment. Ex refused to consent.

After fruitless emails and phone calls back & forth I set forth a "Motion To Change". A 1st Appearance, 2 Case Conferences, 2 Trial Audits & then D-Day. Both of us self-repping.

Fast forward to Sept 8/11 and our judgement day. Ex ordered to start treatment within 30 days, to pay 70% (despite our 9 yr old agreement that he pay only 50% .. because it's now "proportionate to income") and now both boys are in "train-tracks" plus upper & lower spacers.

I'm still bitter because our older son just started high school ... his braces should be coming OFF in about 3 mos. if ex had not acted like a jackass ... now he'll have to wear them until halfway through Gr. 11. At least my 12 yr old who's in Gr. 7 will have his off by the time he hits high school.

[Kenny]

Just to confirm, it is not an insurance request. I can't see the problem here. I was not asking for money from her pocket, just that she submit the dental forms and return the insurance money to me as I paid for it. The first time she did, she processed the claim and KEPT THE MONEY. In a sense, since she has not paid a dime in child support, she has profited from me having the kids.

Now I AM asking for the money in advance, but she gets 80 or 90% of that back in three weeks.

I don't know why she is being so stingy. She lives in a modest house in NB, now may be making as much as $96,700 per year and her new husband works!

When she had custody and I was paying support, it didn't seem this complicated.

[ddol1]

If this is the case it is possible to set up the payments from different sources according to insurance coverage. I do remember our insurance would only pay the monthly fee over 12 months I think - then it allowed us to do our taxes according to that 12 month period for the medical claims/tax deduction. If it get billed direct to each of your credit cards (or whatever method is used)then the insurance money will reimburse each of you accordingly. Heck that would even be good for your kids to see that both mom and dad are helping with thier braces.

Of course, it sounds like you would have a hard time getting her to do this as well???

[mcdreamy]

Ddol..I had this surgery, in my early 30s. Pm me for more details or if your daughter has questions. I had chronic jaw pain and headaches beforehand, but honestly, knowing now how incredibly painful the surgery was, I would never do it again. It also wasnt $20, it was $10 out of pocket, there is a way to qualify the hospital surgery/stay under Ohip. I would be questioning your oral surgeon. I can refer your daughter to my surgeon if it helps.

Kenny, I hear you. I don't understand, and probably never will, how some parents can dump their kids and their obligations.

[ddol1]

mcdreamy thanks for letting us know,
That would make a difference getting it under ohip for sure - he quoted the full price, worst case scenario and followup stuff. He wasn't going to do it (too highly specalized and he was going to refer it - Toronto was the "closest". she is 17 doing ok for now but as yours was in your 30"s. Click on my name and you can send the contact info when you get a chance - a good referal is a better one than blind. I have had now 8 surgeries (next one comes friday!!! finally but touch my mouth...... shudder :-) Maybe if you can take the time you can describe your experience and I will give it to her - this I am sure is a huge concern for her..... who long the recovery etc.

[MommaMouse]

LOL Love it!! The extents people will go to to get out of paying!! I feel for you though. My Daughter was put in glasses at 2, she had a lazy eye caused by near sightedness and far sightedness in opposing eyes, in otherwords very bad eyesight. 4 years later after countless specialists, patch theropy, and appointments every 3 months her sight is starting to improve. I've spent thousands on her eyes, he still insists that she never needed glasses and if I hadn't put her in glasses she wouldn't be wearing them today and because it's my fault she wears glasses he will not contribute a penny towards the expenses occured now or in the future.

Anyway, my point, you are not alone. Keep the reciepts in a safe place and when they amount to enough take your ex to court and FRO will enforce payments.

I figured I would share my Ex-spouse's answer on General Chat because it is almost comical.

Both my kids are in serious need of orthodontic work, but my daughter in particular.

For my daughter only, extractions, molds, braces, etc are an even $8,000. Both my common law wife and my dental plans cover $2,500 each and my Ex-spouse's plan covers the same. Too easy right? Not according to my Ex-spouse.

Even though she gets most of her money back through insurance, she REFUSES to contribute to the orthodontic work unless I can get a letter from the doctor stating that the entire work is medical and that there is no cosmetic work being performed!

WTF! My Ex-spouse can see as well as I can that the child has two teeth growing straight out of her gums. It is not rocket science here.

That is a new low is trying to get out of supporting a child.

Just thought I would share this.

Ken