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trueblue22 · #1 02-23-2021, 12:37 AM

My ex has provided updated financial disclosure and it includes a new personal debt. He doesn't list who he owes the money to (but it's a substantial amount over 6 figures) but he can show that this money was provided to him. He claims he borrowed the money to pay for living expenses for himself and the children since I won't let him access the credit available on the home equity line.

Can my lawyer force him to disclose this source of funds and how this money was spent? He could have taken out money from his corporation but decided to borrow it instead.

rockscan · #2 02-23-2021, 09:48 AM

He can borrow money after separation. He just can�t make you pay for it.

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trueblue22 · #3 02-23-2021, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockscan

He can borrow money after separation. He just can�t make you pay for it.

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I understand that but do I have a right to know where this money comes from? I want to be able to verify he didn't take a lump sum of this money prior to us separating and is now receiving it back under the guise of a loan.

rockscan · #4 02-23-2021, 01:12 PM

I don�t think he has to divulge details. Just that its a loan. You could request additional disclosure but you would need to outline that you cannot fo forward with your case without it. That would be hard to prove.

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Tayken · #5 02-23-2021, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockscan

I don�t think he has to divulge details. Just that its a loan. You could request additional disclosure but you would need to outline that you cannot fo forward with your case without it. That would be hard to prove.

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Actually he will have to disclose the source of the money if he wants to rely upon it for any reason in the argument. As part of Rule 13 you can ask for the disclosure of the loan details. This often happens when someone tries to say they are broke and had to take a loan from their parents... But, without the proper paperwork it is NOT a loan but a gift in the eyes of the court.

A loan is an agreement with terms signed by the person providing the loan and the person getting the loan. In accordance with Rule 13 you can request those details if they put the loan on their Form 13.1/13. Its part of financial disclosure.

It is pretty routine disclosure to ask for... In fact, its probably money from a family member (gift) that they are trying to pass off as a loan. Quite common.

rockscan · #6 02-23-2021, 04:12 PM

What would be a reasonable argument? In my husband�s case the judge said loans or how he paid for things had no bearing on his income and he could use credit to pay for his lifestyle choices as long as he didn�t claim hardship, it didn�t matter what his credit or loans were.

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Tayken · #7 02-24-2021, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockscan

What would be a reasonable argument? In my husband�s case the judge said loans or how he paid for things had no bearing on his income and he could use credit to pay for his lifestyle choices as long as he didn�t claim hardship, it didn�t matter what his credit or loans were.

Nothing churns on the loans or his credit. The judge is correct. People often try to leverage them incorrectly to say "look how broke I am your Honour" to get sympathy. They have no bearing on the argument generally.

Where they matter is when someone is claiming they are broke, get family gifts to pay for legal fees or a life style. Some times judges will consider them to be income in extreme situations when there is significant family wealth. Especially when that party is aggressively litigating the matter.

"Family money gives you wings..." (Same concept as Legal Aid giving someone wings to ruthlessly and recklessly litigate.)

trueblue22 · #8 02-24-2021, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tayken

Actually he will have to disclose the source of the money if he wants to rely upon it for any reason in the argument. As part of Rule 13 you can ask for the disclosure of the loan details. This often happens when someone tries to say they are broke and had to take a loan from their parents... But, without the proper paperwork it is NOT a loan but a gift in the eyes of the court.

A loan is an agreement with terms signed by the person providing the loan and the person getting the loan. In accordance with Rule 13 you can request those details if they put the loan on their Form 13.1/13. Its part of financial disclosure.

It is pretty routine disclosure to ask for... In fact, its probably money from a family member (gift) that they are trying to pass off as a loan. Quite common.

What if he provides a loan agreement (a document signed by both parties) with the details of the lender blacked out? Would that make the loan considered "legitimate"? All this is speculation but I am trying to prepare myself.

trueblue22 · #9 02-24-2021, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tayken

Nothing churns on the loans or his credit. The judge is correct. People often try to leverage them incorrectly to say "look how broke I am your Honour" to get sympathy. They have no bearing on the argument generally.

Where they matter is when someone is claiming they are broke, get family gifts to pay for legal fees or a life style. Some times judges will consider them to be income in extreme situations when there is significant family wealth. Especially when that party is aggressively litigating the matter.

"Family money gives you wings..." (Same concept as Legal Aid giving someone wings to ruthlessly and recklessly litigate.)

My ex's lawyer indicated he borrowed money from a friend since he isn't allowed access to any credit due to my name being on the family mortgage and because we have no separation agreement. It looks like they are blaming me for sitting on the matrimonial home and making me seem unreasonable for not allowing him access to credit.

rockscan · #10 02-24-2021, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trueblue22

My ex's lawyer indicated he borrowed money from a friend since he isn't allowed access to any credit due to my name being on the family mortgage and because we have no separation agreement. It looks like they are blaming me for sitting on the matrimonial home and making me seem unreasonable for not allowing him access to credit.

Well technically you are being unreasonable. Mostly for the reasons in your other threads but now because he has no access to credit because a) you are refusing to sell his asset and b) he has no access to the line of credit on the property he owns.

His argument is correct.

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