It was a nice week with my kids, wish it wouldn't end

[Decent Dad]

As I sit back and read all these posts.Who is really gainning out of all this battle.Our children , us , no the lawyer.I"m not bashing all lawyers only the ones that drag this out for three or four years with no end in site.Thanks Steve

Steve. I agree completely. My ex got an ambulance chaser for a lawyer.. he saw "gold in them thar hills" and everything went downhill from there. True, the lawyer will only do what is instructed by the client BUT they can guide the proceedings and not fuel the animosity. My lawyer was very mediation friendly and actually did not want to be involved at all (to keep costs down). So there are a few good ones. But if one side wants to be vindictive... god help you.

But really, when you are the mother you get: tax free child support to pay the lawyer. You get to write-off your legal bills. You get the equivalent to spouse deduction. And Don Pardo.. what else do we have? Oh.. a sweet equilization payment. So really... it is actually only one person paying everything. So why not piss it away to the lawyers. Well, two people pay: the father and the taxpayers of Canada.

[FPI]

Decent Dad,

As for me sending out mixed messages that’s not what I’m trying to do. I love my children more than anything in this world and would do anything to make them happy, even live with my ex again. And that was pretty bad. At the moment I work afternoons, which makes it difficult for me to see my kids other than on weekends. Unfortunately, it’s been like that since she moved out a year ago. I will be working days within the next couple of months. I have asked my employer to switch me to day shift and they said the next available position should be mine.

I would like to ask you, on my last Case Conference my exs. Lawyer wrote up a court order asking me for further disclosure, questioning and information regarding my employer. That was over a month ago and still I have not heard anything. My lawyer tells me that it’s up to her lawyer to arrange the time, what should I do? I feel extremely bad that my kids are living in subsidized housing. I wanted to give her some equalization payment, but my lawyer told me, why would you want to fund her legal fees

[gooddadgoingmad]

I just wanted to jump in here as I laughed when I read it. " Everybody works..."

I thought it was interesting that you said that because in this day and age, it is more of the norm that both people work in the marriage. You kinda have to just to get by and pay the bills. The days of stay at home moms ( at least long-term) are very rare now. This is what my lawyer said. He said that the fact that my ex is a young woman who NEVER worked a day in her life, is almost unheard of. Before our son was born, she had 12 years of marriage with me where she refused to go to work. We struggled as a result. Now she wants me to continue to support her? Insane....

Sorry for the interjection. It just hit me when I read what you wrote about both people working. I wonder how a judge will look at the fact that she didn't work...refused to.

Ok, continue with your posts. Ha! Sorry to interupt the flow...just hit me and had to express myself. Thanks.

GDGM

FPI,

Everybody works. Even intact marriages have both people working... and guess what? They have kids. I understand your schedule is difficult - but honestly you are presenting a mixed message: I want the kids - but I don't want them?

Many people have told me that when kids grow older (12-18) they will come live with the Dad. It does happen, but not always, and by then the kids are messed up. I do not agree with that arguement as a means not to fight. It is a crutch. To me, when the kids are young, that is a lot of lost time. Time that does not come back. First talk. First walks. Naps. Bedtimes. Baths. Play. Lessons. Camping and more. That will never come back.

I do agree, though, with this: That when children become adults (20+), they will see you for what you are, and see your stbx for what she is. And you are an adult far longer than you are a child. She can't control them forever. You will be the better person in their eyes and they will naturally want to be with you in adulthood.

[Grace]

Lawyer wrote up a court order asking me for further disclosure, questioning and information regarding my employer. That was over a month ago and still I have not heard anything. My lawyer tells me that it’s up to her lawyer to arrange the time, what should I do? I feel extremely bad that my kids are living in subsidized housing. I wanted to give her some equalization payment, but my lawyer told me, why would you want to fund her legal fees

FBI, I think your heading down the wrong road on this one. If there is a court order in place the onus is on you to comply. Your lawyer should be making the arrangements in order to protect your interest by obeying the order. Delay tactics are often used in Family Law, do your utmost to not participate in this, it can come back to bite you in court.

I too would feel badly if any children were living in subsidized housing due to legal tactics. Do what you feel is right by your children. You may want to consider getting a second opinion from another lawyer.

[Jenny]

Jenny,

No I have not spent her money, she came into the marriage without anything and she will be going out with more money than some people make all their lives.
I have kept most of my hard earned cash in a safe place.
Yes she can liquidate most of my assets but that could cost her money she doesn’t have. As for her getting a judgement against me, she could properly do that, but keep in mind I have made her several written offers to settle in amounts larger than what I should be giving her. She just doesn’t trust me. I will be telling her soon that ever dollar a spent on Lawyers fighting her will be deducted from her equalization. The only
Reason I offered her more than what she is entitled to is because I figured the money I have to pay the Lawyers I would give to my kids. She just doesn’t get it.

I don't think it will work this way. What she is entiltled to for the equilization payment is HERS - I doesn't matter what she came into the marriage with- if it works out that the equalization payment is more than she came with- odds are you didn't come into the marriage with the same amount of money you have now - did you? Just somethig to keep in mind.

[FPI]

Another week and no news from my ex's Lawyer. My Lawyer did send my latest disclosure, which was an exclusion that I didn't put in my last. I'm not sure why her lawyer hasn't set up a date for questioning. The only think I can think of he wants to get paid for his time up till now. I'm sure for him to set up the questioning will cost my ex. some money, for example the court reporter has to get paid.
I did consult with another Lawyer yesterday while attending a Peel Family Law Session. She advised me to give my ex some money. I will talk to my Lawyer again and see if she agrees. The Lawyer I'm using now is one of the best in the city; she has been practicing Family Law for over 35 years, and comes highly recommended. I was surprised she took my case since she is so busy.
As for equalization, almost everything I have I had before I got married. I will be excluding allot and have paper work to back everything up. Jenny you must keep in mind for the 9 years I was married my wife didn't work other than 1 year. It is very difficult to save anything when your supporting four people on one income, all my money went to pay bills. How could I save anything under those circumstances? If it wasn't for the interest I was getting on the money I had before I got married we would of suffered big time.
Yes I hate the way my kids are living now, and plan to try to get Soul custody myself. Each parent is responsible to become self sufficient, my ex. Have had a year and a few months's to look for a job, she refuses to work.
When I finally end up in court I might get taking down but that’s the chance I have to take.
Just a few moments ago my daughter called me and told me she had a kinder egg given to her, she tried telling me who gave it to her, and I hear my ex. in the background saying you don't have to tell him anything. How would you feel if this was going on with you?

[Jenny]

I'm confused- so what you are saying is that you have all the money legitimately and her "equalization" payment isn't really an equalization payment at all but something you wanted to give her out of the goodness of your heart? - You had all the money before the marriage and she had nothing? What about the matrimonial home?

Anyway- Just as long as you know that you may end up paying far more then you think you should ( costs of her lawyer, back support, a big equalization payment etc) and there are ways she can get it.

I think Grace has hit the nail on the head- It will look bad with your children in poverty and you delaying....You need to listen to your conscious as well as your lawyer

You asked how I would feel if this was happening to me? It would suck but you also might ask how your wife feels with your withholding payments while she struggles.

With her not working( and I assume would are not calling raising your children work? - at least it wasn't paid work - but it sure as hell was work! and to pay someone to raise your children would be expensive. ) It really does give her a claim for spousal support.

[sunday]

I'm farely new to this forum and feel at times I'm not wise enough to post advice. Tonight I feel quite different and would like to add my two cents worth.
I have noticed a few things WE all have in common. It appears to me NOBODY communicated with their ex BEFORE saying " I do". All of US entered into our marriages blindly. Over time our EXPECTATIONS were not met...we became bitter, resentful, kept score etc. At the end of it all the ONLY thing that really matters to us is money! Unfortunately our society rewards those who have an abundance of "dirty paper". At the end of it all, in a perfect world it would be healthier ( especially for the kids ) to just cut our loses...try and move on...hopefully turn the negative stuff we have learned from the break up into healthy positive eneregy for our present and future relationships!
I have LOST so much material and monetary value from my separation and divorce. Over time I may be able to replace some of it. More importantly I did not lose my MORAL VALUES. Infact, I believe I have gained even more! Probably the best gift I could give to my children.

[Jenny]

You sound wise to me Sunday! Communication is such a tough issue. My ex and I have been through some tough times but really now at this point we are basically moving toward friendship( people are wondering why we are going through the divorce now at all- but it make ABSOLUTE sense to us) Sometimes once the dirty money issues are fixed you can move on to the emotional healing imo. They get tied together in a weird way at times.

[FPI]

Jenny,

I agree with you when you say I most likely will have to pay back support and so on.
It is not like I don’t want to pay her anything, I would do anything to take my kids out of the environment their in, but how can I when my ex won’t budge.
I spoke to her about three weeks ago; I asked her how am I supposed to live if I’m paying you $1000.00 a month spousal support $800.00 child support. Her response was I didn’t ask for that I asked for $1000,00 including spousal support. I told her the offer to settle she sent me did not say that, her response my lawyer must of made a mistake. I would of settled immediately if that was the case. But now she wants to go full force.
You asked me about the Matrimonial Home, Well I purchased the house with my dad 6 years before I married her; the house is registered under my dad’s estate and also holds a mortgage, which is also held by my dad’s estate. I therefore only own a very small portion.
I also agree with you when you say it will look bad on me that she is living on poverty, the child support I give her won’t take you very far. Like I said before I gave her an offer to settle which is over and above what I should be giving her, she refused it. As for picking up her Lawyers fees maybe I will have to one day. From my understanding if the offer to settle I offered her is what she was originally entitled to and she didn’t take it she may have to pay her own legal fees.

Furthermore, I don’t want to delay matters, I would of settled this the day she left. Unfortunately, she won’t talk to me and everything has to be done through Lawyers. I have offered to use mediation she refuses. The women is out to destroy me and friends of hers tell me so.

[Decent Dad]

Decent Dad,
As for me sending out mixed messages that’s not what I’m trying to do. I love my children more than anything in this world and would do anything to make them happy, even live with my ex again. And that was pretty bad. At the moment I work afternoons, which makes it difficult for me to see my kids other than on weekends. Unfortunately, it’s been like that since she moved out a year ago. I will be working days within the next couple of months. I have asked my employer to switch me to day shift and they said the next available position should be mine.
I would like to ask you, on my last Case Conference my exs. Lawyer wrote up a court order asking me for further disclosure, questioning and information regarding my employer. That was over a month ago and still I have not heard anything. My lawyer tells me that it’s up to her lawyer to arrange the time, what should I do? I feel extremely bad that my kids are living in subsidized housing. I wanted to give her some equalization payment, but my lawyer told me, why would you want to fund her legal fees

I think you are going to have a really hard time being anything other than the "every-other-weekend Dad". The status quo has been in place for a year. I wish you luck.

As for the disclosure, you should basically give anything they ask (within reason) and in a timely fashion. Otherwise it will be used against you in court. And really, they will get it anyway - one way or another. Sometimes the ex's lawyers must check out some information. And that is correct they have to book a time (e.g. if they are examing legal or corporate information). But 99% of the stuff can be copied and sent to the ex's laywer. Sounds like some game playing is going on here. You ex could have filed an intermin order for support and custody and access. Has she?

It appears your laywer has one plan and you another?

[Decent Dad]

I just wanted to jump in here as I laughed when I read it. " Everybody works..."
GDGM

Sorry, I should have qualified:

Everybody works who has dignity, self-respect and are will taking care of themselves*. And in this day and age, both parents work, in marriages and divorce. It is not a new concept.

But you are correct, they are those that will use and abuse the "system". My ex has now decided not to work just as we head to our CS trial. sheesh.

*btw, I am not bashing stay-at-home parents, just people staying at home and leaching from the "system".

[Decent Dad]

I'm farely new to this forum and feel at times I'm not wise enough to post advice. Tonight I feel quite different and would like to add my two cents worth.
I have noticed a few things WE all have in common. It appears to me NOBODY communicated with their ex BEFORE saying " I do". All of US entered into our marriages blindly. Over time our EXPECTATIONS were not met...we became bitter, resentful, kept score etc. At the end of it all the ONLY thing that really matters to us is money! Unfortunately our society rewards those who have an abundance of "dirty paper". At the end of it all, in a perfect world it would be healthier ( especially for the kids ) to just cut our loses...try and move on...hopefully turn the negative stuff we have learned from the break up into healthy positive eneregy for our present and future relationships!
I have LOST so much material and monetary value from my separation and divorce. Over time I may be able to replace some of it. More importantly I did not lose my MORAL VALUES. Infact, I believe I have gained even more! Probably the best gift I could give to my children.

You are quite right. Unfortunately some of us get dragged into court everytime we sneeze. And it all about MONEY MONEY MONEY.

[gooddadgoingmad]

Hi Decent Dad,

I understood what you were saying....no need to explain. I just wanted to put my two cents in there as it hit me when I read what you wrote. But I did know the context in which you said it....no worries.

Like you, I am not bashing stay at home moms/dads. I think that if a couple is fortunate enough to have one income which more than comfortably supports the family, it's only sensible to have one parent at home with the kids...at least until they are in school full-time. However, in many cases one income is simply not enough and often times it is necessary for there to be both parents working, at least one part-time.

In my case, ex wouldn't work even when she knew that by going to work it would get us out of financial trouble. She didin't even work when there were no children. She plain refused to. If I had been making a large income then as I am now, I would have been more than happy for her to stay at home with our son...at least until he went to school full-time. However, I really believe that everyone should be working. Even if we had tons of money, should she still be staying at home doing nothing ?( while children are in school)

I didn't know that a marriage certificate was a license NOT to be self-sufficient. Didn't know that child support and spousal support were either....

You mentioned that your ex has stopped working? Was this by choice? Why would anyone just stop working? Ha! If there is no good reason then the judge will probably impute an income to her. I hope it goes well for you!

Wish I could NOT work!
GDGM

[FPI]

Decent Dad,

Thanks for your response, I spoke to my Lawyer secretary today regarding disclosure, she told me we sent out a letter giving further disclosure and have not heard anything from my ex’s Lawyer. She is going to wait until April 13 then sent out a follow up letter.
As for my ex filing for interim order for support, custody and access. She filed when she served me, if that’s the same think. Other than that she has not done anything. No motions or Court Orders.
What happens if my ex’s goes through the year without making any attempt to find a job, will this be questioned when we finally end up in court.