Question about solicitors lien

[mr.mom]

Hello,

I would like to first start off by saying that I always pay my debts. I always try to make payments on time for anything I owe. Until now....

I retained a lawyer to help me through my separation. I am the respondent. The separation was a bit nasty and dealt with a semi complex issue (so I thought) of what to use as total income.


So far my lawyer has responded to an application, drawn up a motion and attended a case conference. A factum has been worked on (I don't know if it was completed) and my financial statement was completed. There have been emails back and forth to my stbx lawyer and I have delivered any evidence I thought may help my case. For this I have paid about 22k and I have an outstanding bill of 8k for a total of close to 30k. After going through the bill line by line and matching it with the emails I have received, I discovered that I have been billed at least 2x, sometimes 3-4x more than what would be reasonable.

There has been a breakdown in the relationship with my lawyer and I and she has gone off the record. I haven't asked for my stuff back yet but I wanted to be informed first.

I was at the courthouse today getting some forms and the clerk I was speaking to told me something interesting when I asked for the form to assess my lawyers bill. He said that a lawyer has to have his/her own bill assessed in order to be able to put a lien on my file. Is this true?

Thank you

[Tayken]

He said that a lawyer has to have his/her own bill assessed in order to be able to put a lien on my file. Is this true?

The only organization I know that can put a lean on your property without having to go through collections processes is Legal Aid Ontario. Not sure how they can do this especially on homes for which two people are on the title for.

So the lawyer, like all creditors would have to go through all the standard processes to get any lien put on your property I would assume.

[hadenough]

I don't know about LAO but I do know that in order for anyone to put a lien on you, they must serve you, take you to court, be successful at court and get a judgment against you and THEN a lien can be registered against ie: your property.

As for asessing a lawyer's bill: I served a previous lawyer, to have his bill to me "assessed" (lots of ASS in this) and I paid an $80 filing fee. Served him. Had the matter heard, and in my case - had his bill assessed down to ZERO. Dismissed.

*as a matter of fact - just this evening I met with a high profile lawyer downtown and the "lien" topic arose briefly. What I wrote above is exactly what he told me.

[hadenough]

I know through a friend that the reason LAO can register a lien is b/c if you are on a LA certificate and are paying a reduced fee but own property, you must agree to the lien in advance (I guess) so that they are covered in the event that the case goes beyond "x" amount of projected dollars that you qualified for.

That was my (second-hand) "understanding" of it :/

[mr.mom]

So without a lien can I just walk in and ask for all my stuff back?

[hadenough]

I don't know - but there are other posts on here you can search for that might give you direction. There was one just the other day that OrleansLawyer was responding to (among others). I don't remember who the Original Poster was..

[Tayken]

I know through a friend that the reason LAO can register a lien is b/c if you are on a LA certificate and are paying a reduced fee but own property, you must agree to the lien in advance (I guess) so that they are covered in the event that the case goes beyond "x" amount of projected dollars that you qualified for.

Well, they have legislation that allows them to bypass what other creditors have to do which in the context of family law can often give "wings" to a highly conflicted party where they have access to funds that the other party does not.

Also, it is not clear for whom the lean is against in a jointly owned property. The lean as registered in Service Ontario does not reflect (a) the amount of the lien placed on the asset and (b) the specific owner of the property for which the lien is registered against.

Izyuk v. Bilousov, 2011 ONSC 7476 (CanLII)

Which could result in conduct by which the Certificate holder in a manner like this (read bold):

60. In the case at bar, the Applicant conducted herself as if her Legal Aid certificate amounted to a blank cheque – unlimited resources which most unrepresented Respondents would be hard-pressed to match. A scheduled 3-4 day trial turned into 17 days, largely because the Applicant fought every issue and pursued every dubious allegation, to the bitter end. She appeared to make up evidence and allegations as she went along. She defied court orders directly impacting on the child, even while the trial was underway. There have to be consequences. Either we sanction this irresponsible and destructive behaviour, or we invite more of the same.

In my honest opinion, in civil matters, and especially Family Law, Legal Aid Ontario needs a significant revamp by the government.

Good Luck!
Tayken

[OrleansLawyer]

So without a lien can I just walk in and ask for all my stuff back?

No. A solicitor's lien is not registered; it is the right of a solicitor to hold onto your file until the bill is paid.

A discussion of it can be found here:
http://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/f...lawyers-12907/

in order for anyone to put a lien on you, they must serve you, take you to court, be successful at court and get a judgment against you and THEN a lien can be registered against ie: your property.

This is against real property, for example your house.