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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #11  
Old 10-17-2009, 11:23 PM
IronMama IronMama is offline
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I dont understand why everyone is so quick to label and BLAME a custodial parent for the kids---the kids who are "persons" entitled to their feelings and opinions too---not wanting contact with the other parent.
It is so easy to say and point the fingers at the one parent saying they are somehow responsible for the childrens reaction, when if the "offending" parent just took a step back and take a hard look at themselves they would have the answers.

If my child said he doesnt want to go to school....I would ask for a solid REASON. If my child says he does not want to speak to his father, I MUST get a soild reason, and I in turn MUST do what is in the best interest of my child.
Also one MUST take into consideration the ages of the children when the absent parent left their lives. My children for example were 8, 13 and 5 months old. The 8 and 13 year old have maintained that they are so upset and angry at dad for him leaving them that they do not wish to speak to him.
I immediately took them to counselling and they have told this to the counsellor also. He says I cannot and must not "force" them to talk to him, but to continue to encourage them to. I do. Though it pains me because they dont know the facts, the lies, the whole case info, and I will not tell them at such young ages. I do. I even put his phone number on the refridgerator showing them whenever they feel the want or need to call dad, JUST DIAL HIS NUMBER.
  #12  
Old 10-18-2009, 03:36 AM
got2bkid got2bkid is offline
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IronMama said "The 8 and 13 year old have maintained that they are so upset and angry at dad for him leaving them that they do not wish to speak to him."

IronMama, as the parent it is your job to explain clearly to your children that their father did NOT leave them, but simply that the relationship between the two of you has ended. You must explain to them he is still their father and loves them as much as always. YOU must insist that they continue to have a relationship with their father whether they want to at this point or not. To hear that kids this young believe that their father left THEM is heart wrentching. He left YOU not THEM and I disagree with the counsellor, you must make them call/visit their dad. They are children. The sooner they re-establish a relationship with their father the better. Not all counsellors know what they are talking about.

Do you put aside your hurt feelings from whatever things he did when the kids are around? Do you think your anger at their dad shows in ways you are unaware of and they pick up on it? Children are SO intuitive, and you have to be very careful. Kids that age can be stubborn, but the longer they go staying "mad at dad" the harder it will be to mend later.
  #13  
Old 10-18-2009, 09:22 AM
representingself representingself is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMama View Post
I immediately took them to counselling and they have told this to the counsellor also. He says I cannot and must not "force" them to talk to him, but to continue to encourage them to. I do. Though it pains me because they dont know the facts, the lies, the whole case info, and I will not tell them at such young ages.
IronMama..... your children never need to know the facts of your case. The "lies and case info" are your burdens to bear.

I agree with G2BK....

Your marriage is over, and I am sure that you are angry and hurt.... but your kids are being shoved into the middle of your fight.

You have to encourage them to continue a relationship with their Father.... it is so important for them to fix this feeling of abandonement they have right now.

You don't want them to feel like they were not good enough, do you?

You don't want them to feel like this is their fault... do you?

You don't want them to feel remourse for the rest of thier lives, if they turn thier backs on thier own Father?

You have to try and stop thinking about the present and focus on the long term effects this will have on the children.....
  #14  
Old 10-18-2009, 09:28 PM
Justforkids Justforkids is offline
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Ironmama,

I do not know the details of your particular case, but I agree with Got2bkids and Representingself, you must always try to encourage the kids to continue a relationship with their father unless the father just simply vanishes from the children's live then there is nothing you could do.
Maybe I should provide more details of my case so everyone understands what we are talking about. I have been looking after the kids 2-3 days a week after school in the last five years (we separated but still lived in the same house). About a month a half ago, she moved with the kids without my consent. At the time she told the kids that they will still see daddy on the same weekdays and some weekends and holidays. In the first week after they moved (before school started), she refused to tell me exactly where the kids were other than an address she told me that they moved to. When I finally saw the kids at school two weeks later, the kids told me that they were not supposed to see me as there was no agreement yet. It is clear that the mother was manipulating the kids as how would the kids know there should be an agreement for them to see me and how would they know such agreement was not in place. The children kept refusing to my access providing different reasons every time I was there to pick them up. About two weeks ago, through her lawyer, she and I finally reached an agreement for the access; however, nothing change after we have an agreement, she still interferes with my access to the children. The children still refuse my access with no valid reason and now they are telling me that they will see me after the court (I assume that the mother told them that they will see me after the court decides the custody issue). It is very clear that she actively alienating the children against me and denying my access to the children. What is even worst is that all I could do is to place my hope at the court. As my previously retained lawyer told me and I think most of us would agree: "courts are not meant for the family".
Currently I am working on obtaining an order for access by way of 14B motion pertaining to our agreement. Failing that I will resume my urgent motion. Can someone please tell me if I can ask the court to assign a psychiatrist or counsellor to help the children?
The children talk with me normally but just refuse to my access even though they were made aware that there is an agreement between mom and daddy. It is apparent that the mother told them not to come with me and I could feel the difficult position they were in. I believe that she has been couched by some people who have very well understanding of the system how to play these dirty tricks.
As mentioned by Miserable, it is very unfortunate that some parents seem to believe that it's ok to alter the child's feelings. Further, it is very sad that some parents are taking advantage of the system but still have the nerve to claim that they are acting on the best interest of the child.

Thanks to everyone for your advices and suggestions, it has been very helpful. But honestly it is a horrible experience going through and that is why I want to share my experience so hopefully others can avoid getting into this kind of situation.
  #15  
Old 10-23-2009, 11:37 PM
IronMama IronMama is offline
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RepresentingSelf and Got2bkid,

I am thankful that I am not one to be easily lead/easily disturbed/ or to be taken on any kind of a GUILT TRIP.
I am thankful I AM STRONG!
You are correct in saying you DO NOT KNOW my case or the particulars of it.
My Children's father LEFT THEM.
My ex-husband LEFT ME. HE LEFT US!
HE turned HIS BACK ON HIS CHILDREN. THAT was ALL HIS DOING and no one can try to make me feel any guilt or any other emotion, EVER.

HE WALKED BY HIS CHILDREN WITHOUT EVEN SAYING HELLO TO THEM, simply because I went to the court for a divorce an Child Support. I had to figure out what to tell them when they asked me why is Dad not talking to them. Why didnt he say hello.

HE LEFT HIS BOYS when they needed him most. HE ABONDONED THEM.What HE did to them is tantamount to Psychological/Emotonal ABUSE.
Why then would I NEED TO FORCE MY KIDS who are ENTITLED to their feelings, upon an ABUSER?
Wont happen!
I have always encouraged them to call him or to speak to him when he calls but I WILL NEVER force them.
Noone could FORCE HIM TO CALL THEM OR COME PICK THEM UP FOR A SOCCER GAME when I first served him papers....that lasted for 1 YEAR! Then he began calling.


For everyone on here I would like to mention the word NARCISSIST.
Google it and then some of you might find the root cause of your dilemas. I sure did.
  #16  
Old 10-24-2009, 10:15 AM
representingself representingself is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMama View Post
RepresentingSelf and Got2bkid,

I am thankful that I am not one to be easily lead/easily disturbed/ or to be taken on any kind of a GUILT TRIP.
I am thankful I AM STRONG!
You are correct in saying you DO NOT KNOW my case or the particulars of it.
My Children's father LEFT THEM.
My ex-husband LEFT ME. HE LEFT US!
HE turned HIS BACK ON HIS CHILDREN. THAT was ALL HIS DOING and no one can try to make me feel any guilt or any other emotion, EVER.

HE WALKED BY HIS CHILDREN WITHOUT EVEN SAYING HELLO TO THEM, simply because I went to the court for a divorce an Child Support. I had to figure out what to tell them when they asked me why is Dad not talking to them. Why didnt he say hello.

HE LEFT HIS BOYS when they needed him most. HE ABONDONED THEM.What HE did to them is tantamount to Psychological/Emotonal ABUSE.
Why then would I NEED TO FORCE MY KIDS who are ENTITLED to their feelings, upon an ABUSER?
Wont happen!
I have always encouraged them to call him or to speak to him when he calls but I WILL NEVER force them.
Noone could FORCE HIM TO CALL THEM OR COME PICK THEM UP FOR A SOCCER GAME when I first served him papers....that lasted for 1 YEAR! Then he began calling.


For everyone on here I would like to mention the word NARCISSIST.
Google it and then some of you might find the root cause of your dilemas. I sure did.

IronMama,

You're just angry because you didn't get the answers you wanted....you expected people to side with you, while you manipulate and brainwash your children....

The fact of the matter is that YOU are angry with your ex and you are projecting those feelings onto your children.

You are bitter and resentful for your ex leaving YOU so you are turning to CHILDREN to get the self-assurance you are so desperate to find.

No matter how you spin this.... IF you deliberately turn those kids against their FATHER then you are wrong...wrong...wrong!!!!!

The only NARCISSIST here seems to be YOU!

You need to seek some therapy or counselling to deal with your anger... One then wil you realize how important it is for you to foster a good relationship between those kids and thier father.

Even if the guy is an evil, selfish prick, doesn't change the fact that YOU shouldn't fuel the fire....

You should be the strong one...

The path you are taking will only make things WORSE...FOR THE KIDS!
  #17  
Old 10-26-2009, 04:28 PM
Stargate Stargate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMama View Post
RepresentingSelf and Got2bkid,

I am thankful that I am not one to be easily lead/easily disturbed/ or to be taken on any kind of a GUILT TRIP.
I am thankful I AM STRONG!
You are correct in saying you DO NOT KNOW my case or the particulars of it.
My Children's father LEFT THEM.
My ex-husband LEFT ME. HE LEFT US!
HE turned HIS BACK ON HIS CHILDREN. THAT was ALL HIS DOING and no one can try to make me feel any guilt or any other emotion, EVER.

HE WALKED BY HIS CHILDREN WITHOUT EVEN SAYING HELLO TO THEM, simply because I went to the court for a divorce an Child Support. I had to figure out what to tell them when they asked me why is Dad not talking to them. Why didnt he say hello.

HE LEFT HIS BOYS when they needed him most. HE ABONDONED THEM.What HE did to them is tantamount to Psychological/Emotonal ABUSE.
Why then would I NEED TO FORCE MY KIDS who are ENTITLED to their feelings, upon an ABUSER?
Wont happen!
I have always encouraged them to call him or to speak to him when he calls but I WILL NEVER force them.
Noone could FORCE HIM TO CALL THEM OR COME PICK THEM UP FOR A SOCCER GAME when I first served him papers....that lasted for 1 YEAR! Then he began calling.


For everyone on here I would like to mention the word NARCISSIST.
Google it and then some of you might find the root cause of your dilemas. I sure did.
That's sad. To me THAT is a deadbeat Dad.
  #18  
Old 10-26-2009, 04:39 PM
billiechic billiechic is offline
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IronMama,

Are your boys still seeing a counsellor? I hope so. I've seen what happens to boys who are abandoned by their father and I wouldn't wish that pain on anyone.

If he chooses not to call them, you can't force him. BUt have you told him that you wish he would and will not interfere? Sometimes the NCP feels they cannot call for reasons of guilt or fear that it will turn into an arguement with the ex. Don't let that be his reason. Maybe you can suggest he (or you) buy a cell phone for the boys so they can talk?

I'm sorry, that is horrible for your boys.
  #19  
Old 10-26-2009, 09:58 PM
IronMama IronMama is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by representingself View Post
IronMama,

You're just angry because you didn't get the answers you wanted....you expected people to side with you, while you manipulate and brainwash your children....

The fact of the matter is that YOU are angry with your ex and you are projecting those feelings onto your children.

You are bitter and resentful for your ex leaving YOU so you are turning to CHILDREN to get the self-assurance you are so desperate to find.

No matter how you spin this.... IF you deliberately turn those kids against their FATHER then you are wrong...wrong...wrong!!!!!

The only NARCISSIST here seems to be YOU!

You need to seek some therapy or counselling to deal with your anger... One then wil you realize how important it is for you to foster a good relationship between those kids and thier father.

Even if the guy is an evil, selfish prick, doesn't change the fact that YOU shouldn't fuel the fire....

You should be the strong one...

The path you are taking will only make things WORSE...FOR THE KIDS!
representingself,you seem to have a lot to say about me, without even knowing anything much about my case/life, but dont seem to have ur confusion that u call your life figured out.

it does not matter what you say on this forum as YOU DONT MATTER. Re-read your own posts and try to figure out ur garbage of a life.
I dont need anyone on here to "side" with me as the courts already saw the truth and I have God on my side.
My kids are beautiful, socially, ethically and spiritually well raised and we are just great.
  #20  
Old 10-26-2009, 10:06 PM
IronMama IronMama is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billiechic View Post
IronMama,

Are your boys still seeing a counsellor? I hope so. I've seen what happens to boys who are abandoned by their father and I wouldn't wish that pain on anyone.

If he chooses not to call them, you can't force him. BUt have you told him that you wish he would and will not interfere? Sometimes the NCP feels they cannot call for reasons of guilt or fear that it will turn into an arguement with the ex. Don't let that be his reason. Maybe you can suggest he (or you) buy a cell phone for the boys so they can talk?

I'm sorry, that is horrible for your boys.
Billiechic,
Yes they see our counsellor still, as a matter of fact we all do. Thank you for your response.

I have already done exactly what your question asks...I have not blocked his calls or come in between him contacting his children.
I have also told him that he can get a cell phone or even install a landline at my house JUST FOR THE BOYS if he doesnt wish to call my number or speak to me.
He was even offered counselling with just the boys and he has refused, and this was to be covered by my employer.
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