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  • #16
    Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
    We have joint custody, I never agreed to hiring this person or consent to the use of these services. I did however offer to care for the children during these periods as I would have prior to the separation.


    Therefore, I haven't personally incurred any "cost" of this nature. Furthermore this is part of my motion to change access material.
    Careful.

    Your consent is not required for daycare for employment purposes. She has no obligation to accept your offer to watch the kids for free. She can choose the daycare without your consent and you are required to pay your proportionate share.

    Even if you "win", I would expect to start funding some of her daycare expenses shortly.

    I didn't express this properly, both my children have experienced this commute for more than a year!
    So you already drive one kid to school for 40km, she has never objected, and now she is objecting to you driving the other kid?

    That's not a great argument on her part

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
      I don't really see how that works, from 0-49% the cost would be even. I still need need to supply a room, food, clothing.....as well as the S.7 expenses daycare and so on.
      The whole point of offset is to set a fair amount given increased costs that comes with shared parenting. Not too clear how shared parenting increases costs per case law.... Perhaps someone with more knowledge could chime on there....

      Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
      Also to clarify the distance I'm 40km from the school, I've been commuting this distance for over a year uncontested.
      I am doing shared parenting and order allows us to live up to 30km apart.. assuming the school could be around 10km from either parent either direction.. then it is quite possible for one parent to be 40km from the school. I would say 40km is not unworkable but not the greatest either. Instead of being 40km apart and worried about the argument she may make.. why not move much closer.. around 5 to 10k and have the distance as something to argue in your favour?

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
        We have joint custody
        Fantastic. So the current order implies you guys have the ability to cooperate and get along.... Makes it easier for you to get shared parenting than sole custody would have otherwise allowed... Only conflict I guess is the disagreement on access. Other than that.. how is communication? Do you guys agree on other things? Cooperate with her as much as you can and avoid giving her any ammunition.


        Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
        I never agreed to hiring this person or consent to the use of these services. I did however offer to care for the children during these periods as I would have prior to the separation.

        Did she ever consult with you before hiring this person ? You should most certainly seek to have opportunity to care for children before 3rd party.

        QUOTE=otttawa_dad;232195] Therefore, I haven't personally incurred any "cost" of this nature. Furthermore this is part of my motion to change access material

        I think this is irrelevant to offset child support. Daycare, if ordered, would fall under section 7.

        What is mom seeking in her response to your motion?

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by tunnelight View Post
          Not too clear how shared parenting increases costs per case law....
          In a nutshell, with shared custody, some costs get duplicated.

          If kids only live with one parent, then that parent can have a house, and other parent can live in a cheap basement room somewhere. If kids live with both parents, then both parents need houses.

          Other things also get duplicated. Both parents "need" the bigger kid-transporting car. Both parents need some gear (jackets, boots). Both parents need to buy dishes for kids, bottles, beds, dressers, etc.

          In terms of case law, I've never seen a judge show a calculation for 9(b), not once. Like spousal support, it is the Wild West on that one.

          Comment


          • #20
            It's in the cards... not feasible at this point, but definitely in the near future.


            Originally posted by tunnelight View Post
            why not move much closer.. around 5 to 10k and have the distance as something to argue in your favour?

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by tunnelight View Post
              Fantastic. So the current order implies you guys have the ability to cooperate and get along.... Makes it easier for you to get shared parenting than sole custody would have otherwise allowed... Only conflict I guess is the disagreement on access. Other than that.. how is communication? Do you guys agree on other things? Cooperate with her as much as you can and avoid giving her any ammunition.
              The communication is "functional" to say the least, sometime we disagree but this is normal in every relationship either together or apart. Bottom line is that we discuss and come to a mutal agreement. I'm all about cooperation and collaboration. I've been collecting "ammunition" for the past 4 years. She played all the "cut cards" right from the beginning, I've been taking the high road. I've started playing cut card as of my motion. She isn't honest and leave trails of her lies everywhere. We have both been subjected to questioning twice, on both occurrences we caught her lying. This will likely be used at trial.


              Originally posted by tunnelight View Post
              I think this is irrelevant to offset child support. Daycare, if ordered, would fall under section 7.

              What is mom seeking in her response to your motion?

              Sole custody and maintaining the "status quo".


              I'm seeking joint custody and shared parenting time.

              Comment


              • #22
                Also to be noted, is we are waiting for an OCL Report and recommendation shortly... i'll post updates as they stream in!

                Comment


                • #23
                  What is her material change in circumstances and justifications to change joint custody to sole custody?

                  I did not know OCL is involved and making recommendations.

                  How did you manage to schedule a trial set without OCL report in hand and without a settlement conference ?

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Our current order had a review clause, we agreed that Child 2 turning of school age constituted a material change and therefore no need to met the threshold/test for material change; probably the best choice I made at that time.

                    Furthermore, aside from Child 2 turning of school age; there have been several material changes:
                    • Sold my house and moved to affordable house; 40km from school
                    • OP hired 3rd parties to care for children while she worked
                    This was a unilateral choice; even though we have joint custody
                    This is what my Initial Motion was regarding
                    • Found an "internet" poster searching for a "nanny"
                    80hrs a month; including, morning, evenings, overnight, weekends, transportation to and from school and to my house
                    • OP denied giving additional access;
                    • Child 1 was not doing well at school with instability of care
                    • The list goes on!


                    Trial management judge, ordered OCL but stated that it could not hold up trial, we should however be getting the recommendation shortly before trial!

                    Trial is set for Jan 21st 2019!

                    Originally posted by tunnelight View Post
                    What is her material change in circumstances and justifications to change joint custody to sole custody?

                    I did not know OCL is involved and making recommendations.

                    How did you manage to schedule a trial set without OCL report in hand and without a settlement conference ?

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      On another note, I spend almost two weeks "watching" a nine day trial where the father was "self-rep'ed" and fighting a similar case I was. Mother was intentionally keeping him below the threshold for CS.

                      Over the nine day trial, I managed to have great exchanges with this gentleman. I assisted him in preparing his questions for examinations and cross-examinations.


                      Judge didn't render judgment on the bench on the ninth day of trial; given I had established a link w this father he promised to send me the judges order as soon as he received them.

                      Got the "order" this morning; Dad get's 50/50... Big Win for his children and him

                      The judge congratulated him on a job well done!

                      I'll post caselaw as soon as it's published on CanLii

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
                        ... a nine day trial where the father was "self-rep'ed"...
                        9 days!?!

                        If the father hadn't self-rep'd, he would have been bankrupt. I'd hate to think what a 9 day trial would cost in legal fees.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by ifonlyihadknown View Post
                          9 days!?!



                          If the father hadn't self-rep'd, he would have been bankrupt. I'd hate to think what a 9 day trial would cost in legal fees.
                          In this case the mom would know.

                          Sent from my SM-G950W using Tapatalk

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Well.... looks like the case law has been published

                            http://canlii.ca/t/hwwzr


                            Dad got 50/50...

                            I'm in a 7 day trial... 2 days already in the books.

                            I'm done testifying... I'm referencing this case law... Same judge and have the dad in question sitting supporting me in my trial!


                            What a stressfull few days this has been... Glad it's over with respects to testifying. Now just have to focus and keep working for the children! I'll keep this thread alive during the course of the trial!

                            I can see the light , 5 years in the making

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              I am late to this but....

                              1) Material change is not required.
                              2) Right of first refusal sounds feasable.

                              why do I say that?
                              https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/do...&resultIndex=1

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by otttawa_dad View Post
                                I'm in a 7 day trial... 2 days already in the books.

                                I'm done testifying... I'm referencing this case law... Same judge and have the dad in question sitting supporting me in my trial!


                                What a stressfull few days this has been... Glad it's over with respects to testifying. Now just have to focus and keep working for the children! I'll keep this thread alive during the course of the trial!

                                I can see the light , 5 years in the making
                                Sending you Good Vibes!!! I cant imagine the stress a trial takes.

                                Happy you have the Other Dad there for support! Most of us won't ever see a trial, including myself. Thanks for sharing.

                                Comment

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