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  • Money in exchange for parenting time?

    Hi all,

    Looking for some views/opinions for the following situation:

    Suppose that you could settle your custody matter under the following conditions:

    1. a shared/joint custody equal time arrangement.
    2. Paying full table CS plus 50% babysitting.

    Knowing that you cant afford the monthly payments and knowing that you could pay less using the set-off amount calculation if you were successful at trial but also knowing that you could fail at trial.

    What would you do?

  • #2
    That's completely unfair, though admittedly it depends on how much money we are talking about. Could she demonstrate "need" for the extra support? Does she work? You see, section 9 gives the judges the discretion to award less than full table support, but it doesn't mandate how much support should be ordered. There is case law for shared custody but still full support is being paid... but it's not the norm. Judges use "set off" as a matter of convention but they consider other things as well, especially needs and means. Mathematically the set off method is still unfair.

    Have you filed a court application yet? Who is offering you shared custody in exchange for full child support? I don't believe most lawyers would recommend it.

    Comment


    • #3
      Why would you fail at trial?

      If you have an offer for 50/50 but with full CS then the other side is admitting that 50/50 is in the best interest of the children. Done.

      As for full CS - that is not fair to you or the kids who live with you half the time. Offset is the norm, and is already unfair to the higher income earner (which you may not be). I would not agree to full CS - it is not reasonable, it is not fair, it is not normal.

      The fact that we are discussing this shows that there is gender bias in the system still - imagine if the genders were reversed how more 'wrong' this would feel.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by billm View Post
        Why would you fail at trial?

        If you have an offer for 50/50 but with full CS then the other side is admitting that 50/50 is in the best interest of the children. Done.

        As for full CS - that is not fair to you or the kids who live with you half the time. Offset is the norm, and is already unfair to the higher income earner (which you may not be). I would not agree to full CS - it is not reasonable, it is not fair, it is not normal.

        The fact that we are discussing this shows that there is gender bias in the system still - imagine if the genders were reversed how more 'wrong' this would feel.

        Thanks All!

        Going to trial is risky as I'm sure everyone here knows, especially if your are a male. It's basically a 50/50 chance of getting what I want, although the lawyers I've spoken to give me a much lower success rate, even though I have a strong case. This is due to the gender bias that exists, it's undeniably.

        What's important to me is being involved In our child's life as much as possible. The equal parenting proposal for Full CS something I proposed as previous negotiations had gone no where, the offer for full CS has brought the other side to the table and it seems probable that she would sign.

        So, in exchange for full CS I would be able to have equal parenting opportunity with our daughter but would indeed cause financial hardship for me. Not only will I pay full CS but I would also fund everything else our daughter needs as the CS is essentially mother's support, our daughter doesn't see a penny of that.

        Thoughts?

        Comment


        • #5
          My thought is that access and support are two entirely separate elements, and should be decided on their own merits. A judge is not going to bargain with you and swap money for access.

          Having said that, it is a little late no? You already opened that door, and no doubt your STBX is salivating at the prospect.

          Comment


          • #6
            My 2 cents doesn't really address the original post.

            But, I feel that's exactly what I do. I pay CS and got the EOW shaft job.

            So, from one point of view - I pay for the privilege of baby-sitting my child every other week-end.

            It's a wonderful world!

            Comment


            • #7
              I think Downtrodden Dad is right. Access and support are different things. You can't use one to "purchase" the other. I imagine any judge would see it that way - specifically, your ex can't "sell" you time with your child for the cost of full child support.

              It sounds like your ex would agree that 50/50 custody is best for the child. That's the starting point. What kind of financial arrangement is appropriate? Table setoff appears to be the answer. Because it's Section 9, a judge could in theory order a non-table arrangement, but he or she would need a pretty strong reason to do so (some unusual circumstances involving your ex, exceptionally high costs of maintaining two homes for the child, etc).

              Unless there are circumstances which make it impossible for your ex to pay her share of a table setoff, I think you have pretty good odds in court, and you wouldn't have to "buy" your parenting time.

              Comment


              • #8
                Send your ex an email asking if they would consider 50/50 if full support was still paid.

                If they respond yes, send another email asking how they imagine the schedule would work.

                Then send another email saying you think the kids would be happy, but what do they think about that?

                After you have several emails from her stating that she would agree, that the schedule would work fine, the kids would be happy, and she forsees no problems, write back and say are going to think it over.

                Then don't bring it up again. Just seek 50/50 at trial. When the ex files arguments against it, your first affidavit includes attached copies of the emails.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Mess View Post
                  Send your ex an email asking if they would consider 50/50 if full support was still paid.

                  If they respond yes, send another email asking how they imagine the schedule would work.

                  Then send another email saying you think the kids would be happy, but what do they think about that?

                  After you have several emails from her stating that she would agree, that the schedule would work fine, the kids would be happy, and she forsees no problems, write back and say are going to think it over.

                  Then don't bring it up again. Just seek 50/50 at trial. When the ex files arguments against it, your first affidavit includes attached copies of the emails.
                  Thanks Mess. Will try to get something, trouble is she may be reluctant to say it in an email Gotta be very crafty with how i ask.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Mess View Post
                    Send your ex an email asking if they would consider 50/50 if full support was still paid.

                    If they respond yes, send another email asking how they imagine the schedule would work.

                    Then send another email saying you think the kids would be happy, but what do they think about that?

                    After you have several emails from her stating that she would agree, that the schedule would work fine, the kids would be happy, and she forsees no problems, write back and say are going to think it over.

                    Then don't bring it up again. Just seek 50/50 at trial. When the ex files arguments against it, your first affidavit includes attached copies of the emails.
                    I have to wonder if this would actually work.

                    my stbx has never responded to any email I have ever sent about coming to an agreement on specific terms.

                    Love it though.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Accept it as soon as possible. make it an order, then in a few months or a year you can ask for changing the CS. You will save much more on the lawyer than you will spend on the CS. And you will not be able to loose that on the trial if it gets there. Getting a shared custody on a trial is very, very risky.

                      Comment

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