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Parenting Issues This forum is for discussing any of the parenting issues involved in your divorce, including parenting of step-children.

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  #1  
Old 07-14-2019, 03:36 PM
fireweb13 fireweb13 is offline
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Default When to stop allowing overnights?

Hello all, quick question as I am extremely frustrated. This may be more of a rant and I am sorry.
Quick background. Daughter is 12-almost 13 years old. Ex and I separated when she was 1.5 years old.
Daughter lived with ex until she was 10 years old. Environment was terrible, drug abuse, constant moving, witnessing of very bad spousal abuse and weapons in the home. After an emergency motion I finally got custody switched, it had been years in the making.
Ex left that guy, immediately with someone else. Moved closer to her parents and has appeared to be clean for a bit.

2 years of scattered access between our daughter and her mom, no child support or scheduled access. Finally have a court order for access, which is 1 weekend and 1 saturday day visit a month. D12 must sleep at her maternal grandparents but can spend day with mom
That court order was made in January 2019.

Ex moved in May, and since then our daughter has visited her mom 3 times overnight. She is still not supposed to be sleeping at her moms but each visit she does. I have asked her to stop, and have out daughter go back to sleeping at her grandparents a few times but my ex just does not respond.

Our daughter now basically does not see her maternal grandparents who she has a very strong bond with and it was a significant part of why she wanted to visit her mom.
Last visit, her moms son was away at his paternal grandparents house, and her fiance was away. This should be a good 4 days of the summer for some mom/daughter time and for them to bond and have a blast doing stuff together right? Instead, her mom had 2 male friends over the entire time and spent the entire time in the kitchen with them ignoring our daughter. From Wednesday until I picked her up, she had not showered and has had several accidents (pee and feces). While here, we know that she has to be on a schedule as this does happen, we even got her a watch that vibrates every 2 hours to help her remember to go. Her mom let her take it off though and didn't monitor her at all. Our daughter spent all day and night on her phone or watching the TV by herself, not showering, not going to the bathroom properly, and not taking her meds. I try so hard to give my ex a chance, I do not want to sever their relationship further than it is already but I am just at a loss of what to do. She goes against everything she should be doing and then just ignores out daughter to spend time with these 2 random guys when her fiancee is out. My ex also has a very strong history of cheating as well. Her fiancee is a decent guy and seems to be a positive influence compared to others she has been with, but now it seems like life is going backwards again.

Thank you, I tried to keep it brief. She also has not paid child support since the order in January, though FRO did garnish her income tax return so our daughter got some of the CS she should be getting.
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Old 07-14-2019, 03:47 PM
rockscan rockscan is offline
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There are two issues here:

1. Child support—you cannot get blood from a stone and if she is not earning money then FRO cannot garnish it. The order will continue and gather arrears but that will be up to her to deal with.

2. Access issues—if your daughter is having health issues while with mom or has safety issues then she needs supervised access which it seems she has with her grandparents. It may be worth involving them in this. For instance dropping child off at grandparents and insisting that mom see her there. Or simply having them spend time with child and tell mom that is where she is.

The grandparents may be a bigger asset than you think. Might be worth a chat with them. Your ex will not change and there is little the courts can do. You already have custody and a support order. They can’t make her smarten up. Your child also needs to learn some things too about asserting herself on wearing her watch and taking care of herself.
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Old 07-14-2019, 04:30 PM
fireweb13 fireweb13 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockscan View Post
There are two issues here:

1. Child support—you cannot get blood from a stone and if she is not earning money then FRO cannot garnish it. The order will continue and gather arrears but that will be up to her to deal with.

2. Access issues—if your daughter is having health issues while with mom or has safety issues then she needs supervised access which it seems she has with her grandparents. It may be worth involving them in this. For instance dropping child off at grandparents and insisting that mom see her there. Or simply having them spend time with child and tell mom that is where she is.

The grandparents may be a bigger asset than you think. Might be worth a chat with them. Your ex will not change and there is little the courts can do. You already have custody and a support order. They can’t make her smarten up. Your child also needs to learn some things too about asserting herself on wearing her watch and taking care of herself.
Thank you. Sometimes I just need to get this stuff off my chest. I worry so much about being a parent who stops a child from seeing their other parent, it is a huge anxiety for me now that the roles are reverses and our daughter lives with me instead.

I will speak to the grandparents and see what their 2 cents are as well. I feel that they are likely missing their time with their granddaughter very much. I know our daughter has a really strong bond with her maternal grandfather, the 2 of them get along so amazingly that I want her to see him as much as possible. My ex just does not get it, before she would be confrontational and always argue everything but lately if there is a chance for conflict she just stops responding and then does what she wants anyways.
I have been working with our daughter about asserting herself and being in control of herself, and self confidence and all those fun things. She attends a trauma therapist as well, and a psychiatrist to help. She has made leaps and bounds in the 2 years she has been away from her mom but there is still so much progress needed for her to function normally. We try and provide a normal and stable enviroment for her which helps, but her relationship with her mom will always be a source of mental conflict for our daughter. Our daughter recognizes her mother has mental illness and has abused drugs in the past, she has confided to her therapist about it. She is getting a better understanding of where she stands in the world, but its a struggle.
Keep on fighting the good fight I figure, she is an amazing kid to do as well as she is doing despite what she has gone through.

Thank you
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Old 07-14-2019, 05:41 PM
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Janus Janus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fireweb13 View Post
no child support
Sounds like FRO garnished what they could. Not much more you can ask.

Quote:
She is still not supposed to be sleeping at her moms but each visit she does.
How many times have you asked her to stop (in writing)? I'm not sure if you can just unilaterally stop overnights. I think you have to go to court for this one. Seems to me like it is clearly contempt, and I almost never say that.

Quote:
Instead, her mom had 2 male friends over the entire time and spent the entire time in the kitchen with them ignoring our daughter.
Unlike the sleeping arrangements which are specified, this is none of your business. I do find it curious that you felt the need to specify the gender of the friends.

Quote:
From Wednesday until I picked her up, she had not showered and has had several accidents (pee and feces).
Honestly, might be easier to deal with your daughter directly on this one. She is 12 years old. Obviously there are issues (not the first time I've heard of people using the 2 hour watch) but she needs to take some responsibility for her own cleanliness.

Quote:
My ex also has a very strong history of cheating as well.
None of your business. Who appointed you guardian of your ex's new relationship?

Summary:
1) Document the sleeping thing. Bring the court eventually. Do NOT act unilaterally against the court order. Her being wrong does not allow you to be wrong as well.
2) Deal with daughter directly for the cleanliness thing
3) Deal with the infidelity thing never, it's makes you sound creepy and it's not your problem.
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:00 PM
tilt tilt is offline
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She is still not supposed to be sleeping at her moms but each visit she does. I have asked her to stop, and have out daughter go back to sleeping at her grandparents a few times but my ex just does not respond.

The Order does not have any more power than you give it. If an Order is not followed despite you reminding them, then either you go to Court to enforce the Order or you both ignore it and it becomes unenforceable on both of you.
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Old 07-14-2019, 09:34 PM
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You have legal custody. If other party is not adhering to Order you go to court to seek change to order so Order can be enforced.

Regarding cleanliness - if a 12-yr-old female (presumably menstruating or soon to be) doesn't have a brain injury or some other developmental disability then there is really no reason for poor personal hygiene.
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Old 07-14-2019, 10:45 PM
Berner_Faith Berner_Faith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian View Post
You have legal custody. If other party is not adhering to Order you go to court to seek change to order so Order can be enforced.

Regarding cleanliness - if a 12-yr-old female (presumably menstruating or soon to be) doesn't have a brain injury or some other developmental disability then there is really no reason for poor personal hygiene.


I’m going to assume by how the OP has explained everything there are some underlying issues. That being said, my step daughter is 11 and no word of a lie when she comes to us she very rarely remembers the last time she showered... when questioned why her response is her mom doesn’t tell her to and during the day she does chores or plays on her iPad and doesn’t think to... when she’s with us on the weekends she shows Friday night and Sunday before going to moms... during the summer she’s with us every other week and we make sure she showers every other day or every day depending on her baseball schedule. My point is, they are still kids and sometimes need reminding... if the parent isn’t assisting in making this second nature to them, kids don’t get it


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Old 07-15-2019, 07:24 AM
Mom 2 Two Mom 2 Two is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Berner_Faith View Post
I’m going to assume by how the OP has explained everything there are some underlying issues. That being said, my step daughter is 11 and no word of a lie when she comes to us she very rarely remembers the last time she showered... when questioned why her response is her mom doesn’t tell her to and during the day she does chores or plays on her iPad and doesn’t think to... when she’s with us on the weekends she shows Friday night and Sunday before going to moms... during the summer she’s with us every other week and we make sure she showers every other day or every day depending on her baseball schedule. My point is, they are still kids and sometimes need reminding... if the parent isn’t assisting in making this second nature to them, kids don’t get it


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I completely agree. Some kids definitely need to be reminded until they just get it in there own. My kids come home from dads and they are never showered. And that is after two days of hockey. They also don’t brush their teeth. I always remind them before they go. And they always say they just forgot or were too tired. Most kids imo until they are 15-16... need reminders for most things. I make my kids shower and brush their teeth. They don’t get a choice. And yes my almost 11 yro son is getting into the habit at home of doing it himself most of the time. But at dads he knows no one is checking.


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Old 07-15-2019, 10:08 AM
iona6656 iona6656 is offline
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this is tough- I'm sure there are a whole slew of other things you are not telling us.

I'm with Janus- don't unilaterally stop the overnights. Email everything- in terms of concern. Start the process to restrict access to supervised. Ask Ex if visits can go back to being at the maternal grandparents completely.

How's your daughter doing with this? Does she still want to go back?

I think it is relevant if the two visitors that spend the weekend are male (related or unrelated. doesn't matter)- does your daughter know them? Did she feel safe? Ok?

also- fuck an access schedule- if your daughter feels uncomfortable or unsafe with people in her moms house- tell her to call you and let her leave the situation. I hope you've had a discussion with her about sexual assault- and all that terrible shit we need to teach girls.
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Old 07-15-2019, 10:37 AM
fireweb13 fireweb13 is offline
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Thank you all, yes there is a huge amount of info that I left out, things were bad enough that I was successful in an emergency motion to get custody and move our daughter in with me 2 hours away from where her mom was residing.

Alot of our problem is that because of the trauma she has experienced in the past, she goes into "survival mode" when things go bad at her moms. Which means she isolates herself to the point of ignoring the world,, to the point where she has toileting accidents.

These 2 men at her moms house, she had no idea who they were and this was the first time meeting them. I have spoken to her about consent and all that stuff, but in the past she has witnessed her mom be raped, and beaten..... I honestly have compassion for my ex, but I have to protect our daughter.

I found out last night that our daughter spent most of the time at her moms by herself though, as mom was out. She has only been to this house 2 times, and it is pretty isolated.

I am going to be speaking with her CAS worker and with her parents to come up with a plan that will keep our daughter safe but not cut her mom off entirely, just have visits supervised.

Thank you again, we are headed away for 2 weeks for a summer trip, so it should help our daughter relax a bit and be happy again.

Take care
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