Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

CS from the under or unemployed?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • CS from the under or unemployed?

    Can someone give me insight into the benefits of pursuing CS through legal channels if the parent in consideration is unemployed?

    For perspective, he is employable (fully able-bodied with 2 college diplomas), however, he has a long history of unemployment or underemployment. We, at one point, had drawn up our own separation agreement where he agreed to pay table amounts of child support. He did not hold to this agreement.

    Is it worth the headache even if it's likely to not lead to support? Is there a benefit to establishing that you have done your due diligence in trying to secure support for your children? Is the likely fallout worth it?

  • #2
    I see you were on this forum as far back as 2010.

    You would therefore know that in order to enforce your SA you would have to register with FRO.

    From your previous posts you indicate the father of your children is chronically unemployed.

    You would also know that the court can impute a wage for someone who is unemployed.

    Comment


    • #3
      Can someone give me insight into the benefits of pursuing CS through legal channels if the parent in consideration is unemployed?
      How is he supporting himself?

      FRO can garnish EI, tax returns and other government money.

      Comment


      • #4
        Yes, I came here in 2010 initially. After joining, he moved local to us and got a job, and he began parenting 50/50. In June of this year, he moved 8 hours away and bought a house with his girlfriend. He quit his job here to move and says he cannot find a new job. The last time that I asked him what his plans were for work and child support, he was belligerent with me (yelling and swearing) and accused me of harassment. He does not think that we need him to pay because he thinks that my husband makes a lot of money.

        To my knowledge, he does not receive EI because he quit his job and he is not on welfare. His girlfriend works and supports him, as I understand.

        I avoid confrontations like this even when I know that I need to have them. I get anxious about things like registering with FRO.

        Your advice is to go ahead? Even if he will become more difficult to deal with? I am worried about the impact on the kids.

        Comment


        • #5
          Do I give him a head's up that I am going to pursue this legally, or do I just do it?

          Comment


          • #6
            You can file a motion for support and ask that he be imputed an income. You can attempt to get it set at the money he was making at his last job. If that fails you should be able to get him imputed with at a minimum of a full-time minimum wage salary. Which I believe is around $24,000.

            Comment


            • #7
              Ok.

              I feel so anxious about all of this. He will be furious.

              Comment


              • #8
                Yup, he will be. But it isn't your problem that supporting his kids makes him angry. If he truly feels he is not obligated to pay, he can take it to court and see if he can get a judge to agree with him.

                Do not let him intimidate you out of doing the right thing for your kids.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Do you know how much he made when he was working full-time?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    No, I don't know how much. It was a huge ordeal to get him to disclose his income before when we did up our separation agreement. I don't think he made a lot, but I am not sure.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hi, Ames.
                      I believe you haven't been to court yet and just have a separation agreement. Important: is this agreement done with independant legal advice, was it also signed by your lawyers, or otherwise notarized? If not, you may have trouble enforcing it.

                      You may register a separation agreement/domestic contract with the court, and it can then be enforced by FRO. From what you say, I don't believe that at this time you may register with FRO.

                      You may not file a motion if you have not filed an application for trial and been to a case conference. At this point in time I would not think about solving things with a motion unless you had earlier begun the court process. From what you say, it seems you haven't.

                      If your separation agreement is registered with the courts, I believe you may file a motion to update it, but I am not certain. I always got confusing and conflicting answers from my lawyer on that. Perhaps someone else here could confirm that, or else you should get a consulation with a lawyer and find out.

                      Court should not be a first resort, and you need to be able to show you gave the other party a chance to settle. This goes even beyond the issue of seeking costs; you can't just file a suit without first asking the other party to settle, or at least negotiate. The exception might be if they cannot be contacted or found.

                      If this were me, I would contact the father and request support based on at least minimum wage ($20,000 per year.) Do this by registered mail, with a follow up by email referencing the contents of the letter. Be businesslike and unemotional; short, and to the point. Don't try to justify anything or give reasons for needing money; this just invites counter-arguments. Support should be paid because it is the law. Simply that.

                      If/when you get a refusal - why I suggest an email follow up - you then can show you have reason to file with the courts. Although it seems daunting, the intial stages can be done by yourself, just download the forms. Do your financial disclosure, write up the application detailing what you are seeking: imputation and an order for support, section 7, and arrears. Then file it and serve him.

                      Many people will smarten up once they are served. More than 90% of family court cases are resolved before trial. So just start the process yourself, we can help you, and the clerks at the courthouse will help you, and it needn't cost you more than a few hours and some stamps.

                      If your ex still refuses to negotiate, that is the time to consider a lawyer, or what your next steps will be.

                      If your ex doesn't want to pay and won't negotiate, they are not going to magically change their mind or change into a different person. So if this were me, I would take the steps I outlined.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thank you Mess! I have been reading about the process and, yes, the agreement that we previously had was never notarized or anything. I don't think it is applicable anymore anyway.

                        I have email records going back at least a couple of years requesting table amounts for child support and with him agreeing to pay this amount. I will write up a letter and send it. I would like to avoid court if possible.

                        Do you have a link to the forms that you mentioned for downloading? I appreciate your help with this. I have been avoiding really dealing with it for so long that it feels incredibly daunting.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          ETA I think I found it. Is this where I should be looking?

                          Family Law Rules Forms — Ontario Court Services

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Yes, those. I think blinkandimgone had a page where you could fill them out online the other day.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Ok, I found the online application to fill out. I'm working on it right now, but I don't have exact dates that it is asking for (the date that we began living together, for example - I want to say that we got our first apartment together with both of our names on the lease in September 2002, but I'm not 100% of the date, and we "lived together" for about a year prior to that). I used to have the original rent receipt from our first month in our first place, but I don't have that anymore. How specific do the dates need to be?

                              Comment

                              Our Divorce Forums
                              Forums dedicated to helping people all across Canada get through the separation and divorce process, with discussions about legal issues, parenting issues, financial issues and more.
                              Working...
                              X