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  • #16
    OK, but facetiousness aside, once one parent has established that the other parent is, in fact, leaving eight-year-olds alone (which, granted, has not yet happened yet, clearly the OP is trying to think ahead just in case), the first step is to address it directly with the other parent as diplomatically as possible, but if that is unsuccessful, then as a last resort, it would not be inappropriate to call the CAS.
    To be honest, I think it is always preferable to avoid involving outside authorities if at all possible, as the kids then have to witness conflict that should remain behind-the-scenes and about which they should not need to concern themselves, but if all other avenues have been pursued, there are some issues that can't simply be dropped, simply because parent A doesn't want to call CAS on parent B. Hopefully it will not come to that in this case.

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    • #17
      Safety issues should be treated seriously.

      My comments on the Durham CAS guidelines: they are a little unrealisitc. Most 12 year olds I know are more than capable of staying home all day. The babysitting course is for children 11 years and older, not 12.

      Each case is individual and should depend on the child's maturity level and ability to handle situations. Most 12 year old children could manage to take care of themselves quite well for a full day.

      When the teachers were on strike a few years ago, the news addressed this issue frequently. Children 10 years of age are allowed to watch siblings for the day. Only one of my kids would have been able to do this at 10. There are no specific laws.

      When my husbands ex let her new partner drive the kids around without seatbelts, let alone car seats, the CAS said it is a police issue and the police could not charge him without witnessing the situation. We did not return the kids after access as we felt their lives were in danger.

      She filed an emergency motion to have them returned to her care. Kids were not allowed to be driven by this loser until she took vehicle to police station and showed that they had seatbelts installed and tether latches.

      This has not proved well for her in court cases since then, as it has directly shown her poor parenting decisions. She actually put in writing: what's the big deal--it is only around the block. they don't need seatbelts for a short trip.

      Comment


      • #18
        Thank you for the posts. That is what I was thinking - not a daddy vs mommy issue but rather a safety issue and I should be concerned, especially with the carseats. I am 100% sure that the kids are no longer in the car seats when with him - the booster seats were at the house the other weekend when he was out of town with them.
        I am actually terrified to confront him on these issues in any manner, even through email. The seperation is recent (3 months), almost every time I have tried to touch base, even to ask simple things like "is there any essentials I need to pick up before coming home for my time with the kids" I get the brunt end of ranting and accusations. He is already accusing me of trying to keep the kids away from him and gain full custody (we are on a 50/50 schedule right now) and refusing to go to mediation because of it. He was in an accident after seperation during his time with the kids. I dropped everything and came home to take care of them during his hospitalization. When he was released, he demanded that he should get 10 days in a row with the kids because he should be in his own house to recover even though he could not take care of them on his own and would have his mother staying with him, doing the driving and basic care of the kids. During his hospitalization and recovery afterwards, I drove 150km round trip to bring the kids for visits, pulling them out of school and missing work. I ensured they spent time with him 7 out of the 10 days (the other 3 days, they did not see him because he did not want it that day) I asked that I had a day or two to think and talk to my lawyer before responding. He showed up at the house within an hour and told the kids that Mom was leaving for 10 days. I told him that the primary care of our kids should be done by a parent, not a grand-parent and I wanted to be with the kids until he could care for them and I would ensure that they saw him every day if he wanted. I ended up fighting through my lawyer because this went against the previously agreed to custody arrangement but did ultimately meet him half way to be nice.
        I guess that although I have a true safety concern for my children, my worry with confronting him is that I will get berated with accusations again, told that I am harrassing him. If I call the CAS, same thing or worse from him.
        How do I get out of this mess in one piece? If I don't say anything, am I liable if god forbid something happens and I knew? I also have evidence that he may be suicidal etc.... Anyone gone through this type of landmine before and made it out on the other side intact? I don't want to prevent him from having 50% of parenting with the kids but I do want to ensure that my kids are safe.

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        • #19
          Paragraphs are your friend.

          Comment


          • #20
            Massive wall of text crits for over 9000...you die....

            LMAO

            Just be reasonable. Get a lawyer if you haven't already and put forward a reasonable motion to settle.

            At 3 months the wounds are still fresh and he's probably heard all kinds of horror stories about Dad's getting rocked in family court. As long as he's not a danger to them, and you are willing to work with him to come to a fair and reasonable settlement, he'll come around.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Mess View Post

              Is a car seat important? Yes. Do I use car seats? Yes. Is it necessary in every single possible driving situation (ie driving a child to school in a 30k zone?) That isn't clear.
              YOU may drive 30 in that school zone but what about the chick coming the other way doing 80 and texting? Seatbelts cannot protect children in a crash. They were not designed to restrain children who are much shorter and weigh less than an adult.

              So yes, it is necessary.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by canadamama View Post
                OK, but facetiousness aside, once one parent has established that the other parent is, in fact, leaving eight-year-olds alone (which, granted, has not yet happened yet, clearly the OP is trying to think ahead just in case), the first step is to address it directly with the other parent as diplomatically as possible, but if that is unsuccessful, then as a last resort, it would not be inappropriate to call the CAS.
                To be honest, I think it is always preferable to avoid involving outside authorities if at all possible, as the kids then have to witness conflict that should remain behind-the-scenes and about which they should not need to concern themselves, but if all other avenues have been pursued, there are some issues that can't simply be dropped, simply because parent A doesn't want to call CAS on parent B. Hopefully it will not come to that in this case.

                I've had CAS involved. It's really NOT as bad as people think. They are trained on how to talk to the children. My girls have NO idea why these people are really there so they are not witness to conflict. All they know is that some nice people show up and ask them some questions. And kids LOVE to talk so they spill everything.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by inseperationhell View Post
                  Thank you for the posts. That is what I was thinking - not a daddy vs mommy issue but rather a safety issue and I should be concerned, especially with the carseats. I am 100% sure that the kids are no longer in the car seats when with him - the booster seats were at the house the other weekend when he was out of town with them.
                  I am actually terrified to confront him on these issues in any manner, even through email. The seperation is recent (3 months), almost every time I have tried to touch base, even to ask simple things like "is there any essentials I need to pick up before coming home for my time with the kids" I get the brunt end of ranting and accusations. He is already accusing me of trying to keep the kids away from him and gain full custody (we are on a 50/50 schedule right now) and refusing to go to mediation because of it. He was in an accident after seperation during his time with the kids. I dropped everything and came home to take care of them during his hospitalization. When he was released, he demanded that he should get 10 days in a row with the kids because he should be in his own house to recover even though he could not take care of them on his own and would have his mother staying with him, doing the driving and basic care of the kids. During his hospitalization and recovery afterwards, I drove 150km round trip to bring the kids for visits, pulling them out of school and missing work. I ensured they spent time with him 7 out of the 10 days (the other 3 days, they did not see him because he did not want it that day) I asked that I had a day or two to think and talk to my lawyer before responding. He showed up at the house within an hour and told the kids that Mom was leaving for 10 days. I told him that the primary care of our kids should be done by a parent, not a grand-parent and I wanted to be with the kids until he could care for them and I would ensure that they saw him every day if he wanted. I ended up fighting through my lawyer because this went against the previously agreed to custody arrangement but did ultimately meet him half way to be nice.
                  I guess that although I have a true safety concern for my children, my worry with confronting him is that I will get berated with accusations again, told that I am harrassing him. If I call the CAS, same thing or worse from him.
                  How do I get out of this mess in one piece? If I don't say anything, am I liable if god forbid something happens and I knew? I also have evidence that he may be suicidal etc.... Anyone gone through this type of landmine before and made it out on the other side intact? I don't want to prevent him from having 50% of parenting with the kids but I do want to ensure that my kids are safe.
                  Seriously, call CAS. They will talk to the kids first and determine if there is an issue they need to address. Tell them what it is you are looking for - for your ex to be educated on the repercussions of leaving the children alone. They can tell you what they can and cannot do to help you.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Ok, I just sent him an email on the booster seat, figured that would be a good first shot instead of going to CAS right away. I will involve the CAS if need be. I couldn't sit back and say nothing as it is a safety issue in my mind and there are laws in place. Your responses re-iterated that in my mind. I just phrased it that the twins were giving me a hard time about using their booster seats in my car because they did not have to anymore in his car. I mentioned that I have noticed the booster seats are not in his car when he goes away with them and they did not meet the height, weight or age restrictions dictated by Ontario Law and I was concerned for their safety if anything happened. I asked that he please reconsider his decision and resume using the booster seats for them.

                    Now is the wait game - see what kind of response I get from him tomorrow either through email or when he picks up the kids. Wish me luck... I know that I had to say something for thier sakes - I would not be able to live with myself if something did happen. But I am nervous for tomorrow and the backlash that I will get if history repeats itself I will surround myself by good friends just in case.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      I know how you feel. In the beginning I used to have a friend with me as much as possible when I had encounters with my ex because of the verbal abuse. Eventually, it got so bad that we now avoid contact altogether (thank god).

                      Word of advice - try to get him to respond by email as much as possible so you have a record.

                      Good luck.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Ok...6 days after the email, he has not responded, not even acknowledged that part of the email (although he spouted off about other items). After the email, I have hard evidence that he has not used the car seats with the kids. Question - what is everyones experience with calling the CAS...seems like an extreme but I am worried for the kids. He is abusive, refusing to go to mediation etc. If I phone the CAS, can it be anonymous? Will it come back to haunt me with the divorce? I just want to survive and get to the other side in one peice. I have been called every name in the book, he holds a joint life insurance policy on me which I can't have changed without his signiature (straight from the insurance company) and I am getting screwed all around. He is not working, I am still paying all the bills even though we are seperated.... I have been told by my lawyer to i.e. not pay his cell phone but the cell phone is bundled with the internet and if I don't pay, the internet gets cut off...Rogers is insisting on his cooperation to unbundle and he wont give it... I feel like I am on rock bottem, my hands are tied, I am a pawn...I have friends telling me I should just quite my job and become homeless to make a point - I cannot do that to my 3 kids because they would suffer. He is depressed (recently on medication which I found out through my work's medical claim forms) and suicidal.

                        Am I screwed? If I call the CAS, could it backfire? If I don't, could I be viewed as neglectful if something happens and I knew?

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by CSAngel View Post
                          YOU may drive 30 in that school zone but what about the chick coming the other way doing 80 and texting? Seatbelts cannot protect children in a crash. They were not designed to restrain children who are much shorter and weigh less than an adult.

                          So yes, it is necessary.
                          For two years my ex took my 5-6 year old to school 3 times a week in a cab with no child seat. Because the child seat was not required by law.

                          Would you call the CAS on her?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I don’t understand this line of argument regarding taxis and car seats. Am I missing something? I’m perplexed b/c I have found that as new member and in reading posts on these forums, Mess’ points are usually fair and balanced. But, in this case, I’m just not gettin’ it…. The father is not driving a taxi, so the point of taxi driving with no car seats is moot. As you stated above, provisions regarding no car seats and taxis is an EXCEPTION to the law, not the rule. Using that line of argument, why don’t we just all the take the position that we are driving taxis and therefore are exempted from using car seats….???????

                            In any event, my own two cents regarding the car seats, for whatever it’s worth, is that YOU are the parent and YOU should act however you deem fit for the safety of your children. Yes, there is a law regarding car seats (as well as exceptions to it J) and there will be parents out there (regardless of whether they are together or not) who will choose to follow it to the letter of the law and others who will choose to be a little less strict in adhering to it. My only advice to you is to ask yourself if you would be hyper-vigilant about it if you were still together. If the answer is yes and it is extremely important to you, then pursue it. If the answer is no, you may want to think about how you proceed…

                            And remember to keep in mind that how you act now may affect you later on. If you are going to be hyper-vigilant about car seats then you will have to think about maintaining that level of vigour with other issues that come up or risk him making claims that you are unreasonable or only selective in those parenting items where you deem him to be less than adequate regarding your children’s safety and security irrespective of course, of different parenting styles. Keep in mind too that if you do continue to press certain items where you disagree, he may then take the approach that you’re being ‘too picky’ and being unreasonable. And also, it opens the door for him to make any claims in the future about anything that YOU might do that he disagrees with or that may be on the negative shadow side of the law. On the other side of it, if you do not do anything about it, it sends a silent message to your ex that you are just willing to ‘accept’ what happens with respect to parenting issues and those items that are legislated. If later on something MORE serious comes up and you cause an issue over it, his response may be that you sat idly on the sidelines regarding previous issues and then will question your rationale or legitimacy for bringing up other issues. Either way, it’s a kind of damned if you do, damned if you don’t scenario. It’s therefore good to think about the future consequences of your actions from the legal side of things and how his counsel might position him with respect to your actions (assuming he will retain counsel and go that way, and sadly, they only too often do). It’s unfortunate that you have to worry about the short- and long-term ramifications of your actions in the legal battleground, but unfortunately, such is the set up of our system that tends to be more adversarial than not.

                            Good luck to you however you proceed, for the safety of your children.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              My point is that if you take a kid to school in a taxi without a car seat, it's legal.

                              If you take a kid to school in a private car, people here are saying call the CAS.

                              The child is in equal danger of an accident in either vehicle and I think that calling the CAS is an over reaction.

                              I appreciate that you usually get my points and disagree with this one. Everyone has a right to their opinion.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Yes, but under that argument, it’s like saying we should use the exception to not enforce the rule. It’s like saying that if any parent decides to not use a child car seat when traveling in their vehicle when it’s required under the law, it’s A-Okay because when considering someone traveling with their child in a taxi, car seats are not legally required. And that, if the other parent is concerned about it, it’s an overreaction because when traveling in a taxi, car seats are not required. It’s like comparing apples to oranges though. Might as well not adhere to the law at all then because car seats for children in taxis are not legally required, and, so, ipso facto, they are not required at all.

                                I would also point out that there are several cab companies who do accommodate parents who wish to use a car seat for their children (either they bring their own or in some cases the cab companies provide them) for safety reasons even though it’s not legislated, because, as you say, the child is in equal danger of an accident in either vehicle. It’s all dependent on how diligent the parents choose to be regarding their children’s safety.

                                No disrespect, but it sounds like her situation hit a little too close to home and you’re taking your own personal situation and applying it to hers. Your ex took your child to school in a cab. But, nowhere in her post, did she mention it was for the sole purpose of taking their children to school. For all we know, he could be driving umpteen kms with them. The point is…we don’t know. What we do know is what the law says, and if she is concerned about her children’s safety and there is a clear violation with respect to the law, then she should act as she deems fit based on her own personal situation. Would ‘I’ be as concerned about it? Perhaps. Perhaps not. But that’s not the point.

                                I guess we’ll agree to disagree on this one. But, I certainly do appreciate the mental work-out, the opportunity to disagree in a respectful way, and the friendly banter available through these forums.
                                Cheers!

                                Comment

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