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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #31  
Old 10-09-2013, 09:36 AM
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NBDad NBDad is offline
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Do I use total gross taxable income? Or straight up gross?
Line 150 of your tax return.

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X's lawyer stated that my daughter does NOT need to contribute at all and that she has reached age of majority therefore I have no rights to see her marks. She stated that even if my daughter failed school that this would not terminate my support obligations.
Don't take legal advice from your ex, or their lawyer.

In this case, the ex's lawyer is blatantly incorrect. IF the child is over the age of majority, AND no longer enrolled in full time post secondary, they no longer qualify as a child of the marriage, and your support obligation terminates.

Quote:
age of majority, in respect of a child, means the age of majority as determined by the laws of the province where the child ordinarily resides, or, if the child ordinarily resides outside of Canada, eighteen years of age

child of the marriage means a child of two spouses or former spouses who, at the material time,

(a) is under the age of majority and who has not withdrawn from their charge, or
(b) is the age of majority or over and under their charge but unable, by reason of illness, disability or other cause, to withdraw from their charge or to obtain the necessaries of life;
Full time post secondary is a valid "other cause".

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The letter I received back was that I have no right to ask for these financials as the payor
Give them the three years of income tax returns, you are legally obligated to provide them on request within 30 days.

You should also request HERS as well in return. She is also obligated to provide these to determine section 7 split.

The other financials, she is not obligated to provide, but you CAN seek an order to have them provided due to her income being less than full time min. wage and wanting to determine her "true income".

IF they push it to court, your response for requesting the financials is twofold:

As per the guidelines, "section 7" outlines the requirements as follows (important part in bold)

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7. (1) In a child support order the court may, on either spouses request, provide for an amount to cover all or any portion of the following expenses, which expenses may be estimated, taking into account the necessity of the expense in relation to the childs best interests and the reasonableness of the expense in relation to the means of the spouses and those of the child and to the familys spending pattern prior to the separation
IE. you require it to determine her means of contributing.

and secondly...to determine your ex's true income/earning potential.

Quote:
19. (1) The court may impute such amount of income to a spouse as it considers appropriate in the circumstances, which circumstances include the following:

(a) the spouse is intentionally under-employed or unemployed, other than where the under-employment or unemployment is required by the needs of a child of the marriage or any child under the age of majority or by the reasonable educational or health needs of the spouse;
Also Section 21 (5) of the guidelines:

Quote:
(5) Nothing in this section precludes the making of rules by a competent authority, within the meaning of section 25 of the Act, respecting the disclosure of income information that is considered necessary for the purposes of the determination of an amount of a child support order.
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  #32  
Old 10-10-2013, 02:46 PM
Tiredfella Tiredfella is offline
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Default CS and overtime case law?

Hey all! Thanks for all the advice so far and FamilyLaw9, thanks for the phone call!!!
I know it is very rare, but does anyone know of any case law in regards to not including overtime/vacation pay or union dues into the gross income? I know I work my butt off to make extra and my family also pays the price for this. But it's what I do to get ahead! Skip vacation so that I can cash extra out for extras for us. But I just want to know if there is any hope of merely having my base salary used in calculations or should I go right ahead and just bend over and no longer work overtime and such since it just bites me in the ass at the end of everything???
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  #33  
Old 10-10-2013, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Tiredfella View Post
Hey all! Thanks for all the advice so far and FamilyLaw9, thanks for the phone call!!!
I know it is very rare, but does anyone know of any case law in regards to not including overtime/vacation pay or union dues into the gross income? I know I work my butt off to make extra and my family also pays the price for this. But it's what I do to get ahead! Skip vacation so that I can cash extra out for extras for us. But I just want to know if there is any hope of merely having my base salary used in calculations or should I go right ahead and just bend over and no longer work overtime and such since it just bites me in the ass at the end of everything???
I've always wondered how people claim this.

If you went from $60,000 income to $70,000 income with overtime. Your child support for 1 child goes up $93.00 / month or $1116 / year. Lets say Government takes 36% off the top. So $6400 is your money. Subtract $1116 from $6400 and your left with. $5284 in your pocket.

Two kids it's $1740 which leaves you with $4660 in your pocket.

I totally get it means more money in your ex's pocket as well but you are much better off in the end. $5000 can go a long way.

Now of course you have to consider the quality time you are losing by not being with your family. But that's not a financial decision.
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  #34  
Old 10-10-2013, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by oink View Post
Yes....Here lies the problem
So some would rather everybody get $0.

Got it.
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  #35  
Old 10-10-2013, 05:49 PM
Tiredfella Tiredfella is offline
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I can appreciate your train of thought oink, but when 14 years ago the ex states she makes 30k doing the same thing she does now but only makes 11k today kinda makes you wonder when her house has gone from an apt to a 500k home! Hmmmmmm..... Also my deductions run more into the 51% area 36 would be great!
My daughter is not a bank for her and would never be left behind. But seems to me that I have to keep working harder to get ahead and she gets to decrease her work. I don know about u but handing over 1k + kinda leaves a bad taste when I know it doesn't directly go to my D. Just saying. It's not worth me working harder cuz my tax bracket gets higher leaving me with less and not worth the sacrifice. I'm better off just taking the time off. Sucks to think that way but seriously why run myself ragged.... Anyhow, was just an honest question. Like I said does anyone know about what I previously asked?
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  #36  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Tiredfella View Post
.....But I just want to know if there is any hope of merely having my base salary used in calculations or should I go right ahead and just bend over and no longer work overtime and such since it just bites me in the ass at the end of everything???
I hear you.

Never could figure out why, if the purpose of CS is to help the child maintain a lifestyle similar to what it was in the family unit, the child all of sudden needs double the support $$$$$ because the payor decides to put in twice as many hours.
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  #37  
Old 10-14-2013, 09:22 AM
Tiredfella Tiredfella is offline
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Default This is ridiculous....

Sending all my stuff to the Lawyer and we will see what happens I guess. On another note, my daughter has approached me saying she knows what's going on and all the BS her mom is putting me through. She wants to help but has a strong devotion to her mom (which is fine). I told her that all this crap has nothing to do with her and that it is just between her mom and I and she just needs to focus on school.
She wants to say something to so one but I don't want her getting involved and messing up her studies with the added stress..... Her mom keeps flaunting how much money she makes around her and talks about the money tat her uncle gave her for school (which she refuses to disclose) and my D is very tired of it all. Is there any way I can have some sort of annonymous statement entered if it comes to that??? That way it protects her and gives her a little sense of relief??
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  #38  
Old 11-26-2013, 01:10 PM
Tiredfella Tiredfella is offline
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Default still waiting.......

Well, quick update; have sent full financial disclosure to the lawyer, have not received anything but line 150 on her return and basically nothing from her business.....

The X and her lawyer haven't even addressed the offer to settle in the very first letter I responded to her with and have basically ignored everything that I have suggested.

My duaghter is sick and tired of her moms greed and has no idea how she is justifying any of this with the amount of money she actually makes and what they are spending on renos at the house (really none of my business).

I'm at a loss now of what to do...... Everything is ignored and the longer this goes on the longer the back pay increases the biger my bill gets which will probably go straight to the renos and not my daughter..... Yes, I understand that it goes to the X too but cutting a 5 figure check (most likely) directly to mom is ridiculous when my D should at least be getting half! She is either in college or working and rarely at the house these days. Pays for everything (majority of things) herself with her income and has made it a point not to ask her mom for anything.

Where to go now? I hae even offered more money than in my previous offer and still nothing...... To me, it seems like her greed has consumed her and I just don't get it, but would really like this to be dealt with ASAP! so I can move on with my family as well. D and I have a great relationship btw.

From what I have read here, there is no deviation from the guidelines even with an adult child involved so I haven't even tried to low ball...... But seriously, this is BS........ I have offered to send $$$ 60% of tuition right away and we can deal with the other issues later but just needed a for of payment that they would accept.... nothing.

Her lawyer keeps talking about the support my X owes me for the 5 months D lived with me and makes statements as to her "Net income" being really low......well no kidding, my net is just above half of what I make but that's not the number they are looking at!! LOL! I told them I don't even care about the money for back then because it was the fact that my D was kicked out of her house and I just wanted her to be taken care of, hence my house!! Still nothing..........

I don't know..... this is just starting to mess with my head a little when I hear the horor stories about back support and such. All I see is number signs and think I won't be able to take care of my current family.......

It just seems like I have absolutely no control.......
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  #39  
Old 11-26-2013, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Rioe View Post
Oh, you are thinking of the T2202A form for transferring the tuition and education amounts from a child who earns little and doesn't really need the deduction, to ONE parent who can make better use of it. Works best on the taxes of the parent with the higher income, and I don't believe there are any restrictions about it being the parent with majority custody.

It's surprising, now that I think about it, that we haven't read more stories about parents fighting about who gets to claim it, the way we see lots of threads about the CCTB and section 7 tuition.
I have a question about this. My husband's D19 just graduated. We told her we would pay her full tuition (10k). Mom has a part time job. She only makes about $100 week. Dad does not work. I work. There's no point in him claiming the tuition deduction. Can I claim it? (Me being the step-mom).
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  #40  
Old 11-26-2013, 09:15 PM
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I will be very interested in hearing the answer to this question.
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