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[iona6656]

here's a wacky question to the OP- how are the extra nights affecting the kids? you live in a different city- but how far? Does it work for them to be with you on Sunday nights?

Could YOU move closer to where they're based now?

[Abba435]

Thanks Janus, much appreciate your thoughts. It was clear to me that my ex was trying to extend CS as long as possible to line her pockets. I had to choose between the option of either giving her an extra year of CS, or to extend litigation (and legal bills) to a trial that wouldn't take place for another year anyway.

When asked for definitive answer, my lawyer said it was offset CS occurred when I reach 6 overnights in a 2 week period. But he also said that worst case scenario is that I have to pay for a few extra months until I graduate to that 7th overnight.

Number of sleeps is commonly used but it is not law. So 6/14 does not automatically mean offset.
40% is 5.6 "sleeps" so why not just say 6/14ths is the math to use?
As usual with family law it is all about precedent and how the judge feels.
Also spousal support can also be impacted as CS is part of the calculation when you go from sole payor to offset.
Same for the Section 7 ratio.
i know that MySupportCalculator does not match DivorceMate but gives a very good indicator.

[Abba435]

Also, when offset is in place then "normal" expenses should be addressed to limit conflict. Who buys winter boots? What kind? New or used sports equipment? Bus passes? Car insurance? It is yet another complication.

[LovingDad1234]

Also, when offset is in place then "normal" expenses should be addressed to limit conflict.

Does anyone have templated language for this? I foresee this as an issue. I currently pay Table Amount and my ex still asks me to buy stuff. I purchased wardrobe so that she has clothes at her dad's, but who pays for stuff that should travel with her is a good point.

[Abba435]

Does anyone have templated language for this? I foresee this as an issue. I currently pay Table Amount and my ex still asks me to buy stuff. I purchased wardrobe so that she has clothes at her dad's, but who pays for stuff that should travel with her is a good point.

There is no template. Everyone is on their own. More legal fees to get sucked away.

[rockscan]

Does anyone have templated language for this? I foresee this as an issue. I currently pay Table Amount and my ex still asks me to buy stuff. I purchased wardrobe so that she has clothes at her dad's, but who pays for stuff that should travel with her is a good point.

You don’t need language. The answer is no. Your child support pays for her needs. There have been parents on here who had ex’s that sent their kids to their other parent with old clothes or stuff from goodwill. The advice was, you keep your own clothes at your house and send them home in the old clothes from moms.

It’s not that complicated. My child support pays for their needs.

When you get to 50/50 then you can split things like backpacks and snow suits etc but again, you equalize her household income by 50/50 support and thats that.

[LovingDad1234]

So what happens when you find yourself paying 95% of the stuff like backpacks, winter boots, etc. when you are exercising 50/50? I noted that my ex doesn't buy anything for our kids. I know to keep the toys, gadgets, skates, clothes at my place but I am talking about the stuff that should go whereever the kids go----like winter boots, winter coats. Seems to me I am always paying for that stuff. I keep receipts but how do I get my fair share??

[rockscan]

Tell her no. Shes not going to send the kids out without snow suits or boots. Just a firm no and don’t buy it. It sounds difficult but its not.

When you get to 50/50 you tell her no again. Or you say you will pay your share when she sends you a receipt.

Think about it, there are thousands of payors in this province who don’t pay. What do you think their former spouses do? Do you think they just wait or send their kids without things? Not always. Your ex has a family that enables her so let them continue to enable her. They can buy boots!

[Abba435]

So what happens when you find yourself paying 95% of the stuff like backpacks, winter boots, etc. when you are exercising 50/50? I noted that my ex doesn't buy anything for our kids. I know to keep the toys, gadgets, skates, clothes at my place but I am talking about the stuff that should go whereever the kids go----like winter boots, winter coats. Seems to me I am always paying for that stuff. I keep receipts but how do I get my fair share??

A huge hole in all but the very best separation agreement is enumerating specifically who pays for what under sole payor or cross support .
Very few get into the appropriate details and none actually state what happens if sole support switches or vice versa.
There is NO right of offset if the receiving parent refuses to pay for what you think the kids need , refuses to provide properly when they reside with you or feeds them properly. No recourse except Motion To Change and we all know the bar is high and very very expensive in terms of money, time and energy.
If you do not have a detailed itemized list and do not have a written right of offset then you are like 99% of separated parents.
The receiving parent holds all the cards in how that cash gets spent.
Does anyone seriously think it all goes to the kids???? Rare as a unicorn.
This is a HUGE hole in family law IMHO.
It can only be remedied by a detailed agreement and the good faith (earnest and honest) of both parents.
No judge can force anyone to act in good faith.

[Janus]

but who pays for stuff that should travel with her is a good point.

Impossible to create language around that.

Mom has to buy boots? Maybe she buys boots at the local thrift shop that has holes in it. She has complied with the agreement. Dad has to buy schoolbag? He gets a dukes of hazzard bag with a big confederate flag on it. He has complied with the agreement.

[Abba435]

Impossible to create language around that.

Mom has to buy boots? Maybe she buys boots at the local thrift shop that has holes in it. She has complied with the agreement. Dad has to buy schoolbag? He gets a dukes of hazzard bag with a big confederate flag on it. He has complied with the agreement.

zactly
Good faith cannot be defined in a contract.
Support can go up their nose or down their throat.
Very little recourse.
Sad but true.
All the money that pours into the legal system should be spent on setting up co-parenting services with enforcement. It would be way cheaper adn much better for the children. In my dreams.

[Janus]

All the money that pours into the legal system should be spent on setting up co-parenting services with enforcemen.

Enforcement of what?

If you want an order that can be enforced, you get a court order. What could a "coparenting enforcement agency" enforce that could not be enforced by the courts?

That said, I would support creating an organization similar to FRO that enforced parenting time. Obviously, parenting time would have to be explicitly described in the separation agreement for enforcement. Beyond the benefits of parenting time being enforced (at low cost to the parent who is losing parenting time) it would also encourage parents to be less vague in their separation agreements, which would probably be a good thing.

[Abba435]

Enforcement of what?

If you want an order that can be enforced, you get a court order. What could a "coparenting enforcement agency" enforce that could not be enforced by the courts?

That said, I would support creating an organization similar to FRO that enforced parenting time. Obviously, parenting time would have to be explicitly described in the separation agreement for enforcement. Beyond the benefits of parenting time being enforced (at low cost to the parent who is losing parenting time) it would also encourage parents to be less vague in their separation agreements, which would probably be a good thing.

Start with a blank page.
Standard agreement is used to establish residency, decision making, financial issues etc.
Government department hires paralegals, mediators, accountants, social workers.
Parties pay into a fund to pay for costs (not perfect). Possibly geared to income.
All big issues are pretty much determined using standard terms including who pays for what, rights of offset, dispute resolution. Essentially the best possible separation agreement imaginable and fill in the blanks.
Detailed, specific with consideration of exigencies.
Then monitored as needed, revised as needed
Vexatious and harassing legal proceedings are nipped in the bud.
Enforceable from the get go

[rockscan]

I would start an enforcement agency only if it meant I could punch people in the face. There are a lot of divorced parents who need a good clocking to get over themselves.

What do you say Janus, think the Dragons would get on board and invest?

[Abba435]

I would start an enforcement agency only if it meant I could punch people in the face. There are a lot of divorced parents who need a good clocking to get over themselves.

What do you say Janus, think the Dragons would get on board and invest?

A real "enforcement" agency, NHL style