Undue Hardship? Please help!

[HammerDad]

Do you have a home phone? Cell phone? Internet? TV? Car payments? Do you pay into rrsps? Are you living at or below the poverty line? Are you struggling to put food on the table? Can you afford dinners out even once a week?

Unless you are supporting your family on a very, very limited income and have no extras (TV, cell phone, etc.) your claim for undue hardship is very weak

As for your education question... everyone is welcome to update their education, but doesn't mean they get to stop supporting their children. did you seek to have an income imputed??

Essentially this ^^^

The requirements to establish undue hardship is very high. You essentially have to be living with no "luxuries" like TV, cell phone, internet, a very basic car, a modest house etc.

And also, while the ex can go back to school, they still have an obligation to support the kid(s). They can't just say they aren't making anything anymore so you are on the hook. Doing that is called being intentionally under-employed and can cause a court to impute an income equal to what they were making (or are capable of making) to them.

[HammerDad]

What would be a fair income to place on the ex? She made 50k annually before she elected to attend school. Now she has done 4 years university.

Do you have evidence of their prior income? If you did, did you request that amount be imputed to them? It sounds like they were making $50k, but now has an income of $35k imputed on them. You either agreed to this, or the court found there was some mitigating factors allowing for the lesser amount.

What is their degree in? Go online to Workopolis etc and see what an entry level position in that field, in their geographic area, pays.

When did the ex complete the degree? Was it just last month? If so, it would probably be reasonable to give them some time to find employment in that field. If 6 months down the road, they aren't working, you could ask that incomes be adjusted to amounts paid in that field, in your city for an entry level job, or an amount equal to what she was making prior to going back to school be imputed.

[lemontree]

It's not totally clear that they are actually finished this degree, however the ex has been in school now for four years. We didn't really agree to an income placed on her, we agreed to an amount of child support without having to go to court and I believe it would work out to her having a salary of approx. 35 down from 50.
She's mad about something now and wants its all re evaluated.

[stripes]

It sounds like you don't have a case to have CS reduced because of "undue hardship", but you probably do have a case to have your ex's CS amount raised, which would reduce the amount of offset you pay.

An imputed income of $35K for someone with four years of university sounds way too low to me. Do you have a court order imputing her at $35K? If so, seek to have it changed based on what an entry-level salary in her field would be, as posters above have suggested.

If you don't have a court order, send her your ex a letter saying you wish to change the means of calculating CS to incorporate an income for her which more realistically reflects her earning power, and to use the federal child support tables to calculate that offset. If she objects, go to mediation. Court would be a last resort.

[lemontree]

Is there any point in which the courts will look at a family household income?
I am paying her, yet she lives in a nicer house, can afford more vacations and has a much higher standard of living etc.. My child obviously benefits from that as well which is great, however I would like to keep that money to spend on her while she is with me if its not needed at the other household.

[stripes]

Is there any point in which the courts will look at a family household income?
I am paying her, yet she lives in a nicer house, can afford more vacations and has a much higher standard of living etc.. My child obviously benefits from that as well which is great, however I would like to keep that money to spend on her while she is with me if its not needed at the other household.

You and thousands of others are in this position. I too am the net payor of offset to my ex, who has remarried and has a much higher household income (and more lavish lifestyle) than I do. However, unless you're absolutely destitute and your ex is Bill Gates, there's not much you can do about it.

Under Section 9C of the FCSG, in shared parenting situations the amount of child support is supposed to be determined by "the conditions, means, needs and other circumstances of each spouse and of any child for whom support is sought", but in practice, you would be hard put to get anything other than offset if you took your current arrangement to court, and the cost of the court battle would be pretty daunting.

[HammerDad]

Is there any point in which the courts will look at a family household income?

Yes, if your ex tried to claim undue hardship their household income would be pulled into the equation.

The test for undue hardship is extremely hard qualify for as all expenses are scrutinized. It is hard for good reason, as if it was easy, the courts would be flooded with people who want to minimize c/s payments.

Aside from imputing an income to the ex I will suggest this - forget the fact that the ex may live in a nicer house then you or whatever difference in lifestyle there may be. It isn't healthy and generally only leads to resentment which carries over to other unrelated issues you may have. Just focus on the fact that you are happier without having to live with them.

[FB_]

You would have a much higher chance of getting an income imputed if someone else is supporting her while she is attending school.

[MrToronto]

The hard fact is by the time "this starts winding it's way through the Court" the maternity leave will be over.

I see a number of threads started by lemon I wonder if he's building a major case to stop his ex's lavish lifestlye

[Tayken]

All I have to say about undue hardship and the claim that the OP is making is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcfkEA2INMw

I highly recommend OP that you watch the video, understand the relationship I am making to your handle (lemontree) on this site and the complaints that you are brining forward on a claim for undue hardship... and in other threads.

You need to realize (and fast), lemongrab, that you are not going to get any government cheese with your "wine"(ing)...

Good Luck!
Tayken

[lemontree]

Not looking for cheese. Looking for something that's fair. If you knew half the situation you would understand why I'm asking for the advice I am. When you pump out $550 monthly to someone who doesn't use it on your child and is MUCH better off than you it can be quite discouraging, especially when things are tough for yourself at home. I'm not looking for ways to get out of my financial obligations towards my child, for I would NEVER have her missing any necessities, I am just looking for ways to ensure I am not getting ripped of by this crocked (in my opinion) system that allows these things to happen.
Thanks anyway.

[FightingForFamily]

Lemontree, you're doing the right thing for your child, and you need to focus on your own life not your ex's.

If you're having a hard time dealing with it emotionally, I would suggest counselling.

[FB_]

Not looking for cheese. Looking for something that's fair. If you knew half the situation you would understand why I'm asking for the advice I am. When you pump out $550 monthly to someone who doesn't use it on your child and is MUCH better off than you it can be quite discouraging, especially when things are tough for yourself at home. I'm not looking for ways to get out of my financial obligations towards my child, for I would NEVER have her missing any necessities, I am just looking for ways to ensure I am not getting ripped of by this crocked (in my opinion) system that allows these things to happen.
Thanks anyway.

Does the child have a roof over his head?
Does the child have clothes on his back?
Does the child get fed?
Does the child have toys?
Does the child have a bed?

This all costs money so how can you say it's not used on your child?

I get it as I'm a payer of almost the same amount in off-set but the money is going to your child no matter how you look at it. Just because the other person has money left over does NOT mean it's not being spent on the child.

I can understand your anger with the other person not working to their full potential. Getting them imputed with an appropriate income is the solution as mentioned already.

[DowntroddenDad]

Not looking for cheese. Looking for something that's fair. If you knew half the situation you would understand why I'm asking for the advice I am. When you pump out $550 monthly to someone who doesn't use it on your child and is MUCH better off than you it can be quite discouraging, especially when things are tough for yourself at home. I'm not looking for ways to get out of my financial obligations towards my child, for I would NEVER have her missing any necessities, I am just looking for ways to ensure I am not getting ripped of by this crocked (in my opinion) system that allows these things to happen.
Thanks anyway.

You don't get it.

The money is there to provide for your child, and is totally independant of what your ex makes. You are looking to get out of your obligations. Plain and simple.

If you want to argue that your ex should bear more of the share of the extraordinary expenses, that is entirely fair. But unless you are paying more than the table rate for support, I find a hard time being sympathetic. Many of us have to downsize our lives, live more modestly, to provide for our kids in this situation.

[MS Mom]

According to your original post - the standards of living in the two homes are similar. You also state that her and the new spouse purchased a half-million dollar home and live lavishly.

If the standards of living are close - how is she "living well" and you are not?