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  • Well... looks like we are heading to trial..

    Just got Dad’s brief and revised offer to settle for sept 17 brief... we are so far apart it’s ridiculous...

    At this point I would prefer just for a judge to decide as I am quite confident he won’t get anywhere near what he is asking...

    I was hopeful we were going to somehow find some common ground.

    He is even demanding way more than what the OCL has recommended... again with no material change that would suggest anything needs to change....

    Shouldn’t have gotten my hopes up...


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  • #2
    Don't lose hope. That was my exact feeling when I got my ex's initial offer back (3 months after we sent ours). So far apart.

    How we got to settlement though was I compromised on financials and he compromised on parenting.

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    • #3
      Out of curiosity, what does your lawyer think? Have you asked him/her- "where do you see this going?"

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      • #4
        I have spent $18k already... I’m not compromising anymore. We have an agreement in place that he has no reason to not follow. No material change... even the judge told him last SC he is nuts and has a huge uphill battle. The kids continue to struggle in his access time. I have now had to purchase a phone plan for my 11 yro old because he is terrified to connect to dads wifi.
        He called me Sunday hyperventilating because dad yelled at him on his bday and was calling him stupid. The OCL pointed out that he kids are in a toxic environment when gf’s kids are there. And her kids continue to bully mine.

        The latest comment from her kid to my 7 yro was... “we know you tell your mom you don’t like coming here, so why do you keep coming.. why don’t you hurry up and stop”.

        My lawyer says that my ex is nuts and out to lunch and that even off the record my ex’s lawyer says she agrees with us but must follow her clients direction....

        Remember 6 year status quo. SA in place and working fine until gf interfered. Which OCL also commented on... and dad paid his share up until the day he moved in with gf and her kids...

        Dad makes more then me... although this year he is on par to drop his income by about 6 k... from 2013 his income was 49k. Then hovered between 48–49k until 2018. Judge told him income will get imputed as he has historically worked 40 and 44 hrs every other week. He is trying to make his hours be 40 hrs average. Which they never have been.

        Anyways I get what your saying... but my children and their emotional needs must come first and foremost. I have done the therapy. Gotten them help to cope. Took them to classes that help. Dad continues to do nothing.

        I’m not giving in and if I go broke doing it it’s fine as my kids happiness and health are most important. My lawyer believes I will win and get costs. So I must push ahead I guess.


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        • #5
          oh- I'm not at all saying you should compromise on financials. I was just saying how I got to the end of a what seemed like never ending battle.

          is it his girlfriend that is egging him on in this insane journey? at some point someone has to have spoken with him about this?

          personally- I'm curious as hell who spoke to my ex. Was it his sister? Mother? His lawyer? It was a big about-face for him to go from fighting for shared custody to sole w/ EOW and one night per week. I actually re-read our MOS every couple of days wondering if I missed something- why did they just agree?

          But my point is- expect the worst...but hope for the best. When you're in a high conflict divorce- hope is the thing you live on. This WILL end eventually. You have a good position. You guys all told me- just sit and wait it out.

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          • #6
            I know you mean well... I appreciate it. I’m just so frustrated... and so is my lawyer. I’m sure he LOL’d when he read this new revised offer.


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            • #7
              Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post
              I have now had to purchase a phone plan for my 11 yro old because he is terrified to connect to dads wifi.
              What happens when he connects to dad's wifi?

              He called me Sunday hyperventilating because dad yelled at him on his bday and was calling him stupid.
              Why on earth is he calling you during dad's parenting time to complain about dad? What did you say to him?

              Kid has to learn to deal with dad. He won't learn that by calling you for help when the going gets tough.

              My lawyer says that my ex is nuts and out to lunch and that even off the record my ex’s lawyer says she agrees with us but must follow her clients direction....
              Both of those sources are the same source: your lawyer, that one you are paying who work for you.

              I've had clients, and what they get from me is not the unvarnished truth. I need their money!

              I’m not giving in and if I go broke doing it it’s fine as my kids happiness and health are most important. My lawyer believes I will win and get costs. So I must push ahead I guess.
              So the lawyer thinks it is ok to spend money on the lawyer, because the lawyer (who you are paying) says that you might get the money back. You have a helluva lotta faith in your lawyer, I gots to say.

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              • #8
                Ok Janus...

                What are your thoughts on what the judge said to dad??

                Judge clearly said

                You won’t get joint custody after 6 year status quo... and the OCL report...

                Judge told him to stop with the mischief with his income and that he is going to get income imputed.

                And that possibly maybe some tiny tweaks can be made to access. I made some major tweaks to it give him waaaay more time then he has now.

                Also judge told him that he should be paying for what is in our agreement.

                All the other children are given wifi. On their devices. My child has been denied over and over again. They won’t give it to him. So he can’t contact mom. If he uses the house phone. Dad and gf stand over him while he talks.

                My son was hyperventilating. And dad just makes it worse by telling him he is over reacting. Would you speak to your child like that who already has anxiety diagnosis that dad is well aware of.

                I spoke to my son for almost 20 mins to calm him down. I repeatedly told him to get tell his dad how he is feeling. And he refuses because dad just makes fun of him.

                Are you not the one who tells other dads on this forum... when they want to upset status quo or try to get more access that they have an uphill battle with no material change in circumstances?

                Yet when a mom comes on with the exact situation dad has put her in you don’t seem to say that to the mom??


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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post
                  What are your thoughts on what the judge said to dad??
                  I don't think I had any thoughts? I was just warning you that many people come here talking about how their lawyer says everything is going to be a slam dunk. Lawyers sometimes lie.

                  Judge clearly said You won’t get joint custody after 6 year status quo... and the OCL report...
                  Judges are clear in rulings. The fact that you feel a judge was clear before the ruling makes me wonder if you are relating the courtroom proceedings accurately.

                  All the other children are given wifi. On their devices. My child has been denied over and over again. They won’t give it to him. So he can’t contact mom. If he uses the house phone. Dad and gf stand over him while he talks.
                  You are in court. It makes sense to control the information that comes from his house. Also, I still don't get how "not getting the wifi password" translates to "terrified to get the wifi password".

                  My son was hyperventilating. And dad just makes it worse by telling him he is over reacting.
                  Well, mom has some blame here too. Son really has no business calling mom in the middle of dad's parenting time to complain about dad. Well, let me fix that... mom has no business talking to the son about dad's flaws during dad's parenting time, or any time for that matter. If son calls, let him know that you love him, you are there for him, but he is with his father now and if he is upset he should deal with his father.

                  Would you speak to your child like that who already has anxiety diagnosis that dad is well aware of.
                  Probably not, but I can understand why a parent might feel that it was the correct response. Kid is having anxiety over nothing, it can be frustrating as an outsider (or an inexperienced parent).

                  I'm not saying that dad is a better parent than you, I'm just saying that you need to give him a chance to be a parent. If you are letting your son call you to vent, you are very much causing the problem.

                  I think there was another poster a couple months ago that did the exact same thing with her kid, kept on intervening during dad's parenting time and then bemoaned the fact that the kid and father had a lousy relationship.

                  I spoke to my son for almost 20 mins to calm him down. I repeatedly told him to get tell his dad how he is feeling. And he refuses because dad just makes fun of him.
                  Sounds like something dad and son need to work out, without mom intervening.

                  Are you not the one who tells other dads on this forum... when they want to upset status quo or try to get more access that they have an uphill battle with no material change in circumstances?
                  I do tell parents that.

                  Yet when a mom comes on with the exact situation dad has put her in you don’t seem to say that to the mom??
                  I'm confused, what was I suppose to say that I failed to say?

                  My bias is that I think kids do better with both parents. It turns out that moms tend to be more interested in excluding the other parent than dads, which is why you might think you have noticed a gender bias, but you're wrong.

                  More accurately, I'm against most people in the forum. If I agree with a poster then there isn't much point in me typing up an "I agree!". Where is the fun in that?

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                  • #10
                    Well... looks like we are heading to trial..

                    Originally posted by Janus View Post
                    I don't think I had any thoughts? I was just warning you that many people come here talking about how their lawyer says everything is going to be a slam dunk. Lawyers sometimes lie.







                    Judges are clear in rulings. The fact that you feel a judge was clear before the ruling makes me wonder if you are relating the courtroom proceedings accurately.







                    You are in court. It makes sense to control the information that comes from his house. Also, I still don't get how "not getting the wifi password" translates to "terrified to get the wifi password".







                    Well, mom has some blame here too. Son really has no business calling mom in the middle of dad's parenting time to complain about dad. Well, let me fix that... mom has no business talking to the son about dad's flaws during dad's parenting time, or any time for that matter. If son calls, let him know that you love him, you are there for him, but he is with his father now and if he is upset he should deal with his father.







                    Probably not, but I can understand why a parent might feel that it was the correct response. Kid is having anxiety over nothing, it can be frustrating as an outsider (or an inexperienced parent).



                    I'm not saying that dad is a better parent than you, I'm just saying that you need to give him a chance to be a parent. If you are letting your son call you to vent, you are very much causing the problem.



                    I think there was another poster a couple months ago that did the exact same thing with her kid, kept on intervening during dad's parenting time and then bemoaned the fact that the kid and father had a lousy relationship.







                    Sounds like something dad and son need to work out, without mom intervening.







                    I do tell parents that.







                    I'm confused, what was I suppose to say that I failed to say?



                    My bias is that I think kids do better with both parents. It turns out that moms tend to be more interested in excluding the other parent than dads, which is why you might think you have noticed a gender bias, but you're wrong.



                    More accurately, I'm against most people in the forum. If I agree with a poster then there isn't much point in me typing up an "I agree!". Where is the fun in that?


                    Isn’t the point of a SC to get the judges opinion? Well I feel like he was clear in his opinion about what dad is asking for. And that he is not going to get it.

                    Dad had put our son in a scary situation. They have a dog and a new cat. Son put dog in bedroom. Closed the door so he could get the cat to his room. Dad yelled at son for this and opened the door and let the dog out while the cat was in his arms. Resulting in the cat scratching the crap out of our kid and kissing and clawing at the dog. They all know the two animals don’t get a long. So sorry don’t think my kid was over reacting when he got covered in scratches.

                    And all I did was talk to my son and calm him down. I didn’t say anything about how dad treated him and did you miss where I said I kept encouraging him to tell his dad how he felt. And when he kept begging me to come and get him I kept saying I can’t this is your dads time you need to talk to daddy... sorry not gonna hang up on my kids just because he is at dads house.

                    He is afraid to be on the wifi because he suspects they know he has it as they can see the devices in use. And he is just a worrier and worries he will get In trouble. And it’s usually the gf yelling and insulting him and then locking him in his room..

                    Except my 7 year old messages-me on an iPad at 11pm.. 12 am. Sometimes on dad’s weekend. So much for controlling what comes from his house. Monday night I got a FaceTime call at 11:50 pm... guess they were checking and hit it accidentally

                    I agree with you. Of course kids do better with both parents... except not when the one parent didn’t want them 6 years ago. Then said parent gets a partner who will do all the work for him as his wife once did and now he wants them half the time. After all this time when dad has never had a good relationship with either of his kids. Same for when we were married.

                    I’m all for change... work towards it sure. Do the work... go for the parenting classes. Or dad an kid therapy... the slowly add more time. Which is what I have offered.

                    Except dad shoves some consent in my face saying I must agree for him to chose a therapist... follow all therapist recommendations (before they are even know ). Wants it signed irrevocably. Lol. And then says I too shall attend when called upon. With no say in anything?? Hmmm little controlling? They said once I sign consent them details of who therapist is would be provided. Guess what... gf is a secretary for a therapist who does custody and access therapy and assessments. Ya good try though.

                    Yet before I started court proceedings I begged him and his gf to attend family therapy all together so we could get on the same page. It went ignored. But now he is ready. Lol.

                    I have fought to include dad in everything... not exclude him... he was never interested. Same when we were married. Same goes now. Invited to everything. Therapy. Drs.. nope doesn’t show.

                    You do seem bias even though you say you aren’t. Just my observation... didn’t say I was always right.


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                    Last edited by Mom 2 Two; 09-12-2019, 05:48 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Mom 2 Two View Post
                      Dad had put our son in a scary situation... Resulting in the cat scratching the crap out of our kid and kissing and clawing at the dog. So sorry don’t think my kid was over reacting when he got covered in scratches.
                      I thought we were talking about wifi, how did this segue into cats and dogs?

                      I agree with you. Of course kids do better with both parents... except not when the one parent didn’t want them 6 years ago.
                      I've talked to a lot of kids. Many would love to have a missing parent back in their lives.

                      Except dad shoves some consent in my face saying I must agree for him to chose a therapist... etc etc
                      Again, where is this coming from? You are all over the map. I know you hate your ex and you think he is terrible. Extra examples don't really prove much beyond that.

                      You do seem bias even though you say you aren’t. Just my observation... didn’t say I was always right.
                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

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                      • #12
                        Cats and dogs is why he called my crying...

                        He called me on his phone I have to pay for because of the wifi thing..

                        I don’t know why I keep explaining myself.... it doesn’t matter. Your is opinion is what it is.




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                        • #13
                          Janus, for the most part I agree with you on your feelings about parenting but this time I disagree with you. Sure Mom2Two has made some poor decisions and inserted herself into situations she shouldnt have but overall, some parents do that type of thing when their child is hurting. I doubt you would turn a blind eye if it was your child in crisis. Yes I know you will come back with “but my children know not to call me” response.

                          This entire case has spiraled out of control because dad has allowed his gf to take over. Even OCL has acknowledged it in their observation and report. You have a highly sensitive 10 year old with diagnosed anxiety issues who does not know how to deal with difficult situations. Imagine a kid on a schoolyard being bullied with the teacher standing there doing nothing. This kid has been forced to spend time with someone else’s children, be bullied and demeaned by them and have his own father ignore it. Dad was wrong to throw them into this situation rather than ease into it and also work with a professional either before or after.

                          None of dads behaviour has been child focused and as a result mom has to deal with the aftermath. The kids come home upset and acting out. They don’t sleep and struggle at school. The teachers are telling mom they had a rough go and they need additional supervision in school. Their therapist has laid out things that need to be done to help kids cope. Yet mom is the only one doing it.

                          This is a parent who refuses to pay for health benefits to cover medical costs and then says no to his share of said medical costs. A man who reduces his work hours to pay less child support and then cries broke because of his obligations to his new family.

                          The list goes on but you get the point. Now you have a frustrated parent who has spent close to two years university tuition to get dad to not only pay his child support, but also put his kids needs first. He refuses both. Mom2Two has a right to be frustrated, angry, scared and upset. Before you jump down her throat about minute details she is mixing up in her turmoil, take a deep breath and read between the lines.

                          You’re normally really astute and I have called M2T on things she needed to give her head a shake on both here and offline. In this instance I give her my support because this guy is doing more harm to his kids than good and thats just through a useless legal battle he can’t win.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by rockscan View Post
                            I doubt you would turn a blind eye if it was your child in crisis.
                            Sure but my children know not...

                            Yes I know you will come back with “but my children know not to call me” response.
                            ...errr, well. But it's true! I mean, they might complain, but at mom's house mom makes the rules. At my house I make the rules. At school the teacher makes the rules. At the game the coach makes the rules. That's the sad lot for kids, part of why being an adult is more awesome.

                            If my kid had a problem with the soccer coach, we would discuss it at home, not in the middle of the soccer practice or game.

                            Before you jump down her throat about minute details she is mixing up in her turmoil, take a deep breath and read between the lines.
                            Ok, I just reread a bunch of her stuff. Point taken.

                            sigh

                            I apologize M2T.

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                            • #15
                              Well... looks like we are heading to trial..

                              Thank you Janus..

                              I am working with my kids and therapists to teach them the very thing you just said about the rules... even when you don’t like the rules... whoever makes them.. you follow them and discuss at home later.. but when the kid is getting bullied and made to feel awful about themselves all the time and then kid has awful anxiety and panic attacks you have to deal with that first.

                              My kids dad isn’t an awful person. He is just not equipped.. and he won’t get help to get equipped. So he relies on others.. which you said before isn’t right.. the parent should parent not the step parent. But again your also right he made the decision to continue to not be equipped and put gf in charge and we are all just sadly trying to teach the kids to cope with it. It’s very very hard for them. Therefor any significant extra time with dad is going to only create more issues than there already is for my kids...

                              This forum has helped me by telling me when I am being silly and need to let certain things go that aren’t worth the fight... it’s helped. My kids need someone to advocate for them and it’s always been just me. Again dad just doesn’t understand... I do keep that in the back of my mind....

                              It’s scary to think where/ how they would be if I hadn’t fought for the services and therapists and accommodations at school if I wasn’t equipped as well.

                              And now I am being very quickly depleted of the funds that should be allotted to continue to support my kids with these services..with no contribution from dad for now the past 1.5 years...

                              I really truly feel like giving up... I almost feel like saying.. here you (Dad) take the kids.. and we will see how they are in two years... you deal with the anxiety attacks and the teachers notes and phone calls.. (which I always share all with dad and welcome him to call teacher to offer any suggestions and they go ignored) and dr and therapists appointments.

                              I will be the parent who gets them every other weekend. Keep them up till midnight and let them play on their devices 24/7 and ignore them all weekend and then send them back to you Sunday night. Then maybe dad would see what is actually going on... or at least feel it. ;-(.

                              Except I have wonderful people in my life who try to remind me that I am doing a good job and my kids and I will get through this somehow and that the judge too will see what is actually going on.


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                              Last edited by Mom 2 Two; 09-13-2019, 06:31 AM.

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