Should we allow the kids to stay overnight?

[Genxer]

My wife and I have been dealing with her ex-husband who has the following history (the past 5 years): 1. Moved out on my wife 2. Moved into a basement apartment (where the kids slept over) 3. Decided to move to B.C (we live in Ontario) 4. Came back after 4 months, moved in with his ex girlfriend and her ex husband (who still happened be living in the house) 5. Decided to move in with his ex-girlfriend's ex-husband. 6 Moves into another basement apartment. Ex husband guy kicks him out. 7. He moves in with a girl he meets online 8. She kicks him out after 1 month. 9. He lives ih his car for 2 days, and then proceeds to go on welfare for 3 months, moves back into #6's place, but on the couch as the basement apartment he previously rented is now occupied. 8. Decides to join the army at the age of 42, goes to Borden, Meaford and Trenton for training for 9 months. 9. Comes back, moves into another woman's place (another girl he met through an online dating service) 10. They decide to move to Belleville (an hour and a half from us) And that's where we stand.

Recently, we checked out my wife's ex's new girlfriend on Facebook to see what she was like, as the ex was now referring to her as his 'common law' wife. One of her posts was to the May 1st Weed march in Toronto. She posted as 'attending'. Also, her two kids, ages 17 and 18 attended the Weed March with her. All of her 'friends' on Facebook are members of
marijuana facebook groups--and are all teenagers. (she's 40)

My question is, would you let your kids stay at their house, knowing that the 'stepmother' publicly trumpets her drug use, as well as attends drug 'marches' and events--with her 17 and 18 year old kids!!!!? The Ex has the kids every other weekend, and once during every week, but they don't stay over, because of all the upheaval in his life. Now, they are about to move again and he wants to have them overnight. I don't trust a parent who willingly promotes drug use with her kids. My step kids are 13 and 10 and I get sick thinking about how negatively influenced they will be. My wife and I are educators, and as it turns out, the new 'stepmom' for the kids was a known 'pothead' within the community. Do we just sit back and allow them to stay over night? Can we prevent this?

What are some options I should think about?

[dadtotheend]

My wife and I have been dealing with her ex-husband who has the following history (the past 5 years): 1. Moved out on my wife 2. Moved into a basement apartment (where the kids slept over) 3. Decided to move to B.C (we live in Ontario) 4. Came back after 4 months, moved in with his ex girlfriend and her ex husband (who still happened be living in the house) 5. Decided to move in with his ex-girlfriend's ex-husband. 6 Moves into another basement apartment. Ex husband guy kicks him out. 7. He moves in with a girl he meets online 8. She kicks him out after 1 month. 9. He lives ih his car for 2 days, and then proceeds to go on welfare for 3 months, moves back into #6's place, but on the couch as the basement apartment he previously rented is now occupied. 8. Decides to join the army at the age of 42, goes to Borden, Meaford and Trenton for training for 9 months. 9. Comes back, moves into another woman's place (another girl he met through an online dating service) 10. They decide to move to Belleville (an hour and a half from us) And that's where we stand.

Recently, we checked out my wife's ex's new girlfriend on Facebook to see what she was like, as the ex was now referring to her as his 'common law' wife. One of her posts was to the May 1st Weed march in Toronto. She posted as 'attending'. Also, her two kids, ages 17 and 18 attended the Weed March with her. All of her 'friends' on Facebook are members of
marijuana facebook groups--and are all teenagers. (she's 40)

My question is, would you let your kids stay at their house, knowing that the 'stepmother' publicly trumpets her drug use, as well as attends drug 'marches' and events--with her 17 and 18 year old kids!!!!? The Ex has the kids every other weekend, and once during every week, but they don't stay over, because of all the upheaval in his life. Now, they are about to move again and he wants to have them overnight. I don't trust a parent who willingly promotes drug use with her kids. My step kids are 13 and 10 and I get sick thinking about how negatively influenced they will be. My wife and I are educators, and as it turns out, the new 'stepmom' for the kids was a known 'pothead' within the community. Do we just sit back and allow them to stay over night? Can we prevent this?

What are some options I should think about?

1.Too bad so sad.
2.A basement apartment? Heavens no!
3.Who cares?
4.OK
5.Heavens to Betsy
6.Another basement apartment????
7.Online dating. Goodness NNNOOO.
8.Oh well
9.OK
10.BC, and THEN Belleville. Send him to Hell.

Why didn't you just say he's moved around a lot? Oh yeah, it's because you were loading up the question to drive the answer you wanted to hear.

Do the kids want to see him?

[standing on the sidelines]

To me the moving around doesn't matter. I know some familys that move every year it seems. To me the the only thing that really matters is the pot use. I do not hold anything against anyone that uses it for a rrecreational thing. Before you accuse me I do not, have never and never will use it myself.It just isn't for me. Just because I do not have an issue with something doesn't mean I would do it myself. I can support something and not do it myself, I support the rights of others to do it.

Your arguement should be about how much she uses it. Does it interfer wtih her day to day life? Has she ever been charged as a dealer? It should not be about her using, rather it should be about how much she does.

why would it matter that you and your wife are teachers?? Geesh my grade six teacher was an alcoholic who kept a flask in the coatroom to add a little extra to her coffee. Even at that age we could tell when she had a drink, you could smell it on her breath. Plus we found her flask and turned it into the pricipal. She was called to the office and we had a supply teacher for the next week but then the orginal teacher came back.

As for being a know pothead in the community, sure it doesn't look good on her but I also know that stories get spread around small towns etc like wildfire. Someone may have seen her take a hit off a joint and the story grows from there like the game telephone.

[Mess]

I can't tell you what to personally believe. If you believe that pot use is the work of the devil, you are pro criminialization, then shit or get off the pot, call the cops on her and have them investigated by the children's aid.

Otherwise you are just targeting the one weak spot you see in their lives (and yes it is one or you would mentioning a slew of other things) and trumpeting the fact you are a pillar in your community.

You could be a teacher, a social worker, a doctor, a hockey coach, it doesn't matter, it doesn't make you a good parent much less a perfect parent who couldn't be criticized if your life were put under a microscope. What did thta dude say one time? Oh yeah, let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

One of my old friends from high school used to smoke pot with her mum and dad as a teenager. She's an architect now. As a teacher you should be aware of how to use and teach critical thinking. Let's see some evidence of it.

[logicalvelocity]

Genxer,

Welcome to the forum.

Are you sure you're not a Private Investigator or Police?
You sure have been keeping tabs on the individual to the extent of checking out facebook etc. It's stalker like.

I think its safe to say - The dude is spontaneous and suspect if they continue the pattern -- their "latest relationship" will be out of the picture soon enough.

By the way, using pot is not illegal. Possession is unless they have their license for medical purposes. They very well may have considering they are attending rally's for legalization and would be no different than any other parent taking a prescribed medication.

Good luck keeping the kids isolated in a bubble.

[dadtotheend]

This is a good example of loading up the question and having it backfire on you. You were probably expecting a stream of OMG, how anyone possibly let those poor children see that vagrant druggie.

Instead you got four (so far) answers to the contrary. This is an inexpensive lesson for you. I wouldn't try that approach in court. So far your batting .000% here.

Again I ask you, do the kids want to see him? They are old enough to have input in the matter, and to form opinions about his lifestyle.

Try viewing this from the kids perspective rather than assassinating his character in the hope that people completely outside their lives will validate your judgement of him.

[Genxer]

Wow. I don't think I posted this message to get what I 'wanted to hear'. There is some validity to the past history of a man who is incapable of organizing his own life, and how it affects our family. There is something to be said for moral purpose, and whatever you want to say about pot use, to me, it's morally reprehensible as a parent to allow your 17 and 18 year old to smoke with you. If that does not sway your 'moral compass', then, maybe you lack in this area.
As for 'dadtotheend''s comment, I don't see anything as a 'backfiring' on me, I'm just trying to get perspective. I think kids need to see their father, but I think at some point, responsible parents sometimes have to advocate for their children and not let them be exposed to inappropriate conditions.

As far as logicalvelocity's comment about me being a private investigator by looking up someone's details on Facebook, then, you better tell that to the millions of Facebook users who do that on a daily basis. Do you honestly mean to tell me that you've never checked someone else's profile? You must be a private investigator then, hunh.

As far as my educator status, yes it does play a great deal. Officially, and according to the Ontario College of Teachers, I have to act according to moral standards that are above the community. The arguments posted here, i.e: my teacher was a drunk, so therefore, being a teacher doesn't mean anything or the 'pot is legal' therefore it's ok, or someone became an architect even though they smoked weed (it makes you creative!) are tired, false logic and morally corrupt.

You ask for me to see things through the kids eyes; empathetic understanding--that's exactly what I'm doing. When I was younger, I was put in exactly the same situation. My dad and his stepmom were into drugs and my mother sent me to their house as per our schedule. I was exposed to things I wish I never saw. I wish my mother had advocated for me. I wish there were some people who could see that putting kids into situations where they are powerless to do anything, where adults in the community weren't saying "weed's not illegal you know" so, it doesn't matter.

I guess there have to be some people in the community where there is a genuine morality. If that makes me the 'police, a private investigator' or somehow delusional, I guess the character education that I teach the children of Ontario is invalid.

But perhaps the members replying to my post, have an agenda?

[dadtotheend]

As far as my educator status, yes it does play a great deal. Officially, and according to the Ontario College of Teachers, I have to act according to moral standards that are above the community.

How pompous of you to regard your morality as superior to the community.

You STILL have not said whether the children want to see him.

[Genxer]

If you believe that drugs are morally acceptable for kids to indulge in with their parents, even when those kids are not of age, and I don't--well then, I'll take the moral high ground, regardless of what makes me pompous or not. I'd rather be pompous and have kids who value right and wrong.

Yes, the kids want to see their father, as you would expect, and no one is preventing them from doing so. My post was based on the premise of reservations about putting them in a situation that could be detrimental to them. And as I have indicated, it's not always what the kids want that is always what is best for them, or else they would be eating junk food, watching t.v, playing video games, and staying out as long as they pleased. They don't do these things because parents have an obligation (yes, morally) to bring up children in a manner that best benefits them. Parenting is not a democracy, and sometimes the 'adult' needs to see what's best.

In regards to 'moral superiority', look up the OCT website. Educators are held to a higher standard (legally) because of our profession. It's there for you to see, should you seek out the information.

So you tell me, 'dadtotheend', what is your advice, or is do you always post sarcastic, facetious comments based upon personal hang ups and vitriol?

Comments don't help, and the fact that you accuse me of writing a post just to 'hear what I want to hear' sounds like you're on a mission to play 'gotcha!' and judge peoples' lives based on subjective commentary. Remember, my post was never a character assasination of my wife's ex, it was all objective fact--background if you will--to assist people in showing the background of the situation. You jumped in with your sarcastic comments (i.e BC THEN Belleville he should go to HELL)

Your post IS an attempt at undermining my character, hence the my replies. If you have nothing good to say, don't say it, and perhaps, if you'd like to help, you may want to consider objectivity. Or do you have an ax to grind? Did a woman do YOU wrong?

[bayleaf]

GenXer, you did get blasted from one side of the argument. I agree that there is another side and I don't think you are wrong to ask questions about the home that the kids' dad wants them to stay at overnight. In my view, that's just being a good parent.

On the other hand, the kids are 10 and 13 -- they are not infants. They see their dad regularly and probably know him a lot better than do you. I agree with dadtotheend -- you need to hear what they think about the overnight plan. Do they have concerns or questions? Their opinion may not be definitive, but it sure is important and can tell you a lot about what the situation is in the other home.

Fundamentally, I agree with the point that other people have made -- the kids' relationship with their dad is extremely important to them and you need to respect that and in fact help the kids protect and enhance that relationship. Lots of people smoke pot and lots of people move around a lot. I wouldn't think either of those things are anywhere near enough to prevent overnight visits.

[Genxer]

Thanks, Bayleaf, I appreciate your objective and fair comments!
I don't think we'd ever prevent the kids from seeing their father as we know how important it is to have that relationship. I actually have raised the kids from when they were little, so I indeed know them better than their father (who has left them on multiple occasions) Their mom and I co-parent equally, and we support the kids financially together.

I just can't help thinking that if it's ok for the new 'stepmom' to smoke weed with her kids and attend 'weed marches' with her kids (and this has been going on since her kids were 15, 16) then, what happens with my 13 year old daughter? Igrapple s it going to be ok if she smokes weed with her stepmom? I mean if it was ok for her kids, then why not ours?
That's the question I with. I don't trust my wife's ex's judgement in picking great role models, but that's not something I can change. If history is any indication, he'll be kicked out within the next couple of months (as per his pattern--that's why the history of my first post is essential to understanding the situation) and this issue will be moot.

They won't have their own bedrooms and most likely will be sleeping on the floor/couch, which isn't cool, but what can you do?

[logicalvelocity]

LOL,

I don't do Facebook. Your allegation is dismissed.

So what made you check out the individuals Facebook profile and their contacts friends etc? How many times have you visited their page? Are you listed on their contacts?

Were you looking to dig up something on the individual to make them look bad or just being curious?

[standing on the sidelines]

Thanks, Bayleaf, I appreciate your objective and fair comments!

That's the question I with. I don't trust my wife's ex's judgement in picking great role models, but that's not something I can change. If history is any indication, he'll be kicked out within the next couple of months (as per his pattern--that's why the history of my first post is essential to understanding the situation) and this issue will be moot.

so someone who agrees with you is objective and fair, the ones who do not are basically immoral people? LOL

If you think the who situation will be moot in a few months they why post at all??

[dadtotheend]

My comment about what the kids want is because they are 10 and 13. The 13 year is on the edge of doing what he/she wants regardless of what you say. The 10 year isn't far behind, could likely follow the 13 year old's preferences and is old enough for his/her desires to be not just heard, but given some weight.

I don't believe that it's acceptable for kids to do drugs with their parents. Way to load up the issue again for the purpose of trumpeting your moral high ground.

I don't care one way or the other what moral high ground the thousands of teachers in this province are held to, or lawyers or engineers or whoever the hell else. I care about what the individual does/says. Your self-declaration of moral superiority is a flag. People who are morally superior don't need to remind others of that. Your membership in a group doesn't confer moral superiority on you. Your actions/words do. So please can the OCT references.

What I think is that you have to strike a balance between the children's need to see their parent and the risks associated with it. You are just going on and on and on about the father's character and make little mention of what the kids want. That makes me think you are not really asking what others think. Rather you are making your case and then asking for agreement on a conclusion that you have already reached.

The consensus so far is that your concerns are not enough to prevent the kids from seeing their father. Do you agree?

What would you have them do if it was solely up to you? Not see him at all? Supervised access? Day trips but not nights?

[dadtotheend]

so someone who agrees with you is objective and fair, the ones who do not are basically immoral people?

Exactly. This guy isn't changing his mind on the issue. Like I said at the outset, he's only looking to hear what he wants to hear. He says he wants people's input, but he's really looking for endorsement of his position.

Good luck to him in the teenage years.